billcoe

I copied and pasted the first part, just like this post Kev.

-Check the ASCA site, although there seems to be less info than before. RC.com use to have a great thread started by RRRadam, but it looks like he edited it. Might do a search there. Rockclimbing.com -@ half an hour depending on how bad your forearms are pumping. 3rd thing: adding a little to what’s been said above: On the bolt question, given rock that’s not just loose shit, for hand drilling, the 3/8 X 2.25 stainless steel wedge anchors would be perhaps as good as anything you could find. I would use them before the Powers 5 pc in Steel, and the Powers 5 pc in Stainless is way too expensive. You might consider using a cordless hammerdrill as you can install larger and deeper (thus stronger) bolts. Course, no one wants to be carrying all that crap on a long alpine route. In the old days, almost all climbers used Rawl bolts because they were deemed the best. The were a split shank construction bolt made by the Rawl corp. out of high alloy steel that had a shitload of problems relating to design, size and material. Strength ratings for wedge anchors and Rawl Studs 1st issue was the size. They were ¼ diameter and either 1”, 1-1/4 or 1-1/2” long. Due to the design of the split shank, the holding power was not at the bottom of that short length, but closer to ¾ of the way down. All the strength was almost at the surface of the rock. 2nd issue is that they rusted quickly. The plating would get scraped at the exact location they relied on for their strength as you banged it in, being high alloy they rusted (relatively) fast. 3rd, the split in the shank needed constriction to cause it to hold, as you tapped the anchor into the small hole, as it started to squeeze the split shank, the pressure would often break the rock at the top of the hole and thus blow out the hole. This occurred more frequently on Basalt than on Granite. At Smith, it was very problematical in the soft welded Tuff but they got used there as well, (along with some other types like the Star Nail-in (Star Dryvins) which used to dot the West Face of Monkey Face and a few other places. These little split shank guys, when brand new, would hold up to 2000 lbs on their very best day in ideal conditions. You can check out the strength in the link above as the Rawl Corp was renamed Powers and they still make the little pups. Of course, in rock, conditions even on the same cliff can be hit and miss, let alone some poor pumped out dude in a near death state trying to hand drill a hole with a dull drill bit as his feet are greasing and smearing off while his forearms are screaming. Yet this was the defacto standard and was widely used on almost all climbing routes and for most anchors throughout the US. You still run into these little workhorses today, standing up after 30-40 years, still holding falls. Failures were remarquably rare too. When 3/8 bolts came into vogue. The length of them jumped immediately as well. Shear and tensile went up by a large factor, but most importantly, the holes were not being banged out and weakened by the constricting force created by the split shank, and the strength was coming from close to the bottom of the length being used, unlike the split shank construction bolts. http://www.powers.com/pdfs/mechanical/07424.pdf Wedge anchors of 1-3/4 length were not uncommon, hand drilling was still in use, and longer than that was rare although there was a bird or 2 using 2” or 2-1/2 here or there in the desert or in weaker rock, but not often around here in basalt, and never in granite with a hand drill. With the use of roto-hammers, size and embedment depth have gotten bigger and size matters less on the installation end. But if you look at the strength of a single 3/8 x 3-3/4 stainless wedge anchor, you will see in order to stress it to the point it will failure, the human body attached to the other end would have most likely not survived that force. So to answer your question, I suspect that a 3/8" diameter x 2.25" is good, especially if you are handdrilling and a 3.75" long anchor bolt is overkill for 99 percent of rock. However, it was brought to my attention by Mark D that any dumbass climber can easily over torque and thus weaken a 3/8 wedge anchor on install. (A torque wrench should be used to install these, or at least learn what 25-28 foot# of torque feels like with your box end wrench) So as such, 1/2 diameter should be utilized to avoid the potential to weaken the bolt on the installation. I have never heard of anyone installing a 1/2 bolt by hand, in fact, my 14.4 V Milwaukee cordless hammerdrill can do about 12-14 3/8 X 3-3/4 holes before the battery dies, but will do only 1 and a half of the 1/2" diameter before dying. It is a significant difference. My cordless drill essentially won't drill that size, and it takes forever and rattles the hell out of ya too when you try it. For handdrilling don't try to bite it all off at once. A new sharp bit and a good hammer will get you far along as will strong forearms. Tap tap tap twist tap tap tap twist Tap tap tap twist tap tap tap twist, get a rhythm and let the rebound of the drill do the work. Don't tap too much before twisting, you'll feel it. If you are way out on lead pissing your pants, a light sling can be put over the drill bit right where it is next to the wall once the bit starts to get some depth, and clipped to your harness to relieve your aching calves. Don't weight it too much or just hang on it as a snapped drill bit would suck, it's for supplementary assistance so you don't take a fall only until you get the hole down where you can put the wedge anchor in. If you are on anything but a nice stance, you'll be peeing your pants for sure, it's a very uncomfortable and muscle aching feeling. Very insecure. When the hole is deep enough, add a few more hammers blows to make it deeper just to make sure, as was said above, inserting the bolt upside down will sort of work, but better yet is to put some tape on your drill bit when you are safe at home watching the Flintstones to mark how far you need to go. I have put in bolts without blowing the dust out of the hole, the twisting motion of the bit will clear the hole, but take a McDonalds straw and blow the hole out. Put the nut and the hanger on so the nut is flush with the top of the anchor stud, then slowly tap in the bolt until it is flush. Slamming the bolt in may be what causes spinners. Tap it in then set it by wrenching it to the recommended torque and you're done baby! Clip that puppy and hang like a the crybaby motherfucker you feel like......err, wait, I don't know where that came from, I mean clip and send, that’s it, clip and SEND BABY! (Note to self: No hanging damnit, no crying damnit, no peeing the pants.... again.... damnit.) A heavy hammer is nicer than a light hammer, the Kong Eagle is good, they make 2 versions the heavy one rules. A5 if you can find one without mortgaging your left nut, a Forrest wall hammer, or Black Diamond are all good. Stay away from some of the real light European hammers (Bonati, Salewa) which are really designed to be carried up easy 3000" faces in the alps to just reset a piton or 2. You'll be working your ass off to get a hole drilled with one of them. Use stainless steel wedge anchors too. Even in Eastern Washington and Oregon. Seriously, otherwise, someone is going to have to replace it, and you can't get the 5 pc out within 2-3 years in western Oregon with a wrench cause the threads rust and weld the bolt to the wedge insert. You wind up snapping the head off and then you have a grade 5 bolt which you aint drilling out easily bubba, so you have to put the next STAINLESS bolt next to the snapped off 5 pc and cover the shithole with 2 part epoxy. Hopefully you will find some pearls of wisdom in that post somewhere that will help you out. Take care Bill

