AlienSoul Posted March 18, 2003 Share Posted March 18, 2003 I need to buy a new tent for backpacking and such. My old pup tent has seen better days and now does almost no water-repelling. I figure that if I am going to spend money on a tent then I might as well spend a little extra and get a lightweight 4-season that I can just use year round. I have pretty much gotten down to the Bibler I-tent and the Hilleberg Nallo 2 GT. I plan on doing some alpine and winter camping along with my general weekend trips to Eagle Cap and such. I like the large vest on the Nallo but I like the inside pole thing on the I-tent. I know this is like asking for a holy war but which do you think would be better (durability, room, ease of setup, price). Thanks for your input, Josh Gesler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted March 18, 2003 Share Posted March 18, 2003 I like the Bibler for alpine but the material is fragile. If you're thrashin' it, you might be better off with the Hilleberg. They're both good tent lines. I think Cavey has a Hillegerg, you might check with him. Lameboner can tell ya all about Biblers...hehehe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jja Posted March 18, 2003 Share Posted March 18, 2003 I have an I-tent and have no complaints. One thing you might consider is buying a cosmetic blemish. I saved almost 2 bills, and 3 years later I still can't figure out what the blem was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienSoul Posted March 18, 2003 Author Share Posted March 18, 2003 Where do you buy blems? From the factory or elsewhere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jja Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 I bought mine from Northernmountain.com It seems they only have the 2 door model as a blem right now. But they've got the green I tent for $446: http://www.northernmountain.com/pgi-ProductSpec?50170,7 note: copy and paste the url (ubb code doesn't like the comma) I'm sure you could check other online sites to find the best deal. I don't know if bibler sells blems directly or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienSoul Posted March 19, 2003 Author Share Posted March 19, 2003 Thanks, I'll keep and eye on that site for a single door blem if I don't find a cheap Nallo first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Check out integral designs. Their MK1 XL is *identical* in size to the i-tent, despite what the spec sheets on both say. It's also lighter, and uses velcro over that shitty clip that bibler uses for the poles. I think their vents are better designed too. Finally, they are a bit less expensive. All of this is why I went with the ID over a bibler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Aliensoul, I've got a Bibler Tempest, and like it alot. Cheaper than the I-tent. Perfet size for two people on a comfortable backpacking trip, nice built in Vestabules and bomber. I would only get an I-tent if you are planning to pitch it in very tight places, or need to carry it over on climbing routes. Otherwise go with an Eldorado or Awhanne, or the "cheap" way- Tempest. I had the zippers blow out on my first Bibler, but REI replaced it and the new ones work fine. A teammate had a Hilldeberg on Rainier last summer and he spent about 2 hours tring to get it staked out properly, and it still flapped in the wind all night long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skisports Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 trask said: I like the Bibler for alpine but the material is fragile. If you're thrashin' it, you might be better off with the Hilleberg. They're both good tent lines. I think Cavey has a Hillegerg, you might check with him. Lameboner can tell ya all about Biblers...hehehe That is the first useful post I think I have ever seen you post. BTW Hilberg are a bit heavy compared to bibler and there construction are totaly diffrents . It depends on what still you want.. I belevie hilbergs are double wall tents and bibblers are single so theres a big differance on wait. a freind of mine loved his hilberg on denali so. whatever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cracked Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 There is very little difference in weight between the two. The Hillebers are indeed double-wall, but the fly is connected to the tent so you set them up at the same time. And for the same weight Hillebergs have far more room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 cracked said: There is very little difference in weight between the two. The Hillebers are indeed double-wall, but the fly is connected to the tent so you set them up at the same time. And for the same weight Hillebergs have far more room. The hillebergs and ID/biblers are obviously quuite different designs. WHo has had exerpience with non-free standing tents such as the hillebergs in 4 season conditions? I use a non-free standing tent for 3 seasons, but that's when I can stake easily into dirt. The Nallo 3 GT has some great specs for a 3 person tent. Very roomy and decently light. I'm just curious if I could give up free standing design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Like I said, my partner spent several hours rigging his non-free standing hildi tent on Ranier. Stakes were a joke in the wind, he had to pile up mounds of rocks and use all kinds of funky guy-line rigging. My tent set up in about 5 minutes an had 4 guy points to worry about and wasn't phased by the wind (other than the zipper ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Lambone said: Like I said, my partner spent several hours rigging his non-free standing hildi tent on Ranier. Stakes were a joke in the wind, he had to pile up mounds of rocks and use all kinds of funky guy-line rigging. My tent set up in about 5 minutes an had 4 guy points to worry about and wasn't phased by the wind (other than the zipper ) Doh, yeah, should have read above Yeah, this was sort of my concern. I would still prefer a bibler/ID for conditions like that. For less severe conditions where you have a few people, lots of gear and don't want to bivy, however, I still think that Nallo GT 3 looks pretty neat. the vestible is farkin' huge. It looks like you could practically sleep another 2 in that thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Also, while we were getting our asses handed to us on Glacier Peak, all of our tent guys broke in the middle of the night. The only thing holding our I-tent up was the structural stability of the two poles. Then tent did fine, yet I couldn't stand on my feet while trying to rig new guy lines with slings. I'm all for free standing tents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rainier_Wolfscastle Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 If you decide to buy a bibler I-tent for year round camping, get the two door model. It provides alot better ventilation as air can flow between the doors on each end. No condensation problems in clammy or wet weather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana_Climber Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 