allthumbs Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 But VB, why bother with the facts when it's so much easier to spew horseshit? jb sux Quote
j_b Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 vegetablebelay said: Fuckin A, get it straight! MtnGoat is talking about 20 missiles, you are talking about barrels found South of Baghdad! apparently you did not read the link I provided Quote
vegetablebelay Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 Actually I did and your link does nothing to refute the initial post from MtnGoat, yet you're using it to try to hammer him. Quote
j_b Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 vegetablebelay said: Actually I did and your link does nothing to refute the initial post from MtnGoat, yet you're using it to try to hammer him. "Suspicions remained open about warheads found in a warehouse near Baghdad International Airport, which was seized last week by coalition forces. National Public Radio reported that an officer with the U.S. 1st Marine Division had said the warheads contained sarin and mustard agent. The officer, who said he heard of the discovery over a military intelligence network, said the warheads were on about 20 Iraqi BM-21 unguided rockets. Those rockets are about 10 feet long, with a range of about 15 miles. The BM-21 is a 40-year-old truck-mounted system with 40 rocket tubes, intended for close support of troops. The Marine officer said the rockets appeared to be ready to fire." Suspicions are not "evidence" for anything. Half a load (20 shells out of a possible 40) of rockets with a range of 15miles do not amount to a clear threat to our country (actually it sounds like left overs from an old and decrepit arsenal). And finally "appeared to be ready to fire" is not a very forceful statement either. Summarily put, we are well short from the "I told you so" thumping by mtngoat. Quote
eternalX Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 The Pentagon just said that they've heard new official reports about the missles found...only seen thnigs in the news. As far as the drums of chemicals, they said they had both positive and negative results from the tests for chemical weapons and that further testing would be done in the US to verify In other words, as of yet, there is no confirmed find of chemical weapons. Quote
Fence_Sitter Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 fuckin hippies... will you never accept the facts? the "persticides" and the missiles are two dfferent things! also...if you say that just because they are middle range missiles, they are not a violation...WRONG!!! Iraq cannot have ANY weapons grade chemicals... ANY! so quit your bitchin and support your troops as they fight a now (proven) justified war! one last question...what would it take for you to believe that they have 'weapons of mass destruction'? if this doesn't prove it what will? what are you saying? that they aren't big enough? you dont think that sarin adn mustard gas could inflict damage? ask the vets from WWI they should know... so quit denying the facts and accept that you were wrong you 'infallible' fucks...peace Quote
MtnGoat Posted April 8, 2003 Author Posted April 8, 2003 20 warheads of a banned material is the same as 1 of them. The material is banned, it's possession violates the ceasefire, and the ability of what it is loaded onto, to go any distance is irrelevent. Because the substances are banned. It's not complicated. Quote
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 So, M-Goat; as Iraqi civilians start suffering and slowly dying of dehydration and malnutrition due to a decimated infrastructure (not to mention who knows how many civilian dead already as a direct result of bombs), is that better than people suffering and dying from chemical weapons? Suffering and dying in the name of "freedom" and "disarmament" is still, if DFA is not mistaken, suffering and dying, and the fact that they're dying for "freedom" and "disarmament" might be irrelevant to those who are doing the suffering and the dying. Is it really worth it? Quote
Fence_Sitter Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 well DFA...it is a little case of logistics... 6 billion people threatened for the entire life-span of Hussein, or a couple of million for a few months (who by the way are already being militarily oppressed as it is)... what aabout the 6 billion? huh? take it hippie Quote
iain Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 he's got you there DFA, there ARE over 6 billion people in the world. What's your answer going to be Dr. Woodstock? Quote
j_b Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 dfa, you silly one, can't you see that all the box cutters seized at the iraqi ministry of information is clear evidence of their being behind 9-11? Quote
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 Fence_Sitter said: well DFA...it is a little case of logistics... 6 billion people threatened for the entire life-span of Hussein, or a couple of million for a few months (who by the way are already being militarily oppressed as it is)... what aabout the 6 billion? huh? take it hippie What's Saddam going to do, drive a boat to within 20 miles of 30 countries (or was it within 30 miles of 20 countries?) and hope one of his missiles lands in a city? Yes, a truly insurmountable threat, the likes of which the world has never seen. Quote
