Jibbing - Why the Hate?

[JayB]

 

I've been wondering about this one for a while. What's the deal?

 

I can see the validity of the critiques directed at the dudes who never seem to leave the terrain park, which seem to hinge on the fact that they have focused on developing a fairly narrow range of skills. A further assumption of this critique is that these guys are not likely to have the skills necessary to ski the whole mountain, let alone those required for safe, efficient travel in the backcountry.

 

These critiques may ring true for some of the park afficionados - but I have yet to see a skier capable of pulling off moves that would cripple the average backcountry-only purist if they were foolish enough to try them - cower in fear at the sight of deep powder, breakable crusts and/or any other condition that the backcountry snobs seem to pride themselves on their mastery of - and let's not even talk about moguls. There might be some extremely young guys that arrived on the scene after twintips that might have a hard time in BC conditions, but their numbers are small. It seems to me that in terms of limited skills, no one can compete with the folks who learned in and insist upon never leaving the backcountry. They are few in number, but rank up there amongst the least capable skiiers I have ever witnessed. Way worse than most avid resort skiers in "natural" conditons, much less competent on resort turf, absolutely hopeless on moguls, and incapable of so much as a spread eagle when the time comes to hit jumps.

 

But even if there's something to the limited-skill-set critique, what I really can't understand is the notion that these guys are hopeless pussies who would cringe in fear an wet themselves if they were to stare dow something as daunting as... the moderately steep slopes that make up 90% of backcountry skiing. I'm not talking about the hairy descents in fall-and-die territory that guys like Patrick Vallencant put up, or lines along the likes of those that the crew hunting down first descents are putting up - but the sort of shit that get's yo-yoed every weekend. When it comes to heuvos - even something that's become as basic as a 360 is to most jibbers is leagues above anyone who keeps both skis on the ground on moderate slopes in the BC. The many beatings I've taken throwing weak old-school maneuvers and the odd-over or under rotation related thrashing I've endured in my bolder moments have given me - at the very least - the ability to appreciate the risks and the boldness required to commit to even the most basic new school moves like a switch 180, let alone the corked 720's and other crazy ass shit the new-schoolers are pulling off, so it amazes me when people who have clearly never even tried a 360 talk like they are the brave one's for linking turns in the BC.

 

And - it's not like the skills learned in the park have no bearing on the BC, as the gut-check and confidence require to commit to any decent sized drop is quite a bit like that required to hit an especially big jump in the park, or try any maneuver that's on the edge of your capabilities, or puts you at a very real risk of injury.

 

So in summary, of the two principal critiques leveled at jibbers - the first (not well rounded) is overstated, and the second (no ballz) is a crock. IMO these charactizations are more accurate descriptions of the once-forever-and-only the backcountry crowd than the jibbers. So - what's the story. Why the hate?

 

Vs

 

Please.

[Billygoat]

It's all good.

 

But extremo mnt. dude is gay.

[snoboy]

Well, I tend to agree that the jibbers are ballsy, and it's some pretty sick shizzle they are throwing down. I get scared trying to pull a 180!

 

I hate watching ski pr0n that is all jib though. Boring to watch. Live is another matter. Big Air comps are a hoot!

[cj001f]

So in summary, of the two principal critiques leveled at jibbers - the first (not well rounded) is overstated, and the second (no ballz) is a crock. IMO these charactizations are more accurate descriptions of the once-forever-and-only the backcountry crowd than the jibbers. So - what's the story.

Said like someone who only skis the west coast - and the Pacific Northwest at that. Try SoCal, or New England, and see what you think of jibber skills.

[iain]

Wow nice pontification. I didn't know there was hatred of park skiers. Now I know.

 

Sidenote: There is jibbing, and then there is the outtake footage from Hot Dog. I hope the difference is clear.

[cj001f]

Wow nice pontification.

The popemobile As does Quilmes.

[cj001f]

There is jibbing, and then there is the outtake footage from HotDog. I hope the difference is clear.

[iain]

Ah yes, plastic brought so many improvements to skiing, didn't it?

[JayB]

So in summary, of the two principal critiques leveled at jibbers - the first (not well rounded) is overstated, and the second (no ballz) is a crock. IMO these charactizations are more accurate descriptions of the once-forever-and-only the backcountry crowd than the jibbers. So - what's the story.

