billcoe Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 The stakes are huge here. As it's close to the final version, has anyone read any of this? There is hot and cold running speculation that the Obama stimulus plan won't even be read by the people signing it as over 1000 pages it's so long. The real scary part is contained in this link below. If we spend the money ineffectively and wastefully, then we're in a bigger hole than before and we as a county are screwed. LINK to full story "Will the stimulus actually stimulate? Economists say no By Kevin G. Hall | McClatchy Newspapers WASHINGTON — The compromise economic stimulus plan agreed to by negotiators from the House of Representatives and the Senate is short on incentives to get consumers spending again and long on social goals that won't stimulate economic activity, according to a range of respected economists. "I think (doing) nothing would have been better," said Ed Yardeni, an investment analyst who's usually an optimist, in an interview with McClatchy. He argued that the plan fails to provide the right incentives to spur spending. "It's unfocused. That is my problem. It is a lot of money for a lot of nickel-and- dime programs. I would have rather had a lot of money for (promoting purchase of) housing and autos . . . . Most of this plan is really, I think, aimed at stabilizing the situation and helping people get through the recession, rather than getting us out of the recession. They are actually providing less short-term stimulus by cutting back, from what I understand, some of the tax credits." ....more...clicky linky... Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 WWASD? what would adam smith do? nothing - fuck the poor! bwahahahahahaha! what's it matter really? it's all monopoly money now anyhow - 10 trillion dollars of national debt, social security gone, several generations deep now of total fools - our national titantic is down by the head and gathering speed! enjoy your (abbreviated) swim bitzes! Quote
billcoe Posted February 13, 2009 Author Posted February 13, 2009 what's it matter really? Dude! PLEASE! Et Tu Ivan? This is the issue your kids may be paying for in 20 years. Huge huge issue. I had hoped that the new president would be getting the military spending in strange middle east places under control a tad faster. I wonder if the Bush admin briefed him on some hidden secret Saudi instability that created an urgency on the middle eastern oil situation: Iraq being the 2nd largest reserves in the area....Glad to see the energy nominee being a damn smart wonk who realizes the importance of our wasteful habits and is not afraid of saying the word "Conservation" like most of the republican jackasses, (any of you repubs on this site should be damned embarrassed about this particular issue BTW, it's one of the big causes of our trade imbalance and the amount of money we are flushing down the toilet in Iraq) but that's a long term thing anyway. This bill has the potential to drive our country directly and rapidly into the shithole instead of out of the one it's been heading for. Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 what's it matter really? Dude! PLEASE! Et Tu Ivan? This is the issue your kids may be paying for in 20 years. exactly, that's why i've already set my 5 n' 3 year olds down and said "listen here now chilluns, this is the whirl-wind you reap for me n' your mama's inability to use effective birth-control". it's going well now actually, my son can gut a neighborhood cat, cook it up on an open fire, and make a sweet set of mukluks out of the pelt in under an hour. we're ready for the zombie apocalypse - bring it on! as to the military thing - it's been a month - did you think it was gonna happen faster than that? i don't see the 50% of our budget going to the military getting cut really ever - it's been this way for decades through democrats and republicans - all politiicans are addicted to that crack which brings dollars to their constituents - what does it matter where the military is killing brown people? vietnam, panama, iraq, afghanistan, wherever - we're gonna keep making the tools of death and sure enough they'll keep getting used. hey, a day off from school! i can write manifestoes all day now...or i can drag my ass to the gym? Quote
Dechristo Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 - what does it matter where the military is killing brown people? Pardon me, but I get sick of this type of racist bullshit. Quote
Dechristo Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 WASHINGTON — The compromise economic stimulus plan agreed to by negotiators from the House of Representatives and the Senate is short on incentives to get consumers spending again and long on social goals that won't stimulate economic activity, according to a range of respected economists. The president should declare an emergency Christmas. Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 - what does it matter where the military is killing brown people? Pardon me, but I get sick of this type of racist bullshit. you don't have to percieve it as racist if you don't want i reckon, but our national and recent history clearly shows our preference, no? Quote
Dechristo Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 It is you who make the distinction and imply motive based on skin color. Quote
KaskadskyjKozak Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 - what does it matter where the military is killing brown people? Pardon me, but I get sick of this type of racist bullshit. you don't have to percieve it as racist if you don't want i reckon, but our national and recent history clearly shows our preference, no? Good call DeC! Quote
prole Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 WASHINGTON — The compromise economic stimulus plan agreed to by negotiators from the House of Representatives and the Senate is short on incentives to get consumers spending again and long on social goals that won't stimulate economic activity, according to a range of respected economists. This bold and refreshing kind of "thinking outside the box" is exactly what we need to solve the planet's most pressing problems and take humanity into the 21st century. Besides, I gotta start moving these babies out of my warehouse in Long Beach! Quote
