dmuja

CBS im not glib about slinging boulders. On sharkfin, there were 3 people spider rapping and jerking off the thing (from what i heard). Just because a climb is popular with beginners doesn't mean everyone is ready to get it. Whats wrong with learning to climb better and with confidence before you step up the level of risk. Maybe people are getting hurt on it because they think its cool and fun to scare grandma by halling her up a multipitch climb? Its just more bullshit "sport" climbing menatality creeping into trad territory. Like I said, ENJOY THE PROBLEM. If your not ready for the problem why are you taking the test?

I don't think so. Chop, Chop Shit, be creative. Its part of the learning process, especially on a route like that one with such an easy last pitch. Can you really only come up with "either its a perfect gear crack OR a chain anchor? That fucking boulder weighs well more than 8,000 lbs by my calculations and is set well enough if you sling it low (as CBS mentioned)and predominantly belay off your body as opposed to hanging and jerking on it. Shit it took me about 2 seconds to sling it with the rope and sit down while my second walked up the last few feet. It (boulder as a back up) will help you catch a stumble just fine and that is the most that will happen if you break the last pitch up *above* the the crack and belay there. See, it forces you to be creative. How about this DON"T FALL on the last pitch. If you can't already climb 5.6 without confidence in your ability to not fall, what are you doing a 4 pitch 5.6 for? If you give in to those kinds of thoughts than you may as well bolt everything in sight because you can always find justification for lack of creative thinking. Shit, just enjoy the problem that is presented to you, solve it, thats how you learn. Bolts and chains often are a short circuit to thinking and better climbing.

They Shouldn't.

I thought cordelettes were "DEATH?"

I don't advocate a free market, but its pretty well described in the second post of this thread. After you see "Sicko", pick up the movie "Network" (1976) and then get "mad as hell...." And may as well pick up "Wall Street" while your at it. Your cinematic edification will be complete

Ummm.... its a little bigger than 3 foot. What do you guess that one weighs? I wasn't joking about a test push/pull - things arnt always perfect but it seemed fine (stable enough) to me at that time. You could always build an anchor at the top of the crack section. From there you just got some real easy corner/slab climbing to do where a fall is even less likely. All else fails, cut the rope, have the second free solo it.

I heard like 2 years ago that hanger was pounded flat. Maybe there's a bolt war going on at the fin?

Yep, tree is dead. Here, you can use this: Just make sure to test it by pushing it toward your partner first.

Arthur Jensen: [to Howard Beale/Dave Schuldt] They say I can sell anything; I'd like to try to sell something to you. It is the international system of currency which determines the vitality of life on this planet. THAT is the natural order of things today. THAT is the atomic and subatomic and galactic structure of things today. And YOU have meddled with the primal forces of nature!!! And YOU WILL ATONE!!! Am I getting through to you, Mr. Beale? You get up on your little 21-inch screen and howl about America, and democracy. There is no America; there is no democracy. There is only IBM, and ITT, and AT&T, and DuPont, Dow, Union Carbide, and Exxon. Those are the nations of the world today! You have meddled with the primal forces of nature, Mr. Beale, and I won't have it! Is that clear? You think you've merely stopped a business deal? That is not the case. The Arabs have taken billions of dollars out of this country, and now they must put it back. It is ebb and flow, tidal gravity. It is ecological balance. You are an old man who thinks in terms of nations and peoples. There are no nations; there are no peoples. There are no Russians. There are no Arabs. There are no third worlds. There is no West. There is only one holistic system of systems; one vast, interwoven, interacting, multivaried, multinational dominion of dollars. The world is a business, Mr. Beale; it has been since man crawled out of the slime. Our children will live, Mr. Beale, to see that perfect world in which there's no war or famine, oppression or brutality - one vast and ecumenical holding company, for whom all men will work to serve a common profit, in which all men will hold a share of stock - all necessities provided, all anxieties tranquilized, all boredom amused. And I have chosen you, Mr. Schuldt ahh...Mr Beale, to preach this evangel.

Twasn't me but... Ive been in similar situations at Index (as the dude your referring to) and had people cut right in front of us. Seems like he may have been trying to make sure that type of thing didn't happen to him. I don't *think* he was trying to bump you off the route, maybe (or maybe not) just ensuring that things go as you all talked over before another party showed up and a clusterfuck insued. People need to be pretty damned polite (he probly wasn't it sounds like anyway), but also logical, and not presumptively defensive imo.

Is that the section thats a bit above the squeeze/chimney, where you get up into one of the cracks? or is it higher up near the last few feet of slab?

Shit I plan on being there on the 7th thru the 9th. TrogB, can you point to that thread or re-post? Last time I was (there 2 weeks back) we were screwd as far as finding a spot anywhere in the canyon - people were using lawn chairs to block anyone from taking there friends spots until they showed up (which I thought was kind of fucked up). Is that even allowed? I'll search for your thread but any advice on camping in the canyon is appreciated. Thnx

all matter in the universe is moving toward seattle not even light escapes

Thats gotta be one of the best TRs on WR Forbidden ever! Thanks TAZZ

Whats the possibilities for trad pro on the route? If we're voting, I say no to more bolts as well. The pro aught to keep you from dying, not from getting hurt - I think anyway. Just add "R" in the guide book if its not already there.

Damn Bill, when should I pick you up?

all figures must first be converted to canucks

youre right though that a "catastrophic plan" is an option when available

Reality check.. Many, if not most, Americans live paycheck to paycheck. Many who do not, assume that everyone else is like them. For someone living paycheck to paycheck, perhaps with kids etc, paying for health insurance that would only cover part of catastrophic medical bills would at first result in debt, then deep debt, and then life long debt if a catastrophic medical issue arose - even if they had the crappy insurance that is offered to them. You guys need to get to know some working class folks and get out of you cubicles.

Id agree that "nationalizing" all health care might not be the best solution, but something should be done for the so called "working poor" which is to say the lower middle class - the ones always getting screwd.

If it were just me it wouldn't be much to talk about. With almost 50 million people in the same situation it becomes a political and I dare say ethical/moral issue. Not from where I was sitting.

Me and the other 47 million people. In my case, fuck , you kill one partner for snoring and it follows you for life. Whats a guy to do?

My choices at this point: A) Go into deep debt by paying $250 per month for health insurance that would likely cover only 80% of major medical costs.. should something big happen. B) Go into deep debt (probably for life) by not paying $250 per month for health insurance that would likely cover only 80% of major medical costs.. should something big happen. C) Hope that.. nothing big happens.. til Im too old to give a fuck about things like debt. not much "control" there.

>>"...41% of Americans answered 'Yes' to the question "Do you think Saddam Hussein’s regime in Iraq was directly involved in planning, financing, or carrying out the terrorist attacks of September 11th, 2001?..."<< That poll is flawed. 41% of "Americans" are actually "Mexican".