billcoe

BTW Kev, best idea yet: if you feel strongly about the Gandolf's bolts, then you probably should get up there soon and fix it the way you want to see it get done. Otherwise, it's gonna be what it's gonna be, and someone might pull them as they put in the new.

No. You sound like you are trying to pick a fight. Maybe I'm misreading your words. _______________________________________________________ Not me. About a week ago Joseph and I tried a new route/pitch (which he later got), there was a very rusty 3/8" wedge anchor which I had hand drilled on lead well over 20 years ago on an early reconnoiter which I had forgotten about. Looking at it, it's an OK stance ond location, not the best. I was wondering if the foothold I'd been standing on had snapped off. -But- That bolt is significantly older than 10 years old. That bolt is very rusty (stainless hanger though). That bolt is shit. That bolt is not historic. Just because I am too lazy to replace it doesn't mean that I won't A) Clip it. B) Not thank the person who replaces it. Now realize that while I'm belaying JH on this route, I'm a pitch off the deck on an existing route clipped to 2 of his new replacement bolts which are located 8" below what is now my cut off uncammoflaged studs of 2 stainless bolts I had installed and which should have been perfect before they got sawed off. Sawed most likly by JH when he put in the new stuff. But why give him any grief over it or even bring it up? He worked his ass off out there. He probably had a reason. I know that the rangers wanted the chains Dave had put on my bolts out there like 8 years ago gone. Maybe the threads were galled? -again- Why give him any grief over it? He worked his ass off out there. I think there was plenty of opprotunity FOR ANY AND FOR ALL OF US to get involved early on and mention that "this bolt or that bolt" was historic. To me, the origonal 1/4 bolts at the end of P2 which were up on the slab (not on the ledge like the current location) which were put in by the FAers on the SE corner should have been left. They were truely historic. I have not given Jim any grief about it because they are way off what is the current route, and n00bs would have got lost, wandered up that way, and gotten screwed. But they were put in by some bold dudes on the first technical climbing route at Beacon, and no one even knows that the route path was changed now. Maybe even you don't know this. I'll bet you dollars to donuts if Steve read this thread with anybodies suggestion that Danny and his old 1/4" bolts on Gandolf's were "historic" he'd be laughing his ass off.

Kevin: tThe correct way to replace 1/4 split shanks is to yank them out with a modified Lost Arrow and use the hole for the next 3/8 bolt after you drill it out. Usually the position of the old bolt is perfect, why just leave rusting trash in the rock unless it's historic. (Like JH left Dean Caldwell and Kim Schmitzs bolts alone at Beacon and just drilled new. )

Serenity: to follow up on what JH is saying. If these Bush administration mistakes were in the rearview mirror, it would be a different discussion. The administration puts together a crack team of true diplomatic professionals (the Baker group led by James Baker) and ask them to devise a plan and an exit strategy that would end this with us on top. They interview all the key players on down to and including people like yourself and the Iraqi counterparts. They come up with a multi-level plan the size of a phonebook to most effectively archive a positive goal and outcome. The Baker plan is debated by various experts in the open to examine potential flaws in the minutia. The state dept supports the findings. Result: ignored. Here we are. The admin is finally starting to look at and try one or 2 of the suggested things after what they have tried instead fail. People like you should not have to pay the price for their stupidity and incompetence, let alone having our country bleed dry over it financially. I mean WTF? I believe that our country could use more like you, and truly wish you well. I'm only sorry to see that the shit these dumb assholes continues to try runs down onto you and folks like you. As competent as you may be, I see it a needless political posturing that only costs us money and lives. I'm off the hook and don't have to pony up on this one, but I have a 17 year old son who may be in the middle of this soon....and it only increases my anger to see this kind of political bungling endlessly occurring. Regards Bill

link

The gov't must be F*ing with you again. You know thats exactly what the CIA does. They fuck with people and later after innocent people had done bad things to each other pushed by the silent hand....well, the dudes would sit back at a bar-b-que and laugh about it over a cocktail. Guess you just have to live with it. HA HA HA ! Glad it's you and not me!

BTW, don't think I'm just slaggin ya, I read one of your books and it was off the hook. How you went from that amazing work of scholarship to this I cannot fathom for they are at the far opposite ends of the intellectual scale. Maybe it's Kevbone doing it to you? Dawg, snap out of it, snap out of it! Bill's review here link Hey Dawg, please don't be offended as I must ask: did you just log onto CC.com and walk away from your computer and leave some 5th grader on it? Help me I'm looking for a reason here? Help! BTW, I loaned (or gave it- not totally sure) your book to Jimmy O. He's a bible fanatic, I'll report back with the results.

Damn Raindawg, how old are you anyway? Grade school was a long time ago for everyone else on this thread.

