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I have to weigh in on both sides of the fence. I like biking better and feel like it's a better cardio workout. I have noticed that when I train only on a bike that I have more problems in the hills. I think that this is do to a bike being non-weight bearing and running or pack walking keeping the weight bearing parts excercised. Of course I am on old dude that has to pay attention to such things but,... What I found works good for me is to bike and work the cardio that way and to load a pack and climb stairs or hills to excercise the hips,knees, and ankles. Just my $.02

I'm not wanting to part with it, but, Marty Blands book "Inland Northwest Rockclimbs" does a pretty good job at southern Idaho. It's new enough and isn't terribly biased.

See what happens dude, you two disappear for awhile and we start talkin about Fred. Welcome back to you too

SB77, great start in spray. I am definatley not a girl so my replies would be: 1) Thongs are cool for climbing, especially if it compliments your harness 2) Prana knockoffs are ok, If you need more support go for it. 3) I once was ridiculed for Plaid shorts, don't ask me about fashion. On the other hand if you are climbing in a thong and an unsuportive top most of us won't be judging your fashion sense 4)Obsession with climbing is better than the income, but without the income climbing is a little rough. 5) Honestly the answer here is to be upfront. I don't mind going out with a newbie, if I know they are new (or even old and learning a new discipline). I hate gettin into more serious stuff and findin out my partner has no clue and was just posin. 6)Personally I like girls, the fresh young ones arn't bad. Newbies are to be tolerated especially since we all did that once. 7) Ya, Sprayin is climbers spoutin off about anything that's not directly climbing. You left this one wide open for "response"

Thanks for the input. It sounds like overglasses are the way to go. I'm sure I have climbed with other glasses wearers. They have all had their own and I didn't really pay attention. This gal leaves for New york in the fall and her climbing future is questionable so I think she will go for the overglasses unless I can talk her into the duct tape shields. Might happen, she thought my duct tape and tyvek footprint was the bomb

I had one of those interesting discoveries yesterday. I have never been on a glacier with anyone who wears prescription glasses only (a couple that I think wore contacts). So anyway now I am supposed to take some newbies up the C-D and one of them can't see without her glasses. What do those of you that wear prescriptions use on the snow? Do I need to tell her to buy custom glasses or ski goggles or what? I'm thinkin that she may or may not continue with the alpine or ice so she's not liking the idea of custom glacier glasses. Thanks for the help.

" No matter where you go, There you are" Seen upside down and slightly crooked "I am not a dumb blond" , yes the driver was blond

STP (one day) good time with good friends. Took some bad hits early in the ride. Broke a few spokes in back wheel first time. Limped along next hit broke a few more and my seat. After almost two hours of fixits I left Puyallup and the rest of the ride was sweet.

Sorry, this year it is one day for me. it would be fun to get together a cc group for two days next year. Assuming that climbers can get organized before the day of

One day or two? can you be a bit more specific.

Dukie, thanks for the note. I agree with what you and Afox have said. Having climbed for a while it is nice to get away from the pepes. I think the thread has drifted a bit. Hopefully you (or whatever newbie) is going out with a more experianced person. I would think it's their part to see that you have a good experience some of which is staying out of trouble. That is the point of my previous post. I don't think that the newbies deserve any crap either way. If I take someone out to a place that I know they will be a problem it is my bad and I (kinda) deserve whatever I get. If I take you to a newbie spot or don't plug things up I don't deserve it either.

I think it was east of the Baring railroad bypass and a little west of Skykomish. I will be passin through there again in a week or so and will try to get specifics and maybe a pic.

Just a little search for beta. In the last couple weeks I have made several trips over HWY 2 and have noticed a fair sized roof just East of east baring railroad marker. It is north of the hwy. I didn't see any easy access but from the hwy it is a decent overhang. I don't remember seeing it up there before. I might be gettin old and absent minded or just driving with the eyes closed previously. Anyone know where I'm talkin about and/or know anything about the rock?

I don't know if there is a best beginner spot. I take a lot of newbies out. It depends a bit on the group and there abilities. I think it mostly depends on the rep that the "host" wants. I frequently take groups of kids that have never been on rock or at best have only tried the "wall" at the local Y. If I showed up at index with 11 or 12 of these nice noise makers and started pluggin up the works, they would still have a great time. I on the other hand would catch flack and rightly so. If I showed up at the top of Mt Erie with the same group don't flip me any shit.

Ya goat, it's kinda funny I have a few projects goin here (mostly tryin to get in good with the owner) in the mean time I'm workin a new line over on cypress. One of these days we should get together and try the same lines.

Hey Snug, Congrats, sounds like a sweet trip and I know the caves was something you wanted to start doin. Sounds like an overall great time.

Hey Newstips, On anothere note. I appreciate the sidebar that was included in your article. I'm sure that the public is having similar thoughts to us climbers. By including a note with Kudos to the volunteers and how rescues are paid for it helps us. There's already a move afoot to charge for rescues and this was a good way to counteract that. Please pass on to the authors and editors.

So what your saying is mixing style and rap scrubbin new routes is not good

Dru, I would tend to agree. Here in the San Juans there is nothing ready made. If ya wanta climb it ya gotta garden it. I would be bent if someone jumped my project (for that I'm safe, nobody comes here to find new exciting rock ). It's also been a long time since I found a new line that didn't need some work. So what is a reasonable time? Do we just flag em with tape and send it anyway if the tape is faded?

Ya the only time I felt sketched was up a ladder with a bucket scrubbin somekinda crap that was stuck on there good. I couldn't help but laugh when I got paid the best for when I felt safest. At least I usually have trouble falling off a rope. I guess you could say I'm on the lam in one of those places that's were the ketch is.

Ya I felt like first come first served was it too. DB This is the site I was checkan out. Mostly dry but look around there's a couple good threads.

the dudes missin out. I did that for a while, I loved the scam. Where I was at, the fee scale went $20/hr to clean windows, $40 if the laborer had to use a ladder, and $60 if they had to hang from a rope. I didn't get all of the take but I loved it when I hung from a rope and got paid the most.

So I was just visiting a texas climbing board (you would think those folk could talk some shit, man their drier than RC.com). Any way there was one post that was a good question. With the way modern ethics are going can you "project" a trad crack? Is it ethical to go send a new route if someone else claims it as their project? I know in the sport world you can claim somethin. Used to be in the trad world it was whoever got the FA. Where are we now?

The have to cause their mommy won't let um climb unless they are extra carefull.

Lambone and Griz. you was right. I just got back from a visitto my friends. We were short on time (too much gabbin not enough climbin) He is really new at climbs of any kind. We spent a couple days in Rosebud Canyon. Did the Ramp on east Rosebud one day and a couple routes on Double Book Dome the next. We made a trip to The Rim also, JK you wern't kiddin about crumbly rock. Oh well great trip to see old friends, couple easy routes for fun and a pleasant stop at Peshastin for eats and a little "stretchin" on the way back. Great trip. Thanks again for the beta. I think I'm goin end of Oct. but I imagine Rosebud going to have snow by then but not enough ice to have anything in. I may just hike or do some alpine stuff then. Beautiful area