wfinley

No - only republican climbers leave a W. This doesn't happen very often though because republicans are mostly ignored in the mountains.

Wow! Awesome photo of Snowpatch Spire. Just beautiful! How many goats did you have to sacrifice for such clear weather?

Or $5,000,000,000 / month in Iraq.

Oh come on... you all know as well as I do that every year a number of climbers get killed by avalanches. The table in the back of Accidents in NA Mountaineering shows 278 ave deaths in the US from 1951-04 and another 125 in Canada in that same time. In 2005 there were 8 avalanche deaths. Granted the table does not differentiate between ski mountaineering and say, an ice route - but plenty of climbers out for a day of "real climbing" have been killed by avalanches. I think a better position / explanation is to say that climbers try very hard to avoid avalanche prone areas and because of this they are willing to take the risk of sometimes traveling through avalanche terrain without beacons so as to not have to deal with the added weight and gear. I suppose it's dumb but so is riding your bike to the liquor store without a helmet.

Hey - thank for that link. Gadd's blog linked to this thread which has decent info: http://www.rockclimbing.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1394069;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;forum_view=forum_view_collapsed;guest=829849

I have a question about half ropes that vexes me: I always climb on two 8.5 mm half ropes. One meandering routes I will often only clip one rope for say, half the pitch, and on the second half I'll clip the other rope to minimize drag. If I take a fall onto one of the 1/2 ropes but the other rope was last clipped in, say, 40-50' below me, is this considered bad? If you climb on 1/2 ropes do you run it out like this or do you use long slings to minimize drag and alternately clip each rope as you climb. Obviously if the fall potential includes sharp rocks / edges one would alternately clip ropes in case of a core shot - but what about on routes where this isn't an issue? PS - According to Mammut's website: "When used singly, half ropes are tested with 55 kg fall weight and must resist 5 standard falls, with a diameter of 8–9 mm and 42–55 g per metre. Used singly, they are suitable for additional securing, for example if there are two other climbers on the rope." However - Black Diamond's 8.1 Half Rope has "No" marked for "Resistance to a factor 1.77 fall over an edge at radius 0.75mm" whereas their 9 has "Yes" marked.

The deadline to comment on the preferred alternative for the Kenai Winter Access management plan is Monday (12/18)! In collaboration with quiet recreationists and the conservation community, a map that captures a collective vision for the non-motorized community—a Citizen’s Alternative (or “Alternative 1 with improvements”) has been made. A high resolution copy of the map is available at http://akcenter.org/GIS/pickup/KWA/ (the two maps are identical, just the titles are different). Thank you to the passionate and knowledgeable folks who have volunteered considerable time and effort on this issue, especially Tony Doyle, Page Spencer, Mark Luttrell, Rick Smeriglio, Charlie Crangle, and many others! Please urge the Forest Service to adopt this citizen’s alternative for the final plan! Email comments to: comments-alaska-chugach@fs.fed.us What's Happening? The Forest Service is accepting comments on the draft Supplemental Environmental Impact Statement (SEIS) for the Kenai Winter Access Project until December 18, 2006. This plan will affect recreation opportunities on the Kenai, including Resurrection Pass, Carter-Crescent Lakes, north and south forks of Snow River, Russian River and Summit/Manitoba. If you're in a hurry, you can simply click the email link below and urge the Forest Service to adopt the changes presented in the Citizen’s Alternative map (shown below). Want more info? Keep reading. Email comments to: comments-alaska-chugach@fs.fed.us The Details: We're seeking a balance between areas open to motorized recreation and those set aside for quiet recreation. Unfortunately, the current proposal dedicates over 70% of the planning area is to snowmachine use, and we are working to achieve a balance closer to 50-50. Of all the options proposed by the Forest Service, we had supported Alternative 1 in the last comment round. Now, a hybrid "preferred alternative" has been released, which has a few glaring shortcomings. So we’ve produced a "citizen's alternative" map that makes those key adjustments to the Forest Service map: The Carter-Crescent unit should be on a seasonal schedule to alternate with the Resurrection Pass unit- so that skiers and snowmachiners each have one of these units each year. (The current proposal designates Carter as open to motors all the time, and Resurrection as seasonal- leaving skiers with significantly reduced terrain in the years that Resurrection is motorized.) The Snow River drainage is the most popular ski trail in the Snow River unit- yet that trail is set aside for motorized use, contrary to the rest of the Snow River unit. The Snow River drainage should be for non-motorized recreation. The watershed of the North Fork of the Snow River should be included in the non-motorized zone (in the southern area of the Ptarmigan/Grant unit). North from Summit Lake to the Hope cut-off, slopes and drainages east and west are set aside for non-motorized recreation, except for a motorized corridor on either side of the highway. This corridor of motorized use bisects a popular skiing area, both eliminating the potential for quiet recreation and creating a conflict-prone access zone. All land adjacent to the highway from Summit Lake to Frenchy Creek should be included in the non-motorized zone. Supplemental EIS and Related Documents The purpose of this comment period is to provide an opportunity for public comments on the draft SEIS prior to the completion of the Final EIS and Record of Decision. The Responsible Official for this decision is Joe Meade, Chugach National Forest Supervisor. Comments are due by December 18, 2006 Additional Talking points for your consideration: The Forest Service needs to preserve natural quiet and wilderness quality recreational opportunities, and to protect the extraordinary natural habitats of the Kenai by designating large areas as permanently non-motorized. The Citizen's Alternative proposes the most-balanced management scenario of winter recreation for all users. It offers the best mix of terrain and cabin availability, and ensures that there will always be an opportunity for high-quality quiet recreational experiences. The Forest Service has failed to analyze the cumulative impacts of motorized uses to quiet recreation opportunities, communities, and other social values, as well as wildlife.

