Buckaroo Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I use camp tri cams all the time for aid and free, in Many cases they are easily C1, where other gear would be way more sketchy. They are super great for horizontal aid placements in shallow cracks where a regular cam would be bent to hell going over the edge of the crack when weighted. But from all your responses to this thread, your opinions are best. Having climbed liberty crack, I would say definitely you want some off-set nuts. I was agreeing with you on your previous post. And I'm putting tri-cams in the beaks hooks category because to properly place them they are tricky. And I'm talking specifically only about Liberty Crack because it was mentioned by the OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billcoe Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Well shit Buckaroo, I think you just sold me on slide aiders. However, I've never seen them used. Yates ya say are better than the Metolius? As far as the OP goes, Ivan and Shapp have good advice on the West Face route for Smith things, I'd try the North Face of Monkey before the East Face, it's more reasonable. Another route not mentioned that we use to do anytime it was raining: The Great Roof. It's up on the ridge and I have not seen it since Beth Rodden freed it, but I saw in the photos that someone had put in some new bolts, so it might actually be too easy if you clip the bolts, but it would be good training and bet it's "safer" than it use to be. I suspect that no one will be on it as it's 14B and a long hike and you can have it to yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckaroo Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I don't know Bill, I could be wrong, it's just my personal experience. Just think sliders are worth a try. I've only tried the Metolius, don't know the Yates, someone else mentioned them. It was also mentioned the pros say they don't work very well on a traverse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 I wouldn't say the great roof's easy for a beginner - the new bolts are great, but the natural gear is so shitty and insecure I mostly just cheater-sticked the whole 1st pitch cool top out though abraxas is an awesome smith aid climb, especially the stellar handcrack way up high Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedellympian Posted June 10, 2015 Author Share Posted June 10, 2015 Ivan, what's Abraxas rated as an aid climb? Does it go clean? I've looked at it numerous times and always wanted to go climb Tombstone Crack at the top but the 5.12 choss lower on the route is a little over my head right now. (Yes, I know you can rap in and climb out but it seems like a lot of shenanigans for 1.5 pitches of climbing! Would be way cooler to go ground up IMHO.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I've done it as a pure clean climb (C1) - 1st pitch is a free climb, 2nd n' 3rd pitch was some gear and some cheat-sticking I recall. I did manage a nice fall when my original cheat-stick cross-loaded the biner n' broke it w/ my body-weight a rare tr for me, it appears I actually put some useful beta in it for abraxas: http://cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1040853 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapitalNathan Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 So I'm in the same boat as Bedellympian but up in Leavenworth at the moment. Anyone got some suggestions for good routes to aid solo to work out all my rookie mistakes on? I realize that the obvious answer is to go to Index but I'm looking for some afterword locations in the Tumwater or Icicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 any route w/ a continuous crack (n' no crowds to be pissed at you) is good, the steeper the better reckon the regular route on colchuck balanced would be a servicable back-country option, if'n you felt real ready for it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montypiton Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 tons of stuff around Leavenworth - any straight crack on a day when no one's on it doing it free: Classic Crack (fat chance finding it empty, but it could happen), Z-crack, Angel, Canary (first pitch), Air Roof, Deb's Crack, Bo Derek, Mr. Clean, Catapult, Damnation if you have wide enough gear, etc, etc. pick a crack, any crack in fact, I routinely start people trad leading by having them do easy cracks (like 5.6 or so) on aid so that they have to load every placement, and make LOTS of placements to get anywhere. a pitch or two, and they're comfortable enough with placing gear to start leading easy free routes. -Haireball Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanS Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Hey Capital Nathan A couple good climbs to check on aid. Piton Tower @ Rattlesnake Rock has a steep thin crack. I think this is a 10A route, it faces the main wall. Or on Icicle Buttress there is a wall at the base with a couple steep cracks. These arent in the guide but are only about 100' from the road. Also do what Ivan and Haireball recommend, twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapitalNathan Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Awesome, I'll go give some of those a try. Thanks for the help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedellympian Posted June 22, 2015 Author Share Posted June 22, 2015 I'll be in the Leavenworth area and want to pop over the hill to Index too. If anyone wants to team up or mentor me on a little aid let me know. -Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnGo Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 (edited) Well, to answer the original question, what's the best way to learn to aid climb, I will offer a slightly different tack. I say go spend a day or two with a guide. This could be a professional guy through a guiding company, or some local hotshot aider who you hook up with and work out a money or barter system that everyone's happy with. The traditional way of learning how to big wall climb was to go to Yosemite and apprentice yourself for a summer. Many people do not have the time or inclination to do that anymore. By paying for a guide, you can get a download of decades of experience dumped on you in just a few hours. Yes, it may cost you a few hundred dollars, but how much time would it take you to learn the same skills if you were to try to learn it through general trial and error? What is your time truly worth? I did my first big wall climbing with a guide, and it was a great experience and set me up for several more successes on my own after that. Also, the link to the Chris McNamara Supertopo how to aid climb series on YouTube is outstanding. Watch all those videos, absorb them, Buy a pair of Yates aid ladders and a pair of Yates adjustable daisies, and a FiFi hook, set up the top rope and solo on your own, and then get a guide for a day or two. You will be well on your way. Edited July 24, 2015 by JohnGo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedellympian Posted October 8, 2015 Author Share Posted October 8, 2015 I just wanted to revisit this thread and thank you fellas for the suggestions. I aid solo'd the west face of the monkey yesterday and it was wild. Someone said it would feel like a grade V and it kinda did, well at least a grade IV. Took me 9 hrs car-car and that was with linking the bolt ladder as a single pitch. Jugging the dynamic rope was ridiculous and motion sickness inducing. I'm pretty sure aid climbers are supposed to bring a hook for the move off the belay anchor for the final section of bolts to the cave, for me it involved etrier to blank slab stemming to gain unprotected slab moves to a short finger crack from which I was able to clip the next bolt in the "continuous bolt ladder" definitely took some time to figure that one out. Does anyone have some suggestions for aiding overhangs? I found the steeper parts to be very strenuous and taxing and found it really hard to reach the next bolt at times, I'm 5'10" with a normal ape index so I'm guessing this should not be a problem if I do it properly. On the really steep stuff I would clip both aiders to the same bolt and push one out behind me to allow a precarious stemming stance, then I would stand up and hang a draw from the next piece so I could clip an aider to it while sitting in my harness fifi'd to the last piece. It seems like there is probably some technique for standing up on just one aider without having your feet fly out form under you but I couldn't get it to work on the really overhung parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-spotter Posted October 8, 2015 Share Posted October 8, 2015 get an adjustable fifi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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