marking the middle

[IceIceBaby]

I didn’t invested in bicolor rope however I would like to mark the middle with something highly visible and permanent bear in mind that the rope color is very dark any suggestions

[max]

First, I'll put my vote in for bi-color ropes. I consider it a safety issue.

Anyways, to the question at hand: How to mark the middle of a rope.

For dark ropes, the best way is to nick the sheath all the way around so the bright white core is exposed. It'll always be easy to see.

Really, I think the best way to mark ropes is still with a small piece of cloth tape. I put the tape on while the ropes is weighted. This decreases the diameter of the rope, helping me get the tape on tight. This in turn minimizes the bump it makes when I'm feeding it through my device while belaying or rapping.

I've stopped using the special pens out there for nylon products. In my experience, the pen fades and is very hard to pick out in a pile of rope. I'd much rather deal with a small bump from a piece of tape rather than the frustration of not being able to find the middle of the rope.

Have a nice day.

[ 03-11-2002: Message edited by: max ]

[erik]

the tape idea is a bad one.....it can and will come off with one tight slide through the belay device......then it turns to litter and that sucks even worse......

make it with a sharpie pen....about 1" wide.....i know i have heard that this weakens the rope by a certain percentage on that spot....but i have yet to hear of it actually failing....so i am sure under perfect testing conditions when the marked portion of the rope falls over an edge it probably cuts......

i say mark it with a pen.....as far as the dark rope goes......still mark it with a pen.....

i generally have a good feel for the rope and you can tell with good judgement if half is coming up or if you should look for your middle marker....

markers fade and leave no mess and taope falls off and litters....

[imorris]

FYI if you use a pen to do this: If I recall, an old-fashioned sharpie is considered safe for marking middles, so dispense with the special pens. Another vote for bi-weave ropes. A directional weave would be a nice little luxury too for complicated pulley systems. If you use tape, I've had some luck with reflective stuff so you can find the ends and middle quickly on the alpine start. It wears off faster though, and gives the usual "tape jolt" when lowering through ATC, etc.

[ 03-11-2002: Message edited by: imorris ]

[texplorer]

You can take a bright colored sewing thread and simply sew a line through the sheath. It will not fade, runs through the belay device well, and you can feel it in the dark.

[freeclimb9]

For dark ropes, white fabric paint works well, but will wear out. The fabric paint can be found in hobby shops, and is used to decorate t-shirts and the like. For light colored ropes, use a Sharpie ink pen; it, too, will wear out. Replace when needed is about the best you can do.

[MysticNacho]

I have to cast my vote on the bicolor, after having one I don't think I'll go back. But for my non-bicolor, I use the tape method. Sure, it will wander away from the middle and it will probably fall off after spending a day running through an ATC, but whenever I coil the rope or uncoil the rope, its not hard or time-consuming to check and see if its still in the middle. If it isn't, I yank it and replace it the next time I climb, generally. I tend to shy away from keeping the tape on the rope when its not in use. Sure, there are better ways with this sharpie business, but I get wide-eyed at the thought of drawing on my ropes. Taping ain't hard, and these other ways sound like a lot of effort, and damn I'm tired. Just be careful with it and don't leave your tape on the ground!

[willstrickland]

quote:

---

Originally posted by MysticNacho:

But for my non-bicolor, I use the tape method. Sure, it will wander away from the middle....

---

Another reason this is a bad idea: If you rap with any kind of backup (i.e. prussik on a leg loop or mare's tail) it WILL hang up on that piece of tape (when you're on a double rope rap), and you WILL have a bitch of a time getting it loose, maybe not the first time, but eventually. Manufacturers should not even produce non-bi color or bi-pattern ropes now that they have the technology. Production cost is virtually no higher, so why do we even need single pattern/color stuff?

[IceIceBaby]

quote:

---

Originally posted by willstrickland:

Manufacturers should not even produce non-bi color or bi-pattern ropes now that they have the technology. Production cost is virtually no higher, so why do we even need single pattern/color stuff?

---

I wish they did

[erik]

quote:

---

Originally posted by willstrickland:

. Manufacturers should not even produce non-bi color or bi-pattern ropes now that they have the technology. Production cost is virtually no higher, so why do we even need single pattern/color stuff?