Sounds like quite a guy. I'm sorry the fellas gone and that I never had the pleasure to have made his acquaintance. We're all heading that direction. All of us. Nothing we can do about that, but it warms my heart though to know that he made such a positive impact on so many while he was on the earth. The world could use more like him.

Thanks for the heads up. But the steel and most Mfg products from China is as good as anything in the US. They have hit that sweet area of price-performance level. You go look at a high end TV, VCR, or toaster...damn ear anything, and even the Japanese branded products (except maybe most Sonys), are all made in China. And it's good stuff too. I'd trust any BD cam made in China much more than any CCH Alien made in the US. (I still climb on my Aliens too).

No way, you can't say shit or fuck over there! As in, "we knocked that fucker over it's too late to give a shit now.... " Hell, the life you saved may have even been mine!

Wayne, that was the best post of the day. Don't be sorry! BTW, with the freeze thaw cycle around the east county area, that thing would have loosened over time..... You might have saved a life. Or several. Who can judge such things?

Nice bit of history Wayne. Damn that must have been loud! And Scary too. I only know (vs like rumors I'd heard on the block-B-Gone thing that involved Wayne and Bob M. ) 2 interesting facts about Gandolfs. When I first met Wayne1112, it was at on the other side of that cliff, he just walked up to us looking for a partner. Turned out, after some questioning back and forth to each other, I think Wayne said he was 14 years old then... and had already soloed the North Face at that point. So we climbed, no one else was around, this was in the days before there were lots of climbers. It's strange in that I vividly remember Wayne, but not the other person I was climbing with that day. Certainly was damn strong even then. The other thing I thought was interesting is that for @ 30 years - a sole knifeblade driven straight up into the roof protected the crux at Golums hang. One day Steve Stauch and I were out climbing somewhere and he laughing confessed to me that he was both shocked and surprised that it was still there. They'd immediately thought it was a particularly poor placement when Steve drove it up into the roof on the FA: and they expected that the next party or 2 would have been smart enough to just replace the pin with a bolt so as not to put their lives at risk. But everyone just clipped it and went. Thing had to have seen, and held, a lot of falls. Does anyone know did the knifeblade meet it's demise anyway? Did it finally fail on a fall or did someone make a proactive move? Geoff, I don't remember these bolts specifically, but they sound like the Rawl Drive mushroom head splitshank construction bolts. Rawl is now Powers, they still sell the things. Link to Powers Fasteners Typically the 1/4"ers were @ 1-1/2 inches deep, and brand new, in ideal conditions, could hold almost 2000 lbs. The folks at the Rawl company, when they found out what we used them for, were horrified. Not long after climbers wised up and changed over to 3/8 wedge anchors. You still see them places, especially in like Yosemite. Somethings they are threaded and look like a wedge anchor, but those appear to not be made anymore. They had the benefit of being fast, relativly strong and cheap. Hand drilling a 1/4" hole 1-1/2 deep while balanced on a tiny stance 30' out on lead while your calves are burning and you're about to grease off is SIGNIFICANTLY easier than a 3/8 x 3" hole.

Yeah, I like that the guy won't personally attack but will offer an intellegent, reasoned response. I suppose there will be some reason to get pissed off later, this being the internet, but until then it seems good......sigh....

Avitrip and Benny climbed it in a day few months back. (West face)

I call bullshit. Lets see a real link. I think most wedding guests in the 80's were too stoned to know where they were, let alone if a marriage would last.

I gotta quote for prosperity, be sure to catch the last line: 6 Dirt bikes package deal worth 15k make offer Reply to: sale-444881272@craigslist.org Date: 2007-10-09, 10:23PM PDT these were my ex-husbands bikes. i got them in the divorce settlement. these all have clean titles. i am not sure of all the details, but here is a list of what i know. 1996 kx 80 2002 kx 100 2004 drz 400 2002 ktm 400 2003 crf 450 (not in picture) 2005 ktm 450 i know they all run and are in great shape. my cousin did all the work on them. he is a mechanic at a ktm store. i will only sell them as a package. bikes are located at familys house in smokey point. i have no clue as to what they are worth. i will be taking offers until thursday night. the highest offer gets them. i need enough money to get a breast enhancement. oh and jerry, i bet your gonna miss these bikes of yours...but i guess you should have thought of that before you f**ked my 16 year old sister!"

Concur: it really sounds like sour grapes to me. Just cause you can't do it in 5 days Raindawg isn't a reason to shit on someone else trying and then achieving a fast time. Although it isn't the reason I climb, I like to get good times up long routes myself, for me though - and know that I couldn't touch that time with a 20 foot pole and a helicopter, which makes it all the more amazing to me.

A solid comeback. Thank you! I'll be here all week folks.

