What Fuels the Psyche of a Climber?

[sobo]

Construction? Petroleum exploration? I'm still

 

Oh, and

[Ducknut]

I thought the obvious fuels for the psyche are "sex and drugs and rock n' roll". Now that line probably dates me.

[sobo]

You googled Dru. That is not his real name. You need first and last to find him. I saw someone get smacked down for outing someone else on this board, so I will tell you where to look, but you have to find it yourself. He posted it in a thread on October 29, 2002. May the force be with you in your search.

 

Incidentally, I was wrong. He job is the fourth and fifth items. One of you illicit drug addicted thieves must have stolen my ability to count.

 

Thanks robert. WHEW! He posts so goddamn much it was hard to whittle it down with only 200 posts allowed per search, and I started in Spray over an hour ago (wild guess - wrong forum, tho). Still, it doesn't answer the question how someone can post, on average, 18 posts per day, FOR EVERY FAHQ'N DAY FOR THE LAST ~1,500 DAYS!!!

 

But I found the Force. Thank you, Jedi Master robert.

[Dru]

How do YOU have so much spare time you can spend an hour trolling through Spray?

 

18 posts takes ~9 minutes. Out of a 24 hour day, that's nothin.

[sobo]

How do YOU have so much spare time you can spend an hour trolling through Spray?

 

I don't, but I'm stalking you now. Once I make up my mind on a target, I don't give up. But I'm gonna have to stay late tonight to make it up, just so's ya know.

 

18 posts takes ~9 minutes. Out of a 24 hour day, that's nothin.

 

You stay awake for 24 hours every day? And you're so quick on the draw in every forum. I just don't know how you have the time to monitor all the shit that gets sprayed on this site.

[Drederek]

Obviously he's a bot!

[Dru]

I should get some of those spraybots, good idea.

[olyclimber]

I just uncaged my soul and topped off my psyche. I'm ready to go climbing.

 

For sobo: The answer you seek is here:

 

[sobo]

Dru's a fish-clubbin' troll in Fairyland? Figgerz...

[Divot]

Mmmmmmmm

[EWolfe]

crapulence

[Dechristo]

crapulence

At what ratio of vapor to solids does flatulence become crapulence?

[sobo]

at <50%. at exactly 50/50, it's all just a crap shoot anyway.

[EWolfe]

crap·u·lence

PRONUNCIATION: krpy-lns

NOUN: 1. Sickness caused by excessive eating or drinking. 2. Excessive indulgence; intemperance.

 

[Dechristo]

A lot of that goin' around...

 

lol...

[obsydian]

Letter to the PI editor, sent 7/18

 

Am writing in response to your article titled "So that's what fuels the psyche of a climber", published July 13

 

I'm really appalled at the lack of sensitivity that the PI would show to headline such an article with the accident that happened on July 10 that claimed 3 lives and injured a 4th. The article is a pretty breezy piece, almost tongue in cheek, with carefree quotes from Viesturs, Simonson, Wickwire and Gauthier and suspect science from Zuckerman. To tie this article to the tragic accident is tacky, shows a great lack of understanding on the authors part, and questions the oversight of the editorial board of the PI.

 

The climbers on the Sharkfin Tower outing were not adrenaline junkies seeking the latest thrill, as implied by the author. They were middle aged folks climbing very modest routes technically, just trying to enjoy the great outdoors. The North Cascades National Park is one of the great wonders of the state of Washington that very few take the effort, or have the capability, to enjoy. These folks were trying to participate in that enjoyment when a tragic set of circumstances overtook them.

 

So why do folks like this take up climbing? This is a fair question, although sometimes hard to answer. I climb for the following reasons:

1) Wonder. I've climbed over 120 peaks in the great Northwest, and I'm continually amazed that each time I sit on a new summit and soak in the glorious views around me how I'm filled with wonder and awe at the world we live in. The mountains are so massive, the glaciers so beautiful, it’s a wonderful place to be.

 

2) Spirituality. I find that I'm closest to my creator and have the sense of a higher being in control, when I'm viewing the beauty of the high peaks, I feel so small and insignificant, and become grateful for the things that matter most.

 

3) Mortality. Many of us have taking up climbing at middle age, some would say a mid-life crisis, but we reach 40, see that we've used up half our years, and don't want mortality to overtake us. We start exercising, stretching ourselves to the limit, gain good health, and feel that we're holding off old age as long as possible.

 

4) Friendship. The circle of companions I climb with are my closest friends, we share very close moments together, knowing our safety depends on each other. We truly enjoy each others company, share jokes along the trail, kid each other about our abilities, and have a great time.

 

5) Health. Climbing is one of the most physically demanding exercises one can do, and keeps me healthy. I really feel good when I'm in climbing shape.

 

6) Get away. I have a stressful job, getting away where there is no cell phone coverage and no connection to all the problems of work completely refreshes me.

 

These are probably the most important reasons I climb. Taking on risk and seeking that adrenaline rush is not one of them.

 

In summary, the profile of the climbers on the Sharkfin Tower accident don't fit the implied profile of the high risk taker published in the article in question. The PI has done a great disservice to the families of the victims by tying this article to them, and a disservice to the general readership with a sensational article. The PI owes the families of these victims an apology.

[obsydian]

Reply from PI:

 

I'm sorry you found the article so offensive and lacking sensitivity. That wasn't the intent in any way. And I received messages from Tacoma and Seattle Mountaineers who understood that, including friends of the climbers. Most, at least among the messages I received, liked the piece and understood it for what it was.

And a few didn't. Yours, obviously, is among those.

As a climber myself who has written about many climbing accidents, I'm regularly surprised by the emails I get when I write about an accident. Many notes have compassion and understanding about the injured or deceased. Others essentially carry this theme: Tragic but they got what they deserved by tempting fate. Some also complain about rescue costs and the rest.

