erik Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 was wondering who the freakin moron is, who was pounding pins on 10% aka the start of jap gardens? you totally plugged up a good clean placement. if you want to learn to pound pins so somewhere else, the lower town wall is not the place. i am going to go up there and clean it tommorow. if your name is on the pins i am coming for you. 10% goes clean at c2+/c3, jap gardens is a classic easily freed line. you and your pitons and hammer make me sick..... assholes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg_W Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Rat Bastard Mofo! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Pins in the clean crack be nasty, but where be the people complaining about the line of closely spaced bolts next to the crack on the route nearby known as Numbah 10? It goes clean on aid yet the sporty's don't like the commitment required to place gear on lead while free climbing. Brother Erik: resist the temptation to be a rock-cop. Grab the pins and consider it booty. You don't want to devolve into that guy who approached me 'n pope one day just because we had a hammer and "he didn't know us" and aggresively lectured us like naughty schoolboys (we had the hammer, on this particular route, for the purpose of tapping out (with a nut tool) heavily weighted and "welded" micro or other nuts placed during our clean aid ascent...a common practice) I saw a guy once completely nail Iron Horse. My reaction was that it was a lot easier to climb it clean and where the heck did he get all of them pitons? Ironically, I think the first pitch of Iron Horse goes free because of pin-scars, but we certainly don't require any more of that action if it goes clean. - Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 quote: Originally posted by erik: [QB]...i am going to go up there and clean it tommorow....[QB] not if I get to them first! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronco Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 How long of a ladder would I need for that erik? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg_W Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Bronco: quote:Originally posted by erik: [QB]...i am going to go up there and clean it tommorow....[QB] not if I get to them first! Either of you need a partner for this endeavor? Greg W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 20, 2002 Author Share Posted August 20, 2002 brutha dwayner....i am not attempting to be the rock cop....i am just voicing my opinion and the one in the guide book....i understand that some people are too selfish to consider their actions and that is fair enough..... if i seen you and da pope at lower town with a hammer i would say nothing, until the iron started ringing..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg_W Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 quote: Originally posted by erik: ...i am just voicing my opinion... Funny how we can do that here in America. Way to go Erik. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 where is a good easily accessible crag in washigton on which you can practice nailing - should told him to go there... or to set up a toprope if he couldnt do it clean on lead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 go bolt the rock at the RIE flagship store Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 quote: Originally posted by trask: go bolt the rock at the RIE flagship store Its bolted already! Oh wait you mean RIE - Random Inventory Experiments? The store where whatever's in store is whatever our specially trained blind monkey picked out of the Catalog? Hey, we're so big, with such a large customer base, SOMEBODY"s gonna buy it, right ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Is that why they have half an acre of wildlife posters and all those random Slovenian teriyaki chocolate noodle energy bars? DFA knew there had to be an explanation, but couldn't figure out what it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Dwayney - I have to completely disagree with your advice to Erik. Ignoring your value-laden term "rock police" I say that it is our obligation to let someone know it is a bad thing if they nail a clean route. Any experiences you have had with idiots are simply not pertinent to this issue. To watch someone nail Iron Horse and not say anything simply is BS. After all the hyperbolic grousing related to ethics on this site, I am surprised you would suggest silence in a face to face encounter. I am not advocating rudeness just a clear statement of fact As far as 10% you bring this route up every few months, I'd say a better example is the bolted line on Snow White. Especially since bolts have been added to sections already lead free w/o bolts. But since you mention it, please describe the nature of the clean pro on each section of #10 as bolted and the original route. Erik - I say if you see someone with a hammer, pins on their rack, or even using a hammer to clean a "loose rock" or piece of pro. Let them know it's clean. The worse thing they can do is to tell you where to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_Anderson Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Grrrrrrr . . . Jap gardens protects just fine (by anything other than a sport climbing standard, then the bolts are a bit spacey . . .) and is one of the finest free climbs at index (full first pitch . . .). Nailing it destroys the nature. We do all have an obligation to do what we can to prevent that activity. We also have an obligation to start out politely. We should stay polite, as we are preventing the degradation of the route. Nonetheless. Such abust must be