The Canadians and Mexicans? This is the kind of propoganda that keeps the military monkey on our backs alive and well. This country has a large military for power projection, not defense. If it had no military at all, and therefore no Middle Eastern military presence, it would not have been attacked on 911, nor would it have been targeted by a nuclear arsenal for 40 years. If, for the sake of a thought experiment, we switched to self sufficient, isolationist policies, we wouldn't need much of a defense establishment at all. I give you Canada; not really threatened by anyone; very similar way of life. There is not, nor has there ever been, another nation or entity that has seriously threatened our 'way of life'. That, my countrymen, is a fucking myth. Even the dreaded Adolph Hitler threatened only Europe and its neighbors. That is because our strength IS our way of life, not the military that supposedly protects it. It is intrinsic to who we are. We choose it. And we have chosen to give it up, through the squandering of our hard won civil liberties and wealth, to become slaves to precisely the kind of paranoia that Billcoe loves to expound upon on this forum. It is the militarized, police state we've created ourselves that threatens and weakens us, not drugs, or terrorists, or whatever other threat of the week (or weak) happens to be on the sound bite agenda. You're wrong. Easy to talk that kind of shit when you are well protected eh?

Hey, you're ticking this stuff off aren't ya?

I'm certainly not "in it" for you fuckheads who have attacked this country, it's principles, it's leaders and policies for the last 6 years. I'm in it for myself? Look in the fucking mirror. Whenever the R's are running the show you undermine them at every step of the way, like petulant children who don't get their way. We have elections to determine who's in charge, and sometimes you lose - is it that hard to fucking understand and accept? And I'm sorry, but the bickering, the animosity, the hatred from your side - has completely revolted me to the core. It's way more than just disagreement about policy. It's personal, nasty and disgusting. It HAS had an effect. Congratulations, you've helped divide Americans against Americans. Don't expect me to defend you and your ilk when you've attacked your political opponents for so long with such vitriol and hatred. I think I will look out for myself. And BTW, it's KK, not KKK, as I've repeated dozens of times. I know you wish I were a fellow member and attended your lynchings and hooded ceremonies, but sorry I don't hate blacks and jews like you bill coe. And when have you stopped beating your wife? Hey. maybe you're thinking of another billcoe? PS, my wife would kick my ass if I even thought about beating her so lets not go there eh?

Well since you don't know basic jackshit about me, let me assure you that I will not be looking out solely for myself. I'm the crazy f* who bought gas masks for all the children in the neighborhood for instance, in case it is needed, 10 of them, in my basement. I don't give a rats ass what your views political are KK: a strong defense is the cornerstone for everything else this country is about. Without it you have nothing. It keeps popping up at various places and threads and is now underlying this very debate on this very thread . If our country is to survive into the future for our children and their children: if many others adopt your attitude and the "me first fuck you attitude" prevails, our country and the principles we stand for will collapse like a house of cards in the wind as the Gauls and Mongol hordes sweep in from the hinterlands and rule us. Don't take this for granted. Think on it. Peace out Bill

Whew, nice call on the international credibility thing someliquitidy. 100% called that right on the money. I also appreciate your restraint in not pulling forth the petroleum card and waving it in our faces concerning our initial Afghanistan attack. Turned out that pre-attack Chevron had proposed a huge pipeline through Afghanistan from one of the other Ass-istans. The reserves available are huge. Part of the story from 2001 link The Taliban rejected this great idea. They blocked our access to this oil. It should come as no small surprise that Condi Rice was on the board of directors of Chevron before Bush tapped her, and she had in fact filled Reagans Secretary of State Geo. Schultz's spot on the Chevron board. She has helped construct a way for that project to take root, and we have benefited and can continue to drive gas hogs thanks to our military putting their asses on the line. Course you pretty much know all of that whole invasion story and the supreme asswipe Bin Laden's role as well. This is the side story, not widely known in the US, but true nontheless. Maybe it's not the side story....hmmm. Anywho- Pipeline was approved by the Karsai govenment early on and is full steam ahead. Don't necessarily think I'm complaining here by bringimg this out and talking about it. It will make our country stronger and I support that. Yet geo-politically, other countries see all of this and suspect our pure motives.....which on the other hand weakens us in several ways. Thought that the last line of the story I linked, which parrots noliquiditys earlier post NAILS IT ON THE HEAD, the last line reads " True security, for all of us, can only be achieved by reducing our dependence on oil." Edited: noliquiity, nevermind my saying you avoided the petroleum card as I was just re-reading this thread and saw you had eluded to this very thing in general terms couple pages back. Wow. You and I should meet and tie in sometime. BTW: to all, good conversation here, thank you all for the various well presented viewpoints.

I had that happen in Nepal few years back. Puked and shat for 3 days until I was empty, then was unable to eat anything for 7 days, all while hiking up every day above 12,000-17,000 feet. Anyway, Sherpas tell me that Dogs are evil people who have been reincarnated, which is why they are ignored and offered no assistance or kindnesses while they wander the streets, eating off the various garbage piles.