Obviously, these folks don't understand what climbers are about and why they climb (and about what really absorbs the bulk of rescue costs, i.e., hunters and hikers). As you know, the reasons people climb are complex and extend well beyond the information in the news story and the reasons you cited in your note to me. The article was an effort to discuss one aspect of those reason, -- an aspect that is cutting edge behavioral science. It was not not meant to reflect the sum total of the pursuit. To that end, I talked to people who had dealt with death first-hand, older climbers, not 20-something adrenaline junkies.

Climbers accept risk when they climb, as they accept the potential for number of factors well beyond their control. I've not met one who's asked for pity about the accepted risk. And I've not met one who didn't consider the problem-solving to minimize risk part of what makes it compelling.

This story was a slice of that. Nothing more. You found it appalling, offensive and lacking in sensitivity; Others didn't. It wasn't my attempt to offend anyone, particularly members of the families. If you know that they are offended, tell them to feel free to contact me (or I can contact them) and I'll offer my apologies for their unintended reaction. Moreover, I'll offer a clear explanation why I wrote the piece. Thanks for your note. -- Mike Lewis

Edited July 22, 2005 by obsydian

[Bug]

Anyone who climbs and says they are not in it for the adrenaline is in denial. I go along with the contention by some that adrenaline is not the primary driver in all instances but it certainly plays a part in all instances. If you disagree, tell me why you do not walk up the back side instead.

I love the mountains for many reasons and I certainly am enjoying hanging with my larvae in the high meadows and blue lakes. But the steep places still pull at me. I used to think it was for mastery or purety of technique but now that I have been pretty much away from it for a long time, I have to admit that it is the unknowns that make it interesting. Climbing known routes is still fun and all but I cut my teeth doing first ascents in Montana and THAT is what I really miss. "Descend the obvious gulley" is good style for a guide writer. It keeps the full bodied spirit of the sport alive. If you know you are going to summit every time you are probably backpacking.

[Mal_Con]

You are right there must be an edge or else it is not worth doing, but it can also be an edge if you are luring your larve up somthing they could not imagine doing.

[sk]

Anyone who climbs and says they are not in it for the adrenaline is in denial. I go along with the contention by some that adrenaline is not the primary driver in all instances but it certainly plays a part in all instances. If you disagree, tell me why you do not walk up the back side instead.

I love the mountains for many reasons and I certainly am enjoying hanging with my larvae in the high meadows and blue lakes. But the steep places still pull at me. I used to think it was for mastery or purety of technique but now that I have been pretty much away from it for a long time, I have to admit that it is the unknowns that make it interesting. Climbing known routes is still fun and all but I cut my teeth doing first ascents in Montana and THAT is what I really miss. "Descend the obvious gulley" is good style for a guide writer. It keeps the full bodied spirit of the sport alive. If you know you are going to summit every time you are probably backpacking.

I do not consider myself a high risk or eiliet climber. but it is the risk and the unknown that make me feel alive and drive me outside to get at it one more time. as i get older i find myself contemplating the risks more and more. I find myself deciding before i go out how much i am willing to risk. but i still have to put myself on the line. as much as i shy away from the sharp end and tell myslef that i am just not a leader, I yern for it. as nervouse as i am to climb my first easy rout on a mountain i will still get after it. it is adrenoline and it is spiritual for me and it does make me feel closer to my spirit. and i do get board when i don't go. and i so hate being board. when i do come to the end of my life, and it flashes before my eyes and i get a moment to look back not on what i have accomplished but on what i have experienced, I know climbing and all it entails will make me proud and grateful for the time i have spent on this planet and the people i have known and loved. Climbing may not be everything... but it is a hell of a lot to me.

[mtn_gnome]

Several years ago I was in China visiting a less well known part of the Great Wall. This particular section snakes along a knife-edge ridge, high above a large lake below. Really quite amazing. One of the other people in our group and I decided we'd take a shortcut by climbing up the face to the top of this ridge, as opposed to walking the footpath.

 

About 1/3 of the way up, the other guy exceeded his comfort level and decided to downclimb and go back to the footpath. While not entirely comfortable with the my own situation, I determined it was better, safer, whatever... to keep going than to downclimb. A little higher up, the realization sunk in that one bad choice on my part at this point would mean certain death.

 

As incredibly irresponsible as it was (on various levels) - I vividly recall the feeling when I finally did top out. It was the most "alive" I had felt in 5 years. Everyone here knows the sensation I'm talking about. It was a wake up call for me that I wanted more of that. I decided then and there that I WANTED to be an andrenaline junkie.

 

But, things happen. I now have a responsibility towards the well being of others, so I content myself with smaller doses of adrenaline - i.e. more calculated and more mitigated risks. So while I wouldn't presume to know why others climb, for me it is an opportunity to enjoy the beauty of the mountains, breath some fresh air, get out of the office, avoid yardwork, and yeah... get a little dose of adrenaline.

[catbirdseat]

[Jedi]

<Some fill more than one: thrill and adventure seeking; experience seeking (non-conformity or impulsiveness, for example); disinhibition seeking (such as multiple sex partners, drugs or drinking); and boredom susceptibility>

 

Before I started climbing at age 25, this was my freak'n resume (sans the drugs). I wish Zuckerman could have been with me the times I stood in front of a judge. The more I poured into climbing, the less havoc I wreaked of society.

 

Jedi

[Drederek]

I too scored three out of four in my youth. When I walked up to a cliff I didn't look around I jumped. Thank God I always hit the water! Now that I am older I still feel the pull but am able to somewhat mitigate the risks. I'll stop and consider the consequences. And channel that energy into climbing. Who knows when you'll start up a route that turns ugly and really tests you?