selkirk

It's a 5.9 crack, but the face moves at the top are 10a. And I've done that too.

That pretty well bites. I thought my morning was rough as I could have sworn it was friday until 30 minutes ago. Had some fuckers break in and steal my pos radio about of month ago. Broke the rear window during the torrential downpour so it sat outside getting wet all night :mad: Fuckers. I hope their lifetime of bad karma and jailtime was worth the $50 they might be able to get for the radio.

I had one that sat in my closet for a good long while before I gave it away. There are some routes down there athat justify it IMHO. BBQ the Pope is probably the classic. It's solid 10b climbing for the whole thing, from the move off the ground to the top. But for a 10b climber, that first bolt is way the hell of the ground and well within broken ankle/leg land if you fall getting there. But then again i'm awfully risk averse.

Your officially out of the club Dru. Luke rode Ton-Ton's.

Why in the hell would anyone ski at Silver? Of course when it was still Jackass and the tickets were $15 it was pretty cool! Schweitzer is vastly superior though!! Better snow, better vertical better runs

So has anyone been out to the I-900 crag yet? Is there still dirt to stick for the top out to the left hand lead route? Cheers

From NOAA Today: Cloudy. Light wind. High 29. Tonight: Cloudy. Light wind. Low 28. Wednesday: Mostly cloudy. Light wind. High 30. Wednesday Night: Mostly cloudy. East wind 5 mph. Low 28. Thursday: Mostly cloudy. East wind 5 mph. High 30. Thursday Night: Cloudy. Low 28. Friday: Mostly cloudy. Slight chance of mixed rain and snow showers. Probability of measurable precipitation 20 percent. High 29. Friday Night: Mostly cloudy. Slight chance of mixed rain and snow then slight chance of snow. Probability of measurable precipitation 20 percent. Low 27. Saturday: Mostly cloudy. Chance of snow. Probability of measurable precipitation 30 percent. High 32. Saturday Night: Mostly cloudy. Chance of snow. Probability of measurable precipitation 40 percent. Low 26. Sunday: Mostly cloudy. Chance of snow. Probability of measurable precipitation 40 percent. High 32. Sunday Night: Mostly cloudy. Chance of snow. Probability of measurable precipitation 40 percent. Low 28. As It's north facing it might still be in

If your ever in Hailey Id. (en route to Stanley, and named for my great great great grandfather too boot so you know the town is cool ) go find Java and get a Bowl of Soul damn tasty stuff. They've got branches in Boise and Coeur D' Alene as well.

Going to a good coffee shop is like going to a good bar. Friendly setting, nice people behind the bar, good music, and they serve your favorite high quality drug of choice.

ooh, lots of these! (all in Seattle though) Zoka in Greenlake - Great atmosphere, good stiff coffee, and free wifi for telecommuting Cafe Allegro and Solstice in the U-district : Both have great vibes and good coffee. Becoming a fan of All City Coffee down in Georgetown as well

I didn't even know it was possible to get stuck on flat ground, but it appears I was mistaken.

Anyone get up to Chair peak recently, or anything else in the Snoqualmie area for that matter? Anything at all forming up yet?

Is this only running Thurs-Sat? or will the prices stay down until the sale items are gone like they have in the past?

Forgive me NOLSE..... I just can't help myself this morning but.... There was this neutrino on an obscure climb in the alpine lakes area....

Finally and honest women!

No it didn't!

Calamity Jam down at Smith, 5.10c my ass. If you don't realize how best to use the big pocket up high, or get at all out of sequence your hosed. Or maybe Blasphemy also down at Smith. Not particulary hard for the grade. But on your first attempt it's hard to convince yourself to commit to palms and stems low enough and if you don't your in trouble.

I love my Genie! I hate that they don't make it anymore

Is this still going on?

Gear... Basically, if you have tools bring them, if you have crampons bring those too Maybe bring 1 kit to help set up the top ropes, and if you have an old rope bring that to. It will likely get covered in mud so nothing too new and shiny. Oh and be sure to take your leashes off! Beyond that... helmet, gloves, and clothing appropriate for the weather, hot tea can be nice too. Oh, and definitely bring the headlamp. Your tools will get dull, your crampons will get dull so no need to sharpen them. There are at least 3 set of anchors, and likely one or two new ones all of which can be set up from above as top ropes. If your feeling spry, two of the lines are very well bolted for leading (thanks Alex!). Oh, and when you fall leading, your crampons will shoot sparks The left hand one is pretty straight forward, except for the exit move which involves manteling on tools, and desperate sticks into the grass clump Alex thought it was probably M4. Right hand route has a thin dihedral in the middle but an easier topout. Likely M5? Alex, did anyone ever get the redpoint on the right hand route? Both cruxes have bolts you can clip from below the crux which is much appreciated! also, as it's Issaquah in the winter, plan on getting your rope muddy as hell regardless of what you do. Had lots and lots of fun last winter! Met some cool folks, got to play with a variety of tools. So long as it's not pouring it's pretty cool, and likely dry tooling is the only local real rock to be had til spring. We usually climbed for a couple of hours and everyone did a lap or two on the routes and then headed home. Parking is limited (2, maybe 3 cars if you squeeze) so carpooling is a good idea, though I think the Issaquah P&R is still closed? I can't make it the next two weeks, but will hopefully make it out after Thanksgiving. Have fun and stay dry!