stopped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted August 20, 2002 Share Posted August 20, 2002 Yo Erik, I saw that angle on Jap gardens last week... Someone is either very ignorant, or just has no respect for other climbers. They had also been nailing on the line just to the right of JG, you can see the scars from cleaning... On that same day i saw an RMI guide nailing pins into the Boulder underneath City Park. When I asked him why he was carrying a hammer and knifeblades up City park i just got a cold shoulder. They procedded to Aid the 2nd (10b pitch) and Slow Childern... I didn't hear any further hammering though. I've been psyching myself up to try and do Snow White clean for a couple of years now. (Then deck potential kept me a way) Now it's just another ruined aid climb. I hope the one or two people that can free it really enjoy themselves... Bad scene at the lower wall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backcountrydog Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 It goes clean on aid yet the sporty's don't like the commitment required to place gear on lead while free climbing. neither do "aid" climbers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by backcountrydog: It goes clean on aid yet the sporty's don't like the commitment required to place gear on lead while free climbing. neither do "aid" climbers Of course sport climbers don't like the commitment required to place gear on lead while free climbing. That's why we're sport climbers, Holmes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klar404 Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Lambone: Yo Erik, On that same day i saw an RMI guide nailing pins into the Boulder underneath City Park. When I asked him why he was carrying a hammer and knifeblades up City park i just got a cold shoulder. They procedded to Aid the 2nd (10b pitch) and Slow Childern... I didn't hear any further hammering though. Just Curious how you came to the conclusion that it was a RMI guide? And I'm guessing you got the treble hook out for trollin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 No, not realy a troll...just a fact I thought I'd point out. I'm not sure how relavent to the discussion or not. I was not suprised to get the cold shoulder from yet another RMI guide. Yet on the other hand, a few RMI guides are some of my best friends... They had RMI issue clothing on, and I had a conversation with the guy who led the first pitch at the Godzilla/City Park belay. He was way cool, and it was his first aid lead, positive and friendly...it was obvious to me that he hadn't nailed any pins on the route. He said it was nice to get away from the Rainier scene for some granite. He was one of those guys that you are happy to share a belay with. His friend on the ground however,was quite the opposite. Sort of the ying and yang of climber types I guess. It doesn't realy matter, I just think people should find a more obscure spot to practice nailing pins, and professional guides if anyone should be aware of that. [ 08-20-2002, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: Lambone ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 I agree with Puget that all of us who care about the crags share some measure of responsibility for what happens there if we fail to speak up when somebody is doing something wrong -- but as Dwayner's frequent complaint about a ten-year old episode demonstrates, it can be very touchy confronting someone about their ethical or cordial transgressions. For this reason, I wouldn't suggest that everybody has an OBLIGATION to speak out if they are (1) so pissed off they won't be able to address the offender with some modicum of respect, (2) worried that the offender may adopt a belligerent response, or (3) just not interested in dealing with it today. [ 08-20-2002, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: mattp ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by mattp: I agree with Puget that all of us who care about the crags share some measure of responsibility for what happens there if we fail to speak up when somebody is doing something wrong -- but as Dwayner's frequent complaint about a ten-year old episode demonstrates, it can be very touchy confronting someone about their ethical or cordial transgressions. For this reason, I wouldn't suggest that everybody has an OBLIGATION to speak out if they are (1) so pissed off they won't be able to address the offender with some modicum of respect, (2) worried that the offender may adopt a belligerent response, or (3) just not interested in dealing with it today. #1 and #2 I agree with but not #3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 I say go explore the area. There are tons of short cracks around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted August 21, 2002 Share Posted August 21, 2002 I hear Orgasmotron at Little Si is a good nailing route Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen Posted August 22, 2002 Share Posted August 22, 2002 One of the best ways to keep things civil is to offer a good alternative place to go place pins (other than up their a$$ of course). Where do you guys recommend someone go to learn the craft? Is there a good roadcut with a variety of cracks that isn't going to attract the state patrol, etc...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted August 22, 2002 Share Posted August 22, 2002 I'd suggest the quarry area, just a couple of hundred yards up the trail from the lower wall. Or one of the aid routes on the upper wall that actualy still requires pins. There is only one way to realy learn how to bounce test a tied of blade... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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