Index-cracks vs face

[eric8]

Anyone else out here find Index face style sport routes really hard in the grade when compared to the trad routes? Or do I just suck at face climbing?

[DRep]

It's a different type of game. Technical and balancy instead of burl. Takes alot of practice, but you gotta love the classic Index slap to the face.

[Sol]

Examples?

[eric8]

how many do you want? newest industry, model worker, wham, dana arch, little jupiter, heironymous Bosch all feel harder than any traditional 11 except p1 tmpv which the hard part is bolt protected face climbing

[Pete_H]

Both are hard for their grade I think. Maybe you're just more comfortable on cracks.

[eric8]

or a more detailed brake down

 

I can't think of any that feel bad at 10d which is where index sport routes seem to start...but at 11a

p1 kite flying blind, accidental discharge, and/or newest industry vs short bat skins, julies roof,

11b heironymous bosch, dana arch versus marginal karma, death to zeke

11c wham versus japenese gardens or shirley

11d little jupiter versus iron horse

 

maybe I'm just a bad face climber

[RuMR]

i thought kite flying blind was 11c...

[eric8]

the second pitch is 11c and feels about right the first is listed as 11a

[RuMR]

oh...i didn't read carefully...i always link the two as one...

[Sol]

I don't really see any major discrepancies between the styles, but it seems like you can get shut down on those faces if you miss a single foothold or fuk up the sequence...

[mountainmatt]

I tend to agree with you eric8. Another example is the fifth force.

[Blake]

Eric, I think Julie's roof is harder than KFB pitch one, but maybe the overall reason for your theory is that you have a lot of upper body strength and can crank on steep cracks or finger locks, whereas the face climbing might require more precise feet, crazy high-steps, or tech savyness.

[Rad]

Then there are some crazy blank slabs, like the 10c under GM. Who can do that thing?

[Jens]

I think that as we enter the next couple of decades, the face climbing of today and tomorrow at index will really be recognized for how unique and cool it is (if enough people climb it to keep the moss away- which isn't the case today)- Even though "slab" climbing isn't cool these days. Most other granite areas, don't have the micro features to allow pure face climbing at the steeper angles.

As for the crack routes at index, the harder crack routes at index just tend to be pinkie jams in pin scars or older quarried flake lieback problems or exfoliated flakes. When we coined the phrase "splitter" a number of years ago, it mean't staight in cracks which index virtual has none of. The index cracks are mostly behind flakes at either the micro or macro level. The term "splitter" has been bastardized badly in the last 10 years or so.

[TimL]

Index face climbing is special cause it's a mix , IMO, between fiction and technical face. For a lot of people who've climbed at Index, you'll recall that on the harder cracks, the crux sections are more face cruxes versus cracks i.e Jap Gardens and Iron Horse, Natural Log Cabin, TPMV.

 

Like most climbing, it depends what your used to. As for grades, they are on par with the cracks. They are just not the same style as 38, 32 or Smith. It's it's own special style. Just like overhanging limestone is it's special style. I know climbers that can't climb a 5.9 slab that put down 5.14. It's all about what your used to and what know how to climb. I've had to learn how to climb roofs and tufas here, but anything that involves friction, cracks or technical face climbing comes naturally.

[eric8]

I don't disagree that the harder cracks have face sections but my point was that these feel easier than there sport equivalents. I haven't led it but 24 hour bucanneer is basically a traditional face climb and compare that to just about any 11b sport route.

 

Anyway I suspect that a. I am a little worst at slabby face climbing b. there is some variation in the grades after all some route like leave my face alone, hairway to stephen, the route to the right of stud farm whose name escapes me don't feel to bad...

 

but supposing that a. I am worse at slabby face climbing, anyone have any tricks to improving this if I can only get out to index once a week when the weather is nice. UW rock? hangboard? yoga? etc.

[DRep]

but supposing that a. I am worse at slabby face climbing, anyone have any tricks to improving this if I can only get out to index once a week when the weather is nice. UW rock? hangboard? yoga? etc.

 

Other than just getting more milage on the specified climbs, go climb some long slab routes at Static Point or Darrington. The hyper-awareness of friction and subtle features has really allowed me to push myself on the face routes at Index.

[G-spotter]

Most other granite areas, don't have the micro features to allow pure face climbing at the steeper angles.

 

 

 

[RuMR]

what part of "micro" didn't you read? those are MACRO...

[G-spotter]

Those edges Peter's crimping on astroturf are pretty micro...

[RuMR]

he also said "most" not "all"...

[G-spotter]

Whateverz...

[RuMR]

you are the one playing semantics with his point...

[counterfeitfake]

Then there are some crazy blank slabs, like the 10c under GM. Who can do that thing?

 

Man, fuuuuuuuuck that thing. I did eventually make it.

[j_b]

Hard face climbing at Index is height-dependent (or at least significantly more so than crack climbing) so if you are short, it'll be correspondingly harder?