Said like someone who only skis the west coast - and the Pacific Northwest at that. Try SoCal, or New England, and see what you think of jibber skills.

 

I think I know what you are talking about but you'll have to expand a bit.

 

FWIW most East Coasters suck at anything besides hardpack, but the folks who learn to ski and become proficient skiing on glorified ice tend to have better mechanics than most West coasters. I think that this might explain, in part, why an outsized number of the US's best racers have East Coast roots.

 

Only Cascades and Rockies. The Sierras and the Tetons are the only other places I'd bother to visit in NA.

 

But back to the topic at hand...

[chucK]

Chicken or the egg Jay?

 

"Why do those fucking numbnut loser pussies hate us so much?"

[JayB]

No lo comprende.

[Lowell_Skoog]

I agree with most of what Jay says. Backcountry skiing standards have gone way up thanks to skills and equipment from lift skiing. The skills that jibbers bring to the party will just push things higher.

 

When I started backcountry skiing in 1979, few alpine tourers could link turns rhythmically in natural snow (think powder eights). It's hard to believe today, but that was the standard I remember. Better gear and more lift-trained skiers are the reasons for today's improvement.

 

I think some of the negative feelings about jibbing are because those tricks aren't necessary (or even wise) for backcountry skiers. Watching guys in the movies throw flips off cliffs and land backwards is amazing, but that's a dumb thing to do in "real" backcountry, without a helicopter crew to scrape up the pieces if something goes wrong.

 

But those guys and gals are great skiers, and if they choose to throw tricks in the backcountry, more power to them. As an old-time freestyle skier, I've been guilty of it myself. A friend took this picture of me in 1982 at White Rock Lakes while skiing the Ptarmigan Traverse. I'm throwing a helicopter in leather mountaineering boots and Ramer bindings, after dropping my pack and gloves next to a perfect little wind scoop.

 

[JayB]

That is one killer photo - quite the juxtaposition of disparate skills on display there!

 

Lowell - I remember reading about your freestyle background somewhere. Oddly enough - you were one of the guys that came to mind as a living counterargument to the notion that jibbing and backcountry skiing are mutually exclusive pursuits. The record-setting backflip ensemble was especially impressive.

 

Cool stuff.

[thelawgoddess]

nice, lowell!

[forrest_m]

am i missing something? where is the hate being expressed? if the supposed conflict is crusty bc-only curmudgeons and saggy-pants wearing terrain park-only jibbers, how do they ever come in contact with one another?

 

and anyway, does the backcountry-only skier still really exist, or is it just an urban legend? my experience is that even the most troglodyte types recognize that the lifts are useful for building skills, even if you hate everything else about ski areas.

[Ponzini]

I, who grew up skiing narrow, stiff 207's, enjoy the chance to lay down a backcountry jib session, or a "huck high 'til you're hospitalized" contest in the backcountry, even though I'm pretty close to the "backcountry only" skiier. New equipment makes it fun to use old skills to throw down new tricks.

 

Wicked picture, Lowell! All you need to complete the old-time skiier outfit is a tie and a pipe!

[JayB]

am i missing something? where is the hate being expressed? if the supposed conflict is crusty bc-only curmudgeons and saggy-pants wearing terrain park-only jibbers, how do they ever come in contact with one another?

 

and anyway, does the backcountry-only skier still really exist, or is it just an urban legend? my experience is that even the most troglodyte types recognize that the lifts are useful for building skills, even if you hate everything else about ski areas.

 

Trad-only purists and pad-people seldom cross each other's paths in real life, but the seem to have found a way to perpetually slag on one another in virtual meeting places like this one.

 

Ditto for the wool-knickered three-pinners with bamboo poles and the jibbers. Not many pure archetypes out there, but my sense, after cruising ski related forums for quite a while is that there's a persistent low-grade disdain for resort skiing in general and jibbing in particular amongst the denizens of these sites, much like animus against sport climbing and bouldering - except that there's no way that you can argue that the jibbers are lacking in heuvos.

 

 

[steepconcrete]

I use to hate on jibbers, simply cause I got sick of it being half of what you see in the flicks and the mags. But now I think anything that attracts people to the sport is good. Weather you are pretending like you are a skateboarder grinding rails, or sloggin up some remote peak, its all about having fun.