I was also told last summer that camping the rocks near the heather is also frowned upon.

From my own, rather limited anecdotal experience, the folks I know and have instructed usually have a pretty good grasp of why things are done the way they are and can answer most basic questions. More in depth questions are often referred to the the area leaders (typically climb leaders or other folks with at least 3 or 4 years of climbing under the belt). The people going on to take the intermediate class are usually the more aware, more interested, and focused climbers in the basic class, not the students who were in over their heads and struggling to keep up with the technical aspects. Usually during the spring field trips you don't actually get many of those questions. The students are too busy trying to just absorb the basic techniques. Unluckily, the answer is sometimes, this is the way were teaching it because it's what's been decided. Most instructors are pretty good about discussing alternatives. Those questions tend to pop up more out on the climbs, and again purely anecdotaly, most of the intermediates I know are pretty sharp people, and if they don't know the answer refer the question to the leader. I think like any other group, there will be some people who probably shouldn't be teaching, but for the most part, I think the instructors do a pretty good job.

I can certainly agree with that. But I think that the level of experience needed to demonstrate a basic skill, and then ensure that someone is doing it safely is much, much less than the experienced to decide what to teach. I get the impression that some people think that there is a pack of unsupervised people with 1 years worth of experience who are entirely responsible for teaching basic students climbing skills, which isn't even close to correct. The net responsibility of a 1st year intermediate in a teaching situation is to demonstrate a skill they already know, and then watch to make sure the basics are doing things safely. (tied in, harness on correctly, belay device threaded and locked, yada, yada, yada). More experienced climbers have decided what to teach, how to teach it, and which experienced climber is going to be in charge of each teaching area. I think in my opinion a year's worth of climbing experience is likely enough to demonstrate a basic skill, and then supervise someone while they practic it. The higher standards that had been suggested are a great starting point, but I think it's likely overkill as even these instructors have a set of more experienced climbers intermixed and overseeing what they're teaching. Now having a few people who design and run the field trips, go through some more advanced training I think could be very useful. So what would your opinion be, on the minimum amount of experience appropriate to demonstrate a belay or rappel, and then supervise while someone else practices, all in a controlled environment?

Granted. The mounties don't teach a great deal of technique. Pretty much none in the basic course, and very little in the intermediate course. That's not what they were designed to do, and it's not something you could do with a large group. The mountie instructors get "wrapped up" in the gear and details during the basic and intermediate courses because those are the fundamentals and minimum skill sets needed. If you can't use the gear safely (i.e. tie in, belay, rappel, etc) you shouldn't be climbing anything. Even if you can't climb 5.10, you can still climb 5.4 though. Not to mention most folks I know in the mounties aren't interested in climbing hard rock. Their interested in getting out in the wilderness on moderate terrain with good company. Ever read the book Feeding the Rat? Mo Antoine put it well, the best part about climbing is "a good day out with your mates". The rest is just gravy. The other qualifier, is that for those who are interested in "manning-up", they offer seminars in aid, water-ice, friction climbing, crack climbing, (and new last year) advanced crack climbing, and sport climbing. Granted, none of those will get you to lead WI-6, or 5.11+ yada, yada, yada. These are much smaller groups though (5 to 10 people usually) and last anywhere between a weekend and a season. They don't even teach a great deal, but they do offer an opportunity to meet people who are share interests in learning how to climb harder. You might also look at some of my earlier statements. I know some pretty damn strong climbers who teach and lead climbs for the mountaineers. To think of any of the climbing courses as comprehensive is incorrect. They only provide a safe minimum set of skills to get you outside and climbing, and for you to build on as you see fit.

Thanks for the response Mtnfreak. That's kind of what I expected. My big point was that the critical part, determining what to teach, isn't carried out by inexperienced climbers, but by very experienced climbers. All of the curriculum, content, and progression skills are managed by the climbing committee. The first year intermediates are really just supervising practice to have another set of slightly more experienced eyes on safety. As for the guides skill in determining a clients, needs, wants, and abilities. To some degree that's taken care of by the course structure. Everyone who comes through the basic class receives the same training, and is tested on knowing the same skills so there is a dependable minimum skill set. It may be higher but it isn't lower. The climbs themselves aren't so much about teaching basic climbers a new skill set, as giving them the opportunity to put into practice their skills, so they can start to develop some confidence and efficiency, in a relatively safe setting. This also goes for the intermediates. They're just practicing a different skill set (route finding, leading etc.) The "teaching time is over", now it's practice time in the reasonably controlled setting offered by trade routes. That's not to say people aren't learning on climbs, but they're not teaching oriented. It's where you start to learn the finer points.