Teamsters Play Hardball with Darigold

[Dru]

hard ballin'

[RuMR]

you gotta quit talkin' to yerself or they will put you on stronger stuff than prozac!! you -ing er

[sk]

here it is in a nutshell.

-gregw (inovative, self-motivated, and determined)opens a business

-gregw advertises fair/competative wages/benefits.

-prospects see add in paper, understands gregw offer wages/benefits (compares to gregw's competition), responds, interviews, and is hired.

-business is good for gregw, employees, and community.

-employee(s) (enter toptimmy and gang) while on vacation sees super-rich guy pull up to indian creek in an Hummer H2 and pulls out 108 Camolots (12 per size).

-employee(s) covets super-rich guy, gives into impulse, dumps the Xterra and 109 Camolots onto credit cards.

-employee(s) is now well beyond his means, life becomes very stressfull. And then becomes raging mad when, at the end of the year, he only receives the national average 3.0% wage increase.

-Not understanding their own predicament, employee(s) pick up the phone...

-enter 'www.laborparty.org'

-'www.laborparty.org' gives severe grief and demands rediculous wages/benefits by means of organized crime upon gregw and all other business owners.

-gregw (along w/ Boeing, IBM, and countless others)says "WTF?" (has no idea that employee(s) is disgruntled do to their own demise).

-gregw takes advantage of capitalism/free trade, moves business offshore.

-now disgruntled unemployee(s) sits midday at local public library adamantly defending labor unions on electronic message boards. oh yeah, and sprays the typical victicrat banter, "F@#k Bush its all his fault, blah blah blah..."

-gregw continues to be innovative, self-motivated, wealthy, and in general, happy, all because he acknowledges and overcomes all his own faults in life.

-community falls apart, unemployeed union member falls into the victicratic downward spiral,loses all dignity and self-worth and sucks from the teet of mother welfare, demanding greater taxes on the prosperous, so that welfare won't end up like Darigold product.

-last but not least, fat 'www.laborparty.org' bosses sit at poker table with cuban cigars counting the endless stacks of money collected from every increasing outa work union member dues.

prosperity scorecard:

gregw - winner (by honest methods)

'www.laborparty.org' bosses - winner (by dishonest methods)

unemployee(s)/union members - loser

 

the end

either this is a hew GregW avitare or greg has a gay lover he hasn't told us about

[RuMR]

i think he enjoys talking w/ himself...

 

but you may be right, note the earrings!

[Dru]

either this is a hew GregW avitare or greg has a gay lover he hasn't told us about

 

how many HAS he told us about sounds like a freakin Dufferin orgy

[RuMR]

either this is a hew GregW avitare or greg has a gay lover he hasn't told us about

 

how many HAS he told us about sounds like a freakin Dufferin orgy

 

so...greg does laundry, one can only assume the other guy cooks??

[TBay]

TBay is legit, my friend, i'll dial in my bio later.

come on now, dont give credit to gregw, just cuz of my timely response and my total number of posts that equal the number of cams i trundled off of Iron Hawk. i am amased though at your lack of ability to tell someones sexual preference from writing style? yeah, and i can just mentally hear the faggoty lispe of my writings.

FYI-the pro gay/lesbian agenda(as with union/socialist ideology) tends to on the liberal platform, my previous response if you couldnt tell, had a conservative/republic conotation.

late

[Dru]

TBay is legit, my friend, i'll dial in my bio later.

come on now, dont give credit to gregw, just cuz of my timely response and my total number of posts that equal the number of cams i trundled off of Iron Hawk. i am amased though at your lack of ability to tell someones sexual preference from writing style? yeah, and i can just mentally hear the faggoty lispe of my writings.

FYI-the pro gay/lesbian agenda(as with union/socialist ideology) tends to on the liberal platform, my previous response if you couldnt tell, had a conservative/republic conotation.

late

 

T-Bag you and GregW could be one of these "Log Cabin Republicans" non-married couples

[Greg_W]

TBay is legit, my friend, i'll dial in my bio later.

come on now, dont give credit to gregw, just cuz of my timely response and my total number of posts that equal the number of cams i trundled off of Iron Hawk. i am amased though at your lack of ability to tell someones sexual preference from writing style? yeah, and i can just mentally hear the faggoty lispe of my writings.

FYI-the pro gay/lesbian agenda(as with union/socialist ideology) tends to on the liberal platform, my previous response if you couldnt tell, had a conservative/republic conotation.

late

 

T-Bag you and GregW could be one of these "Log Cabin Republicans" non-married couples

 

Doubtful, Dru, as I don't consider myself a Republican, per se (too liberal).

[mr.radon]

Non-Right-To-Work states suck. In '96 when I went to work for the Lazy-B half way though the first day's orientation class they pulled the hourly workers out. They came back thirty minutes later with funny looks on their faces. They were in a Union meeting. They were all handed union cards and told to fill them out. One poor unlucky bastard raised his hand and said he didn't want to join thank you very much. Well the nice shop steward said fine, but your not working at this company. WTF? Closed shops are the most extreme form of coercion and is ABSOLUTLY un-American.

