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leejams

Ice tool knot's

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depends on what you are using for a leash. on my alpine axes I have some webbing, so I used water knots.

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Daler, yup that is what they came with. Just wondering what others use.

 

Joshk, The leash is just regular alpine type with webbing. Water knot is good.

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Dale, maybe I have my terminology screwed up... Here is what I was referring to as a water knot:

 

http://brmrg.med.virginia.edu/knots/water.html

 

As they describe "essentially an overhand follow-through".

 

I've also used water knot to describe the act of tying webbing back into itself (to loop and knot through an anchor hole in an axe for example), but I guess that is what you mean when you say re-woven overhand?

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Josh-

 

That photo is a water knot, yup!

 

The "act of tying webbing back into itself (to loop and knot through an anchor hole in an axe for example)" would technically be a different knot. The most accurate name I can think of would be an "overhand on a bight." Tying it to something through a hole turns it into a hitch, as opposed to a bend where two cords are tied together, and neccesitates tying it by re-weaving. Ashley refers to it as an "overhand loop" but doesn't seem to refer to using it as a hitch.

yellowsleep.gifGeek_em8.gif

 

JoshK said:

Dale, maybe I have my terminology screwed up... Here is what I was referring to as a water knot:

 

http://brmrg.med.virginia.edu/knots/water.html

 

As they describe "essentially an overhand follow-through".

 

I've also used water knot to describe the act of tying webbing back into itself (to loop and knot through an anchor hole in an axe for example), but I guess that is what you mean when you say re-woven overhand?

 

 

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I believe in this situation, the water knot is woven back from the leash end and the rewoven knot is woven back on itself. Most people I know use the rewoven (both the leash and tail go the same direction)

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Yup, you guys are correct, thanks for the clarificaiton. i had always been under the mistaken impression that water knot simply described a flat overhand knot of one form or another tied in webbing.

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Yes, I was talking about technical ice tools. Just bought a set and they had a knot that I was not familiar with. Definately not a water knot though. Thanks for the info though. bigdrink.gif

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because it's much simpler. I tried it 3 times past winter. ergos and new bd leashless tools suck on ice. but new vipers (with those thingis for your hands) are awsome! my friends from calgary pretty much climb leashless now, i guess it's time to upgrade my gear. as far as leashes go (even for alpine) andreoids are the shit for me

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I would not say that the Ergo or the new BD tool ( Fusion ) suck on ice. They just swing differently. With your wrist held at the same angle the pick is in a radically different position and takes a lot of getting used to, especially with the Ergo . Less so with the Fusion which swings much more naturally; more like traditional tools (framing hammers, axes, picks, straighter shafted ice tools) that we have more experience with. But the more extreme the angle of the Ergo's grip definitely allows you to pull harder and really comes into its own on the vertical or overhanging, whether it is rock or ice.

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leejams said:

why?? just curious!

 

Still looking for some solid reasons on why some go leashless, some don't?

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read dergees of freedom in the last AAJ. might give you some answers. leejams- just go to one of them ass fests (i don't know if they are all done for the season- quebeq might be still this weekend????) and try some of the tools. remember- these are just opinions and opinions are like assholes- all of them are the same and all of them stink.

from my own experience and my friends from calgary/manmore area - leashless with heel spurs is easier then leashes and no spurs. just climb and you'll figure this out. ciao

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gotta agree with you glasgow. I have vipers and recently added the fang things you talk about. Also very nice pinky protector for those of us who tend to destroy our pinkies often. I've found the combo of anderoids + fangs (both come and and off very easy) is killer. the anderoids are particuarlly great because i have the security of the leash for alpine but can easily get out of it to climb leashless and it's not dangling in my way. bigdrink.gif

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Why not buy a leash with a buckle? Skip the water knot. Thats old school dude...

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