[iain]

Ditto for the wool-knickered three-pinners with bamboo poles and the jibbers. Not many pure archetypes out there, but my sense, after cruising ski related forums for quite a while is that there's a persistent low-grade disdain for resort skiing in general and jibbing in particular amongst the denizens of these sites, much like animus against sport climbing and bouldering - except that there's no way that you can argue that the jibbers are lacking in heuvos.

 

I just don't see this conflict. I have not seen many "wool-knickered pinheads" either. In fact, telemarkers are the gear sluts of the industry these days.

[JoeMack]

I am definitely respectful of the skills that the jibbers (99% snowboarders) have in the park, but when they sideslip through the trees scraping away all the good snow in a 4 foot wide swath, then I get pissed. Is that reason enough to be hatin' fer ya?

[Ponzini]

Agreed! All of the heel-sliding, snow-scraping, no-talent snowboarders should be banished to a planet comprised of only the icy crust that they leave behind.

 

Long live the carvers!

[steepconcrete]

I think snowboard companys need to start making the heel-side edge look like this ^^^^^^^^^ so as they scrape it clean, it becomes a nice, although extreamly narrow, groomer.

[graupel]

 

So in summary, of the two principal critiques leveled at jibbers - the first (not well rounded) is overstated, and the second (no ballz) is a crock. IMO these charactizations are more accurate descriptions of the once-forever-and-only the backcountry crowd than the jibbers. So - what's the story. Why the hate?

 

While you might be right that the not-well-rounded claim might be overblown, it is non-the-less quite real. Here is an example of a tale told to me by someone who was there:

 

Two sponsored skiers were off on a trip to somewhere foreign (paid trip). There was new snow overnight, putting a nice fluffy cushion on a mogul run. Described by skier #1, known for being a big mountain skier as "it just doesn't get any better than that", and promptly shredded by skier #1. Skier #2, known for being a jibber, and highly promoted as a sponsored athlete, nearly resorts to kick turns to get down the fluffy bump run.

 

It would be an embarassment to call #2 a skier. A gymnast with skis perhaps, but skiing in the traditional "making turns" sense they wouldn't even qualify for the "advanced class". I'm sure this isn't the norm, but it does exist.

 

I'm not sure if heard many claim "no ballz" though, more an issue of whether jibbing is really skiing. I've got more of an issue with white kids pretending to be ghetto in clothing, mannerisms and speech. More in a shake-your-head-I-can't-believe-their-so-dumb kind of thing than truly "hate".

 

The bonus is when one of the youth oriented film companies shows up at your area with cast and crew on a 18" new day, they build a jump in the middle of a run and session it all day, leaving you and your buddies to freshies all day long.

[highclimb]

ok well this is my opinion as an 18 year old who on one given weekend will be skinning up the side of some mountain (on my twin tip seth pistols) to ski freshiez and on the next weekend be at the resort in the park wearing "baggy" pants and helmet working on tricks.

 

skiing is a sport that has progressed an enormous amount in the last 10 years. with the introduction of the twin tip ski new things have become possible on skis. i mean two years ago i never thought i be skiing "switch" in powder, or landing backwards off a 35+ foot jump.

 

what i am trying to say is the way i look at the terrain park is a way to progress my individual style and bring it to the backcountry and competition. nothing feels better to me than going off a cliff and landing backwards in powder and making it look good. thats just me, its an individual thing thats why i love it.

 

others has different goals but they are doing it to better themselves in their area of skiing. park exclusive skiers want to be doing that and more power to em. its just a different new form of skiing not many people are used too.

 

why do people hate on jibbin? i dont know. persoanlly jibbing has so much more style, beauty, individuality than other older forms of skiing. i mean look at downhill....everyone can race down an icey slope, they all look the same...just their times are different, not their style. that form of skiing makes it a number. thats what we should be hating on. i am not taking anything anyway from downhill racers its just a thought.

 

anyway got carried away. just random thoughts.

 

Aidan

[steepconcrete]

progression.

 

Aidan sez it how it is, very well put young blood, keep it up.

 

All except the racer thing, just watch Bode.