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Turn out the lights....


Alpinfox

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The LED thing is cool and will probably make a significant dent in power consumption. Biodiesel is a cool way for hobbyists to use grease - but that's about it. Once you start running the numbers and look at the environmental impact of increased biofuel consumption, it doesn't look nearly as appealing from an environmental, efficiency, or economic perspective.

 

Read this paper straight through and I suspect you'll be less enthused about biofuels.

http://petroleum.berkeley.edu/patzek/BiofuelQA/Materials/RealFuelCycles-Web.pdf

 

Increasing energy efficiency and conservation of conventional fuels and quite a bit more nuclear power, along with a smattering of wind/solar/biofuels is what we'll eventually end up with, but not handing a few dozen billion to the folks producing subsidized, tarriff protected ethanol.

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The LED thing is cool and will probably make a significant dent in power consumption.

The ROI isn't there - and won't be for years. The big advantage of LEDs, economically, is in increased lifetime, and the reduced labor costs associated with replacement - which is why LEDs appear in stoplights, airplane interiors (new 787). The other big advantage is a smaller package size - why they are making big inroads in automobiles, taillamps currently, with HBLEDs appearing in headlamps in the next few years. Oh, and making them uses a bunch of really nasty chemicals like Gallium and Arsenide.

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I think you're wrong parislover, I think the ROI is certainly there for office lighting over halogen and other types of task lamps. A 60 amp transformer versus a 6 amp transformer for the same amount of light?

 

Not for all applications, but certainly for some...and the manufacturing? yummy. couldn't agree more.

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I think you're wrong parislover, I think the ROI is certainly there for office lighting over halogen and other types of task lamps. A 60 amp transformer versus a 6 amp transformer for the same amount of light?

 

Not for all applications, but certainly for some...and the manufacturing? yummy. couldn't agree more.

 

that was from a trade magazine on educating customers about the benefits (my company makes LEDs). The cost on current units is like 10x conventional bulbs

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that was from a trade magazine on educating customers about the benefits (my company makes LEDs). The cost on current units is like 10x conventional bulbs

 

Oh for sure the installation costs are higher, but depending on your electricity bill you can recoup those investments within two years, and many of the packages i've been playing with (the next business project perhaps) have 4-5 year life spans under normal use. (nichia, luxeon and osram 1 watt and bigger packages.)

 

How dirty is the manufacturing really?

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Oh for sure the installation costs are higher, but depending on your electricity bill you can recoup those investments within two years, and many of the packages i've been playing with (the next business project perhaps) have 4-5 year life spans under normal use. (nichia, luxeon and osram 1 watt and bigger packages.)

 

How dirty is the manufacturing really?

 

At current energy prices ya, 2-3 years. But people are looking for a 12month ROI......

 

Really that dirty? Dunno what your qualifications are. Not terribly green to make, possibly/probably offset by lifetime.

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Brazil makes ethanol with no subsidy.

 

Yeah - no kidding. They have a significant natural advantage since they produce their ehtanol from sugar cane, which is way more efficient, and it'd make way, way more sense for the US to import Brazillian ethanol at prices that are way lower than what it costs us to produce ethanol from corn, even with the massive subsidies.

 

Now that MTBE is being phased out, and we dont have the infrastructure needed to get the ethanol to the refineries on the coasts, or to prepare the final mixtures for delivery to the stations, or the ability to make enough ethanol to replace the MBTE - it'd make a hell of a lot of sense to get rid of the tarrif wall that keeps cheap ethanol from Brazil out. Why have ethanol delivered right where it's needed by ship, at a way lower cost, when we can burn tons of fuel shipping more expensive ethanol to the coasts by truck?

 

Quite the populist retardation on display here. Should be quite the expensive megacluster by the time we arrive at peak driving season.

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At current energy prices ya, 2-3 years. But people are looking for a 12month ROI......

 

Really that dirty? Dunno what your qualifications are. Not terribly green to make, possibly/probably offset by lifetime.

 

Hmm. I've found some strong initial interest with large institutions for supplying them with task lamps for entire offices. I think I'll be moving forward with it in about six months, but basically, I pay part of the initial costs, and they split the cost savings with me over five years with buyout optionality.

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