I've only used an I-tent as far as this post is concerned. Those little velcro pieces that held the poles in place all ripped out in the middle of the night while on Shasta in 50-60 mph winds. With the new plastic tabs, the tent hasn't had any problems. I like the fact that my I-tent weighs 4 lbs with vestibule and that the vestibule significantly adds space to the tent. It makes it into a "3-man" tent in emergency conditions. On Denali , I used a double wall, 3-man tent from Wild Country. It was very heavy (~12 lbs) but held up to everything. On Aconcagua, I didn't use a tent until high camp but at that time I used my 3-man TNF oval. It's 19 years old now but still holds up well. It also is a monster to lug around at ~ 12 lbs. The best thing for stakes, either snow or rock, or what are known as "soft stakes". These are basically a piece of tent fabric, cut into a rectangle, with cord sewn into the sides. This piece is buried and acts as an anchor. I believe Bibler sells them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montana_Climber Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Bibler Tents Here's a direct link to the soft stakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 Montana_Climber said: I've only used an I-tent as far as this post is concerned. Those little velcro pieces that held the poles in place all ripped out in the middle of the night while on Shasta in 50-60 mph winds. With the new plastic tabs, the tent hasn't had any problems. Have you had the new one in similar winds? I can't see how the difference in how the poles attach to the clips would make one stronger than the other. the weak point, it seems, would still be the stiching, weather plastic stiched to the tent or velcro. FWIW, I seam sealed the seems holding the velcro in on my tent. It's apparently the only place that isn't taped and I figured the little extra security couldn't hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leejams Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 alien, I am in the market for new tent(s) as well. Just basically trying to lighten my load with my older heavier stuff. I looked at bibler but way to expensive for my taste and still a bit heavy. I am looking at Henry shires tarptent for 3 season http://www.tarptent.com/products.html And the black diamond betamid for a 4th season shelter http://www.blackdiamondequipment.com/gear/rock/betamid.php JoshK I believe you are right and should stick to a freestanding tent. My 4 season kelty is a similiar design as those hilleberg tube tent's and the problem is sagging with any snow unless you have guy lines going everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 jja said: I bought mine from Northernmountain.com It seems they only have the 2 door model as a blem right now. But they've got the green I tent for $446: http://www.northernmountain.com/pgi-ProductSpec?50170,7 note: copy and paste the url (ubb code doesn't like the comma) I'm sure you could check other online sites to find the best deal. I don't know if bibler sells blems directly or not. Bibler (owned by BlackDiamond) has been off and on selling blems (or special color runs, like neon green!)through their website, and the factory sale flyer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienSoul Posted March 19, 2003 Author Share Posted March 19, 2003 I really like how big the Hilleberg vest is. I want to be able to put all of my gear under it and out of the rain/snow/hail/bird poo! I also like the option of cooking under the vest in bad weather. I don't really mind putting out guy-lines since my current tent uses them. So far here is how the Bibler and Hilleberg compare. Weight is just about equal Bibler is 1lb more at 5lb9oz Nallo is 4lb10oz. Bibler is about $160 more including the vest. Hilleberg may take more time to setup and might make more noise in wind. trask said that the Bibbler might be fragile. If I am using this all the time would the Hilleberg hold up longer? This sure is a tough one. So far it doesn't seem that I would be losing big either way. It may just be more personal than anything. Bibler has been around awhile and people get attached to their gear, but that doesn't always mean that it is the best thing out there. I guess I'll just have to watch for a deal. Anyone selling a used Bibler or Hilleberg cheap? LOL We'll see what happens Josh Gesler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 (edited) I don't think a bibler is more fragile, infact I thik their material is probably stronger than most tents. The Floor might be a bit thinner fabric, use a ground cloth. Mainly I worry about getting the inside of the tent walls dirty. I think dirt would hurt the breathablity of the fabric. But unless you have a dog or something, they are easy to keep clean. It is hard to say one is better than the other. Single and double wall tents are like apples and oranges, they are just different. It depends on what you are using it for. For winter stuff single-wall will almost allways be lighter than a true four season double wall tent. For summer backpacking it is overkill. Also, don't plan on getting two people plus all your gear inside an I-tent, you will need a vestibule for that. Good luck! Edited March 19, 2003 by Lambone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cascadehigh Posted March 19, 2003 Share Posted March 19, 2003 (edited) Have you looked at convertibles! MSR makes some sweet tents. I have the super fusion and it is fairly priced. Here's a link... web page Edited March 19, 2003 by cascadehigh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshK Posted March 20, 2003 Share Posted March 20, 2003 lambone is right, I think the bibler/ID single wall tents are *stronger* if anything. The fabric is quite thick. The hilleberg tents use really thin material, so I'd actually think the bibler might be stronger if anything. One other thing to consider is platform size. I love the small single wall tents for camping on snow because you don't have to dig a big ass platform for them. The double wall I used before required digging a huge platform that would take forever. This is also a big benifit when pitching on tiny ledges. I have found my ID tent will often fit in bivy spots that were originally cleared for just a bivy bag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted March 20, 2003 Share Posted March 20, 2003 The bibler offers no vestibule which offers nothing if you decide to use a vestibule as a tarp in summer or when going even lighter. Bibler is ok but Integral Designs is made of the same material as bibler. Integral Designs is also cheaper so the only argument you might have between these two is the design. I would buy the nallo2 gt personally but whatever you like is like trying on a pair of shoes. Some might compare the hillebergs to a better stehpenson's warmlight.... And my final thought is that I would by the nallo 2 gt or nallo 2 since I already own a 2 person 4 season double wall exp tent... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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