When SPEEA voted for the closed shop status I was glad I had already quit. More then a few great engineers also quit rather be FORCED to join SPEEA. More then a few got fired for not joining. I had some SPEEA rep come up to me and demand I join, it was voluntary at the time. I told him to F off. He said, "We went on strike and fought for everything you have. You should be forced to join because you reap the benefits I won you through sacrifice." I firmly replied, "Sir, I was given a job offer commensurate to the skill sets I bring to this company. I had several to select from. If this company didn't give me the wage and benefits I felt I deserved I would not be working here, so F-off!"

I didn't like the Lazy B's management and pigeon hole tactics so I left. I'm pretty sure that if 80% of the Boeing work force did the same, wages just might go up on their own. Unions are just plain evil, they sit in hell just to the right of the Anti-Christ.

What union labor does to a prospering business: (no smiles though)

What they do to workers: (no smiles though)

Another good union example. My friend worked for Conrail. The Buffalo yards were always backed up. Well a new manager showed up and told the work force and union management, “Get this yard running on time and get everything unloaded on time you can go home early.” These guys figured out how to get eight hours work done in 5 hours and then left, getting paid for eight. The manager got the Buffalo yard running like a dream. Top management came by to see how he did it. They saw everyone leaving at noon and were shocked. The manager told him the deal he made with the union. Unimpressed the manager was fired on the spot. The new manager figured, hey they can do 30% more work then before to fill in the 3 hours they took off every day. Wrong, delays and more delays. Union guys were putting in tons of overtime and the yard was always backed up. Extortion.

Another good example. Friend of mine works for Boeing as a Boiler operator. Well they went to an automated system. The week before the switch the Union files a complaint with the city of Seattle stating without proof that Boeing is not in compliance. The City demands Boeing prove its plan again and until they do Boeing they can't switch. But they’ve already laid off the six workers. Does the union recall them? NO. These boys worked 12 on 12 off for seven months, seven days a week. Rolling in the overtime. All to a man said they wanted the overtime, anyone of them could have turned it down and necessitated the recall of at least one worker. It took Boeing seven months to convince the City that it was in compliance after all. Nothing was found wrong. Once again a perfect example of the union and its workers reaming not only the company but the poor worker without tenure. Pure EVIL.

[marylou]

TBay's story rings true. Workers are exceptionally greedy. Here's an example:

 

My labor union organized a theatre's stagehands about three years ago. These workers were all getting between 7 and 8 dollars an hour with no benefits. I guess the Xterra wasn't enough for those workers either. The rates went up a lot in terms of %, to 11-13$/hr if I recall, but the wage after they unionized was still pretty modest. They now have the same shitty HMO health insurance I've had since the 80s. It's the best we can afford though. We control the Health and Welfare trust in partnership with our employers. Same with the 401(k) plan, which is mostly contributions we make on our own behalf.

 

As far as white middle class men saying affirmative action is BS.....well that speaks for itself.

 

And with regard to closed shops, people are not required to join the union, the law allows for them to pay an amount equal to what the members pay for dues minus any money spent on political action. We have three or four people in our union who do this. That said, if you don't want to work in a union shop, work elsewhere. There are plenty of places to work where there is no collective bargaining agreement.

[lummox]

wacth out for lurking

[mr.radon]

To get hired by a company and then have some Union gangster come by and say, "Pay up and join or you loose your job and your kids will go hungry." sounds real fair. What you refer to as the "Beck" amount is not Right-To-Work. You’re an idiot.

Right-To-Work means you can work without having to join any Union. Therefore not pay any union dues at all and you can bargain your own contract with the company. America is all about freedom of choice and personal rights. If there is a Union in house fine, I want the choice to join or not. Threatening my job over the choice is not RIGHT.

Another thing the idiot Union leaders haven't figured out is this. You go on strike over some piddly thing, get shafted out of money on strike. Win, but never make back the lost money, and then the customers which the Union members help drive away from the business during the strike never come back and half the workers get laid off. What a STUPID business plan that is. No wonder Unions are in decline.

[Hayduke]

I am a member of a union.

The average wage in WA State is approx. $15/hr. I make less than this. My union has helped negotiate better health insurance for me and my family. My union has helped negotiate more job security so that in down times my company doesn't fire me at a whim and leave me and my family out in the breeze.

 

Where I work, guys with 15+ years of experience make almost twice what FNGs make. Without the union, everyone would be a FNG because they are the cheapest to pay.

 

Listen to what John Edwards has to say. There ARE two Americas and the middle class is not one of them. It is becoming increasingly harder for regular working guys to get by. How can I help my children with their homework if I have to work 60-70 hours a week just to make enough to pay the bills and keep a roof over our heads?

 

Do you know what a McJob is? Not everyone gets paid mega bucks to sit in a cubicle and spray about their expensive leisure sport-- a lot of people work hard and not all of us get paid nearly enough to get by.