JGowans Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 I guess I'm beating a dead horse or whatever other metaphor you wish to employ, but the latest from MSNBC says that test indicate that the barrels do in fact contain only pesticide. Additionally, it would seem that reports of the rockets containing weapons grade warheads cannot be confirmed. “I’VE SEEN NOTHING in official reports that would corroborate that,” Maj. Gen. Stanley McChrystal told reporters at the Pentagon. He was referring to news reports Monday that Marines had found rockets, possibly packed with sarin and a mustard agent, at a warehouse outside Baghdad. So, right now, I'll sit here like a smug little git and laugh defiantly at all you right-wing war mongerers who can't see past the end of a rifle scope. I imagine soon though that you'll have your chance to sit there and say "I told you so" but until then....adios. http://www.msnbc.com/news/895392.asp?0cv=CB10 Quote
Sphinx Posted April 8, 2003 Posted April 8, 2003 Past the end is the point. Unlike you, we typically take the caps off the scope....moron. Quote
MtnGoat Posted April 9, 2003 Author Posted April 9, 2003 "So, M-Goat; as Iraqi civilians start suffering and slowly dying of dehydration and malnutrition due to a decimated infrastructure (not to mention who knows how many civilian dead already as a direct result of bombs), is that better than people suffering and dying from chemical weapons?" Yup. When they suffer and die from chemical weapons, they're pretty much toast. You fix dehyrdration and starvation with a magical elixer called "water" and another called "food" and in a short while, usually, you're OK. We can feed them even without their infrastructure, and further, since they have been existing with a very limited infrastructure to begin with, with simple markets and person to person trading, rebuilding a basic system merely requires water, and electricity, and most important, stability. "Suffering and dying in the name of "freedom" and "disarmament" is still, if DFA is not mistaken, suffering and dying, and the fact that they're dying for "freedom" and "disarmament" might be irrelevant to those who are doing the suffering and the dying. " You are correct. "Is it really worth it?" Since when this round of difficulties is over, the suffering and dying they've been doing under Saddam will be at an end, I would think the answer is largely, yes. We're not living in a perfect world, this isn't a situation where we're comparing perfect and imperfect, it's one where there's bad, and worse. If the UN had had it's way, the Iraquis would have continued to die in executions, prisons, torture, and yes, starvation, beyond this war, every day, and every week, into May, June, July, August, Sept, the fall, 2004, 2005, and off into the forseeable future. Once this current hell is over, that's all done. No more sanctions. No more torture. No more secret police. Quote
MtnGoat Posted April 9, 2003 Author Posted April 9, 2003 "What's Saddam going to do, drive a boat to within 20 miles of 30 countries (or was it within 30 miles of 20 countries?) and hope one of his missiles lands in a city?" Doesn't need to. One bottle, one barrel, traded off to some very bad folks, or many traded off to many, and all they need to do is get one somewhere with someone willing to pop the cork, and somewhere a lot of people in a mall, a stadium, a school, or a subway die in really nasty ways. Saddam doesn't need rocket launchers or submarines, all he needs is to know nasty people, which he does, and give them a few pounds of something really bad. Quote
Fence_Sitter Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 Hmm... DFA lets see here: 1) sadam denied having any weapons grade chemicals 2) we found some... which proves that he lied so.... 3) its probably pretty likely that there will be more found as Iraq is a large country with an emense dessert 4) having any weapons such as these are a violation of the peace accord signed after the 1991 altercation... and no...i am not tomcat... what do you propose we do then DFA? give back the missiles and go on our merry way? if they really dont pose a threat to us then why not... when you get done getting by your own preconceived assumptions and realize that this guy is up to no good then i will be able to take you seriously again... Quote
Fence_Sitter Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 wait..did i just admit that i took DFA seriously at some point in time? damn! must be too much lituanian Quote
iain Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 Fence_Sitter said: 3) its probably pretty likely that there will be more found as Iraq is a large country with an emense dessert Agreed. Those bastards are well-known for hiding Vx in giant Jello pudding pops. Quote
lummox Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 ali goes all dead n shit, and sexual chocolate goes silent. Quote
eternalX Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 It's fucking party time in baghdad. What are you anti-war people thinking now that the civilians in baghdad are celebrating the US involvement? Baghdadis poured into the streets in celebration, waving at U.S. troops and tearing down posters and busts of Hussein. In a scene reminiscent of the fall of the Berlin Wall, Iraqis attacked a giant statue of Hussein with sledgehammers. With the help of U.S. Marines who ran a cable from their tank to the 20-foot tall statue, they pulled it down, literally yanking the image of the fallen leader out of his boots. Quote
allthumbs Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 Now the lefties and Dems. will spend the next 6 months searching for shit to disparage the Coalition's efforts and outstanding work. Just watch, it'll be "bash Bush, business as usual". I'm afraid nothing will ever be good enough for "< some" folks. I find them zany at best. Quote
erik Posted April 9, 2003 Posted April 9, 2003 trask just like you bashed clinton? funny how a two way street works! Quote
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