---

cause sometimes Will, one of the bi-color patterns might not match yours or your climbing partners outfit.....or vise versa....., i mean what if you both cordinate off of only one color for your daze ansamble and not the other....???

think of what it might do for shoe selection!!!! get it together man....half of being bitchin, is lookin bitchin'!!!!

[IceIceBaby]

quote:

---

Manufacturers should not even produce non-bi color or bi-pattern ropes now that they have the technology. Production cost is virtually no higher, so why do we even need single pattern/color stuff?

---

I think the reason why they don’t switch to all ropes in bicolor, is because that it dose not allow to cut the rope in any length they want and they do have to switch pattern in the middle taking more time to create the rope also with duo u either cut it to 50m 55m 60m or 70m and there is no way to determent which will be a better seller plus we have to remember that ropes have a limited shelf life so the reason is economic it seems I guess that’s why it cost moreMy $0.02

[ 03-11-2002: Message edited by: IceIceBaby ]

[vegetablebelay]

quote:

---

Originally posted by MysticNacho:

after . But for my non-bicolor, I use the tape method. Sure, it will wander away from the middle...

---

Setting up a rap when the middle isn't where you think it is could be a mess...

[Zenolith]

UIAA recomends the thread thing that tex mentioned. I've done it and it works very well. UIAA says that they've done confirmed tests that show the marker method (even the marker made for that purpose) weakens the rope by as much as %50.

[freeclimb9]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Zenolith:

UIAA says that they've done confirmed tests that show the marker method (even the marker made for that purpose) weakens the rope by as much as %50.

---

I call bullshit on that claim. A rope's primary tensile strength comes from the core, not the sheath. So even if the sheath were totally compromised, the rope wouldn't be weakened by 50%. What in a marking pen would react with nylon? Nothing (unless it contains xylenes, and I know of no marking pen that does). It's only adsorbed. That's why the mark rubs off eventually.

[imorris]

I'm unaware of this study. My comment was based on what Bruce Smith and Allen Padgett say in On Rope- N. American Vertical Rope Techniques. This source claims alcohol or water base markers are fine. Phenol derivatives are not. If you can point to UIAA evidence which contradicts this I would consider it. 50% is an alarming statement.

[haireball]

I've used contrasting-colored thread (weave it into the sheath with a fine sewing needle) to mark rope middles for over twenty years. the mark lasts for the life of the rope (defined as "until the sheath wears through"), does not affect rope-strength, and , yes, you can feel it in the dark, and it doesn't hang up in brakes or pulley systems. yes, it takes a couple minutes longer than tape or marker, but it is far far superior

[Zenolith]

I have the following from meeting minutes; "NEWS FROM THE PLENARY SESSION OF THE UIAA SAFETY COMMISSION INNSBRUCK, AUSTRIA, JUNE 2001"

"New work has again confirmed that ropes should not be marked (middle) with any kind of felt pens. The ropes will be damaged."

The following is from the Alpine Club of Canada Gazette regarding UIAA safety commission's testing on ropes. 1) Gasoline, diesel fuel, camp gas, sea water, coca cola, and strong vinegar do not damage ropes. Urine dropped the number of falls held in the standard test drops by 50%.

2) An American product specifically sold for marking the middle of ropes reduces the strength of the rope (only at the point of marking however and only when this point is loaded over the test edge) by as much as 50%.

I had forgotten the last part which really makes it unlikely that this would cause a real-world problem.

[Dru]

1) if it was a German product they would never have found that it reduced rope strength.

2) dont pee on your rope, although soaking them in gas or "coca cola" is fine... (what about pepsi?)

3)I dont mark my mid point and i dont have a problem

4) just cut the rope in half and tape it together again with duct tape. TOTALLY SAFE UIAA APPROVED

[allthumbs]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Dru:

1) if it was a German product they would never have found that it reduced rope strength.

2) dont pee on your rope, although soaking them in gas or "coca cola" is fine... (what about pepsi?)

3)I dont mark my mid point and i dont have a problem

4) just cut the rope in half and tape it together again with duct tape. TOTALLY SAFE UIAA APPROVED

---

Dru, rumor has it the Canadian Feds. are rapidly closing in. Suggest dismantling grow operation poste haste.