My wife just asked the bank about this today... $12 / month in Alaska... but if you climb it jumps to $165 / month.

Seen on a truck somewhere in WA: Hug a Logger You'll Never Go Back to Trees

This has become an international media event with debate over rescue and costs popping up all over the US. Climbers are a small special interest group that can't even agree with each other over tiny details - much less the general public on broader issues. The last thing that the public needs to see on television is a group of climbers headed out combined with a random interview of some SAR official asking climbers to avoid the area. If the public sees a news segment like that they'll go nuts and we'll be one step closer to more government oversight for all climbing areas. Climb elsewhere this weekend.

PM Sent!!

Jens - most phones today are only digital; older cell phones are analog - the phones inbetween are both - but often times you had to manually switch them. Analog phones transmit using radio frequency modulation (FM) and are thus better for long distance (I've made calls with mine from remote peaks in the wrangells and in the ak range). On the other hand digital is clearer and better for chatting with your homies.

A few years ago I was caught in a storm while descending Mt. Blackburn in the Wrangells. I've never seen anything like it - the winds were howling at a sustained 50+ mph and the ridge was literally disintegrating beneath our feet. After fighting our way down for 3000' we couldn't take it anymore and bivied in a snowcave. If the weather is even remotly close to what we experienced then I could never wish for another party to come to our aid; ave conditions were far too dangerous and the wind was unreal. Our night in the snowcave was sobering; luckily the weather cleared and we were able to pick our way down to high camp. I can only imagine what those guys are thinking right now. (edited to be nicer)

Isn't this a digital vs analog problem?

I can attest to that.

The flip side to this is going into the Teton Ranger station and asking about routes. A couple summers ago we asked about conditions on Owen and the ranger was like "Awww - I usually just take sneakers up that... maybe an axe." We wore crampons the entire route! As for Dougherty's guide - I have met many a person who went off their rocker complaining about Dougherty's time estimates. If he had humanitarian goals perhaps he should have considered how fat and slow american alpinist such as myself are.

Climbing accidents have been front page news since the Everest debacle. Anyone can get lost in the woods, but getting pinned down in storm near the summit of a peak... that's sexy! Stay tuned for the ABC's "High Altitude Rescue - The Mini Series" this spring!

Watch your language!! http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2006/12/13/tracing-a-climbers-footprints-in-cyberspace/

Yeah... like on Denali. Are you ready to shell out $500 to climb Mt Hood?

I agree that flexibility is needed whenever doing alpine routes - and I don't think any alpine climber would disagree. Regarding visitors vs locals and conditions... I can't speak for OR / WA but in AK the majority of accidents (in sum and proportionally) due to conditions involve locals. This isn't really a Cascades issue - bad weather is everywhere (think about Mt. Washington). Locals might be aware of conditions but familiarity of an area / region often cancels out fears regarding conditions. How many times do you go skiing during high ave conditions just b/c you know that certain runs don't (or rarely) slide? On the other hand if you were visiting you'd probably not ski in that area b/c you wouldn't know what to ski. As for conditions and reporting - the best system I've ever seen is at the Ice Fields Office in Banff / Jasper. At the ranger's desk there is a detailed log book for the area with excellent details regarding routes / conditions / accidents etc.. People are really good about updating it and newly arrived climbers can quickly get a feel for conditions. I've never seen this in the US - in the US it seems the NPS and USFS want to act as a filter.

Fine... but what about people who have jobs and thus are forced to only climb when they have pre arranged time off. What about kids, babysitters, your mothers sunday brunch that you can't miss? Would these climbers be considered vacation climbers? What about weekend warriors?

I did a quick browse through last years Accidents in NAM. The first 4 listed accidents in OR / WA were: - Ave on N. Sister in May: locals from portland - Frostbite / Lost on Ptarmigan Ridge; these were guides from RMI - Weather on Muir snowfield: guy who died was from Seattle - Fall on Gibraltar Ledges: guy from Port Angeles It seems to me that it is just as likely that locals will get into trouble as visitors. I'm sure that statistically speaking more visitors get into trouble but to advocate some sort of screening process for visitors is a pretty elitist attitude.

Nikwax makes a rope treament product: http://www.nikwax-usa.com/en-us/products/productdetail.php?productid=271&activityid=1 I've never used it so I cannot say how well it works.

On day 19 of an Alaskan Range trip I once dreamed that my girlfriend was baking a chocolate cake naked. When I walked into the kitchen she began rubbing the frosting all over her breasts. I was about to start cleaning off the frosting off when my climbing partner woke me and said it was time to get moving. On day 21 I dreamed I was in a kitchen with a hot Latino babe who was making chicken wings. I was equally mesmerized by her butt and the hot sauce that she was massaging into the wings. On day 25 I dreamed that my dog got into a fight with an Islamic cleric who also happened to be a king salmon.

You need the chain steering wheel: http://hometown.aol.com/halluciddreamer/images/cheech%20&%20chong.bmp In the summer of 2000 a friend of mine and I drove from Seattle to Alaska in a 1978 Ford Cargo van climbing along the way. It was the deluxe setup until we drove through the Yukon where gas was $4 / gallon.