[Wopper]

How can I help my children with their homework if I have to work 60-70 hours a week just to make enough to pay the bills and keep a roof over our heads?

 

Do you know what a McJob is? Not everyone gets paid mega bucks to sit in a cubicle and spray about their expensive leisure sport-- a lot of people work hard and not all of us get paid nearly enough to get by.

 

You can start by:

A) Living within your means

B) Increasing your marketable skills which will assist in increasing your pay.

[chucK]

GregW says that if you don't like the working conditions you can move on.

 

Marylou says that if you don't like working in a union shop you can move on.

 

Who's right? Is one wrong?

[scott_harpell]

I worked a union job for 2 years the first year of which i was making less than minimum wage after they took their 'cut'. Thanks a lot!

[Greg_W]

It is becoming increasingly harder for regular working guys to get by.

 

Hmm...I get by okay. Maybe you should have thought about the longterm consequences of the lifestyle choices you made (i.e., having children) in light of your lack of marketable skills and ability to make money. Just a thought.

[scott_harpell]

GregW says that if you don't like the working conditions you can move on.

 

Marylou says that if you don't like working in a union shop you can move on.

 

Who's right? Is one wrong?

 

Unions are there so you dont have to change jobs. What good is it if you have to change jobs to get the benefeits you want? Can't you do this on your own without someone putting their hand in your pockets? This isn't 1912 New York by the way.

[Gary_Yngve]

I worked a union job for 2 years the first year of which i was making less than minimum wage after they took their 'cut'. Thanks a lot!

 

So what was your payrate? Minimum wage? Isn't the standard union cut only like 1-2%?

[Gary_Yngve]

I'm getting hounded with phone calls, emails, and letters asking me to vote YES for if the UW TAs and RAs should get unionized [under the UAW].

 

What should I vote and why?

[Greg_W]

Unions are there so you dont have to change jobs. What good is it if you have to change jobs to get the benefeits you want? Can't you do this on your own without someone putting their hand in your pockets? This isn't 1912 New York by the way.

 

So, you're saying that it's someone else's responsibility to ensure you get the wages and benefits you want? If employer "A" isn't offering what you want to meet your personal wealth goals, then look for another employer. No employer is required to give you what you want; it's up to you to seek it out and secure it for yourself.

[mr.radon]

Call me a rich kid all you want but I'm not some silver spoon.

I worked 40 hours a week while raising a baby boy from diapers, paying my way through college and for my heath insurance. I figured out a way to do it and did it.

I now work for people and management I like and tolerate, places that respect the skills I bring to a job. If they don’t treat me well, I move on. I've also run two small businesses and have worked for some small one's that were great.

I'm sure you have a lot of incentive to work harder knowing twenty poor guys with less time then you would get laid off first in a downturn, or knowing that they can't get bigger pay raises then you because the Union doesn't allow pay for performance. But then again that would be making a stupid assumption like you did right???

I'm glad you're happy with your Union, most people say they are making the choice between the lesser of two evils. I prefer not to make a choice between any evil.

You avoided my whole point; how can it be fair that a Union locks someone out of a job because they do not want to join? Un-American, pure and simple extortion.

Union’s strive to keep the over achievers beaten down so the rest of the work force doesn’t look pathetic and pulls up the underachievers; sad way to run a work force.

As far as climbing being an expensive hobby, you’re really smoking crack there.

[chucK]

GregW says that if you don't like the working conditions you can move on.

 

Marylou says that if you don't like working in a union shop you can move on.

 

Who's right? Is one wrong?

 

Unions are there so you dont have to change jobs. What good is it if you have to change jobs to get the benefeits you want? Can't you do this on your own without someone putting their hand in your pockets? This isn't 1912 New York by the way.

 

I don't get your reply. Who is right? Who is wrong?

 

 

If the union is there so you don't have to change jobs, then I'd say Gary ought to join the union, because he's not exactly in a position to shop his skills around until he gets his "union card" (PhD).

[j_b]

What should I vote and why?

 

anecdotes won't help you choose. here's what the non-union environment looks like:

 

"A snapshot of Georgia's program for uninsured children shows that it's packed with kids of Wal-Mart employees.

 

[...]

 

Wal-Mart, with 1.4 million U.S. workers, is the biggest private employer in America; it now employs more than 46,000 workers in Georgia. The company is not unionized.

 

[...]

 

Last year a federal raid rounded up 250 illegal workers doing janitorial work for Wal-Mart contractors. And the company also confronts a large gender discrimination lawsuit charging that it pays and promotes women less than men. Wal-Mart said it disputes the allegations.

 

Health insurance and Wal-Mart are major themes in a strike by grocery workers in Southern California. The grocers want to reduce employee health benefits so the companies can compete with a coming wave of 40 Wal-Mart Supercenter stores in the state.

 

The outcome of the conflict, unions say, could set the tone for medical benefits in industries nationwide."

 

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/0204/27walmart.html