j_b Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 "may" crash the economy? LOL The economy is already crashing, which is why a stimulus is necessary. Do try to keep up. Quote
Hugh Conway Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I thought you were stocking up on canned food and firearms? wouldn't that be a good thing? Quote
JosephH Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 Hmmm, a couple of trillion spent badly in the U.S. vs. a couple of trillion spent badly in a desert far away - I'll take my chances. The only way to get credit flowing immediately would be to absorb all the banks bad debts, nationalize them, and start extending credit. On the other hand, a significant contraction in consumer debt and expansion of savings is what's required in the long term. Like Afganistan and Iraq, the choices facing us and Obama aren't good vs. bad - they're bad vs. really bad. It's worth keeping front and center that there is absolutely no way out of our current financial situation without a terrible amount of pain all the way around for a significant period of time. Realistically, the 'stimulus' is simply an attempt to 'do something - anything' to keep the situation from free-falling into a further melt down further rather than 'getting us out of it'. Quote
Dechristo Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I thought you were stocking up on canned food and firearms? wouldn't that be a good thing? Party like it's nineteen-twenty-nine? Quote
j_b Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 It is you who make the distinction and imply motive based on skin color. it's most desingenious to pretend that racism/xenophobia isn't routinely used to justify "collateral damage", but then to assert that mentioning it is racism is beyond the pale. Quote
Hugh Conway Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I thought you were stocking up on canned food and firearms? wouldn't that be a good thing? Party like it's nineteen-twenty-nine? Irish bashing! Don't mind if I do! Quote
Dechristo Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 (edited) I assert that our country's involvement in Europe during WWII produced more collateral damage in civilian lives relative to combatants killed by orders of magnitude (with no regard given to appearance) compared to current conflicts. I must give you points for this gem: ...racism is beyond the pale. Although, you are often entertaining, your online persona, if genuine, frequently reinforces the notion that "reality is stranger than fiction". Edited February 13, 2009 by Dechristo Quote
j_b Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 so you think that cutting up my post to better spin its meaning and going off on a tangent to not answer what I said isn't going to be noticed? what a waste of time. Quote
JosephH Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 Human Losses of World War Two by Continent Continent / Civilian deaths --------------------------- Asia / 24,203,300 Europe / 23,302,800 --------------------------- Brown people, by slightly under a million noses... Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 It is you who make the distinction and imply motive based on skin color. i've spent a good portion of my life around the military, and i have met very few military types who aren't racist as fahq when it comes to our enemies - i'll grant you that their racism may be reverse-engineered, though, but nonetheless... as to motive, who cares? is going to war over greed/religion/ego better/worse than over race? Quote
j_b Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 Human Losses of World War Two by Continent Continent / Civilian deaths --------------------------- Asia / 24,203,300 Europe / 23,302,800 --------------------------- Brown people, by slightly under a million noses... Dont get caught up in this strawman. Comparing the collateral damage during ww2 to that in Iraq (for example) isn't the issue at hand. Quote
DirtyHarry Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 We've created such a mess I just going to emigrate to Sweden. But apparently beer there is really expensive. Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 Human Losses of World War Two by Continent Continent / Civilian deaths --------------------------- Asia / 24,203,300 Europe / 23,302,800 --------------------------- Brown people, by slightly under a million noses... we can also just do a count comparision of wars vs brownies vs honkies wars against "brown" people: - all of the us wars against indian tribes - the barbary pirates - the mexican war - the phillipine insurrection - the boxer rebellion - the dozens of wars/occupations in latin america in the 19th/20th century (nicaragua, honduras, haiti, the dominican republic, panama, etc) - ww2 - the korean war - the vietnam war - both iraq wars - afghanistan wars against honkey-states: - revolutionary - 1812 - civil war (but a war fought mostly over race, though under the pretense of states rights) - spanish war (sorta, and hey, them spainards are pretty much pushing the honkey-boundary - also, largely justified as "you don't treat brown people the right way, let US show you how its done!) - ww1 (hey, no fair - you took all the brown people's land - we want some too!) - ww2 still seems like the brown folk win (alright, alright - they ARE a hell of a lot more of them...) Quote
ivan Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 We've created such a mess I just going to emigrate to Sweden. But apparently beer there is really expensive. plus they're alphabet is realllly fucking strange on the other hand, hots chicks, hot tubs and a lot more ice to climb Quote
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