Stealing fixed gear in the Alpine

[Mattski]

I fixed a rope on Sharkfin Col on 8/6, hoping to avoid a 2am struggle and 4 foot moat on 8/7, but someone decided that it belonged to them and took the rope without checking with half a dozen parties around, the picket it was attached to and the additonal piece in the anchor. The Party responsible was seen climbing Sharkfin Tower and probably grabbed the gear on the way down. I was planning on taking that gear with me, so I am writing this message to A)give this individual a chance to rectify his or her alpine Karma and contact me and return the gear(The equipment belongs to American Alpine Institute and the rope is more than one season old) and B)just say that as alpine etiquette goes, stealing fixed gear with other parties in the area, reduces places like Boston Basin to another cragging ghetto, with car break-ins and bad behavior. This has been one of the sorriest days I have spent in the mountains and I hope those responsible do not end up statistics in Accidents in North American Mountaineering, Sincerely Matt

[This message has been edited by Mattski (edited 09-01-2001).]

[goatboy]

Hey Matt,

I'm sorry to hear about the theft of your gear. I doubt you'll get it back, but hope that you do.

A question: Since you fixed the rope on 8/6 and posted your message on the 31'st . . . was your rope fixed all that time? If so, perhaps that contributed to whatever poor choice the thief made -- not that this excuses them, but I'm just curious about the details.

If your rope was fixed for all those weeks, who knows how someone interpreted that.

Steve

 

[DPS]

Maybe the rangers removed it considering it a fixed anchor? Perhaps someone thought it abandoned? Maybe affixing a note would insure it stays put?

[Rafael_H]

Well, I saw a cam on the Tooth and even went back to retrieve it.

The cam was left on the South Face at least 1.5 months ago.

It does need some work, cleaning and lubrication, possibly replacing the sling. If You still want it back, describe the piece and the exact place.

[Cpt.Caveman]

quote:

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Originally posted by danielpatricksmith:

Maybe the rangers removed it considering it a fixed anchor? Perhaps someone thought it abandoned? Maybe affixing a note would insure it stays put?

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Dan are you serious about the note deal?! C'mon!

Matt, it sounds like you left it just for a few hours ? IS this true give more details...

 

[Stefan]

Let's say I came across a rope hanging there with a picket. I see no one around--and nothing to indicate the person will return. Here is what I assume: The lameass who left it does not know how to rappel and left it behind for the retreat off of the mountain. Therefore I will take it. No I did not take it, but if I came across this situation, you damn well better know I will take it.

[jblakley]

quote:

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Originally posted by Stefan:

Let's say I came across a rope hanging there with a picket. I see no one around--and nothing to indicate the person will return. Here is what I assume: The lameass who left it does not know how to rappel and left it behind for the retreat off of the mountain. Therefore I will take it. No I did not take it, but if I came across this situation, you damn well better know I will take it.

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Just be ready for the Karmic bitch-slap sure to find it's way upside yo head.

 

[DPS]

Cave-man,

What I was suggesting is that perhaps the person who took it assumed it was left as a rappel anchor and abandoned. In this case a note describing the date it was left and when it will be retrieved would avoid any confusion. This system works in Alaska for caches. Of course, if the person responsible is set on getting booty, then a note would do no good.

I actually found two new ropes on Snow Creek wall with a note explaining they were abandoned during a hasty retreat in a storm and if they could be returned it would be appreciated.

Dan

[Cpt.Caveman]

Interesting but most people dont carry the equipment to make notes in the mountains that I climb with. Not part of my 2 essentials

[This message has been edited by Cpt.Caveman (edited 08-31-2001).]

[forrest_m]

a stubby pencil an a sheet of paper are a good addition to even the lightest first aid kit. a MOFA or WFR type course will instill you with the importance of writing down pertinent info when you go for help. weighs nothing, plus it ensures that can you brag in the summit register about your new record time on the route and keep accurate score when you play card games on storm days ;-)

[Cpt.Caveman]

Forrest gimme a break but I am never gonna carry that shit into the mountains. Sometimes I dont even sign summit registers and have no delight in spraying into them about times etc. The chestbeating style is not my style. I am supergumby so anyone could break my time. I think the only pertinant info I need for help can be registered in my brain. Those are weak arguments if you ask me

[forrest_m]

Well, i'm kidding about keeping score (now a deck of cards is *really* unnecessary weight)and bragging... but what are you going to do when you meet the future mrs. caveman on some alpine climb and she offers you her phone number?

