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Darling Lambone- There is more to climbing in California than Yosemite. Needles (Kernville area), Domeland Wilderness, and definitely stuff within and hour or two of the road in Kings Canyon/Sequoia. Check out Southern Sierra Rock Climbing: Sequoia/Kings Canyon by Vernon/Moser/Hickey

You will be assimilated!

When I worked at a goverment lab all of the equipment suppliers started wetting their pants come August - because they knew everyone had to spend their alloted money. All the reps knew how to write a quote (splitting lines, multiple quotes for seperate parts) to get it in your budget. Then their are congressional line item projects (aka pork) - a whole nother fiscal fandango.

Ever heard of Mt Lemmon?

It was hot stuff - I was justing reading climbing #100, awesome stuff Now if we could find a woman dressed like a certain Patagucci add of the era...

NOLSe - Only if you sport a pink harness, AND leopard print spandex

Charles S Houston made a career of High Altitude Physiology maybe talk to James Wilkerson, author of Medicine for Mountaineering?

Late October!

Damn elitist liberals

My sister had a torn meniscus. The Sports Medicine People at her school misdiagnosed it - so she played a full season of D1 soccer on it. Couple Months after the season finished, her knee locked - when they finally diagnosed it correctly. Instead of having it scoped, which would have been what happened if she'd had it treated orginially, she had to have a meniscus transplant. Alot more $, a whole lot more time of her feet (6 weeks)

The act itself is a bit murky, but I'm not a lawyer. The feel good first part of the definition: "A wilderness, in contrast with those areas where man and his own works dominate the landscape, is hereby recognized as an area where the earth and its community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain. " Seems at odds with the meatier part: "An area of wilderness is further defined to mean in this Act an area of undeveloped Federal land retaining its primeval character and influence, without permanent improvements or human habitation, which is protected and managed so as to preserve its natural conditions and which (1) generally appears to have been affected primarily by the forces of nature, with the imprint of man's work substantially unnoticeable; (2) has outstanding opportunities for solitude or a primitive and unconfined type of recreation; (3) has at least five thousand acres of land or is of sufficient size as to make practicable its preservation and use in an unimpaired condition; and (4) may also contain ecological, geological, or other features of scientific, educational, scenic, or historical value."

I haven't visited a visitor center in 5 years, and don't you have accounts to "manage"?

Once again Fairweather, do your research: " and detract from the park's integrity until the claims were finally acquired by the government in 1984. [67] " http://www.nps.gov/mora/adhi/adhi7a.htm

If it matters to Oregonians it's in the Washington Post

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Cj, I'll entertain you one last time in the access forum...clearly you are uninformed. Try to educate yourself a little on issues you address. Learn how to read a map Fairweather.

The Wilderness Act of 1964 covers National Forests, National Parks, etc. It defines wilderness, by, among other characteristics "(1) generally appears to have been affected primarily by the forces of nature, with the imprint of man's work substantially unnoticeable;" Fairweather likes to quote the feel good part and not the meat.

Fairweather, Do I need to buy you a map to go with your condscension? All of the areas I mentioned are within Wilderness Areas, which was my point. No orange exception in above map of Oly wilderness for Enchanted Valley Or, further afield, the Ansel Adams Wilderness, which includes the Ostrander Ski Hut (that you need a Wilderness Permit to Sleep At!), which was part of the original 1964 Wilderness Areas. Revisionist Thinking?

Nothing like backing one state founded on intolerance vs another state founded on intolerance.

Fairweather- Remind me if I'm wrong, but didn't Nixon ® use the mechanisms of the state to work for his own reelection in the Watergate scandal? No democratic president has done that since then. If your going to use broad generalisations, back them up with facts. Or run away from them, as you do in the access debate.

Anyone used the Petzl Spirlock crampon attachment scheme?

Only one has the slogan "We report, you decide?"

Sunday morning the view was awesome from Emmons on Rainier. Waves, Strobe action, plumes, awesome!

John- Read the administrative history: http://www.nps.gov/noca/adhi-1b.htm "Lined up in opposition were the traditional park opponents -- the state's timber and mining industries, hunters, outdoor recreation groups, such as ski area developers, and local area residents and industry-oriented chambers of commerce, all of whom favored continued Forest Service management. Similarly, Seattle City Light, with some 700,000 customers in the Seattle area, continued to lobby for protection of its interests under the proposed Park Service management." While this isn't unanimous opposition, it is quite stiff opposition that Jackson faced. Oh, Fairweather, there was mining and logging activity in numerous drainages that are now wilderness in NCNP.

As I Walked Out One Midsummer Morning - Laurie Lee A World Never to Return Man-Eaters Motel - Denis Boyles