[Cpt.Caveman]

I drop my business card to the honey. Problem is I am Caveman and I think that the bare miminum is the supero standard. Now I am sponsored by Team Gander Mountain I can get me a 20lb sleeping bag to bivy with her on the summit in stylie Freakie fashion.

[jblakley]

You kiddin'. If Cavey finds the future Mrs. Cavemen then he's just going to club her over the head and drag her down the mountain by the hair. No pencil needed for that.

[Cpt.Caveman]

[This message has been edited by Cpt.Caveman (edited 08-31-2001).]

[miker]

What's cavey gonna do with a phone number. He just bonks her on the head with his club, er croquet mallet, er picket. and drags her the rest of the way up the mountain and has his way with her. The only commitment he knows about is the kind where you get the nice tight white jacket.

"There coming to take me away, hoho heehee haha"

miker

[dan_e]

This seems to be a touchy subject lately, but it does seem like it could have been mistaken for a retreat line.

Should we really be fixing lines on alpine routes anyway? What would happen if for some reason you did not return for your gear? Should it be left there? To me this is the same as leaving trash on the mountains.

I still take booty, as it's a long standing tradition, but there are un-written rules. I would never take a rope though, mainly because you can never tell how it's been treated. However if you 'accidentally' leave a cam or ice screw behind it's getting added to my rack and I will use it with no guilt. I don't loose gear much, but I am sure someone out there is using a piece or two of mine and good for them since I was the dumb ass who dropped it or left it behind!

Dan E.

[Dan_Petersen]

Sounds to me like a writing utensil in the mountains these days is a useful tool. Of course, a note might make Stefan's rationalization of theft a little more convoluted.

I can envision the epic retreat where I leave the second rope behind on the last difficult rappel. I note carefully that I will return to claim it and that it was really necessary to leave it to ensure my survival. Stefan finds said rope and note, labels my explanation insufficient and confiscates my rope and picket as my penalty for not meeting his standards. After all, I've been warned.

[hikerwa]

instead of a club, he could use one of the big Husky pencils...

I will agree that a small pencil stub and a piece of paper is nice to have especially in an emergency or rescue situation, besides you can always use the pencil shavings and paper to start a fire (although not in icicle creek canyon, preferably).

[Jman]

Here's Cavey's future wife:

[Cpt.Caveman]

Question what the heck do you write down? Uh my partners brain is on the side of the mountain on the 420th pitch? Enlighten me.......

[jblakley]

Your partners secret ATM code

[forrest_m]

Well, the form I've got (copied from the mountaineers MOFA book) has spaces for a bunch of info that in an emergency you might forget to record but that emergency crews would like to know - heart rate, breathing, a bunch of other stuff. Plus you can write down time, location etc - that way you could, for example, pass the sheet off to someone you meet on the trail and stay with your buddy, etc. Last year, a friend of mine was a witness to a multiple-injury accident just below Headlee pass; he and several others were doing first aid, and flagged down another passerby to go get help. However, the guy didn't get the number of victems right, so when the helo arrived, there wasn't enough space for all the injured, and everyone else had an epic night assisting the (least) injured dude down to the trailhead. Ever play that game telephone? It's really easy for information to get distorted, especially in a high-stress situation... writing it down can help.

[Rafael_H]

Almost lost my sun-glasses at the base of Cathedral this June, ran back and got them. It was then when I changed my mind on booty. My friend who is very good and sharp and loves booty almost left his $100 glasses, good thing I noticed.

I don't criticize Stefan, myself went to get the cam from Tooth, almost cleaned a bunch of gear on Forbidden (didn't want to delay the party though), but think it is more honorable to return the booty, if possible of course. I lost a quick draw in L-worth myself for the first time and would really appreciate to get it back.

[Cpt.Caveman]

I like booty. It must suck to have to pay for it!