And to the brave few going up to get them. Hoping they have great conditions and no loose rock or ice blocks if they decide to rap down the N Face. shit

Shit, his 5 year olds probably doing Shoes already. P-L-E-A-S-E.

Nice of you to recognize the need to be "corrected" and thanks for putting us minorities back into our place. Yazz boss! So, you've got the take on the majority, eh? So, we're supposed to shut up because you feel we're wasting our time, eh? So, if it falls on deaf ears, are you suggesting that the "majority" is sufficiently close-minded as to not to consider the alternatives? There are more of us out here than you think, and we're not leaving town. Get used to it. Mr Moore makes some very pointed salient points which you are obviously ill informed about. I am surprised that this is the best attack you can muster. It appears to me that you did not read his full post, or if you did, did not wish to think yourself wrong. Frankly Dwayner, I agree with many of your points. Gym climbing and sport bolting mentality causes the overcrowding Mr Moore is bringing up. Mr Moore is spot on the money with his post, you can belive that putting in bolts is more environmentally damaging than snowmobiles, but then, you can believe in the tooth ferrie as well if you wish. I am hardly a bolting fanatic. The last 5 routes I cleaned up at Rocky Butte had a total of 1 protection bolt put in. You, however, take it to a new, and unrealistic distant point where you really are by yourself pretty much. I am glad to see you finally acknowledge rappel bolts. There may be hope for you after all:-) BTW neither Moore nor I are asking you to stop preaching, but after a while, it really reminds me of those street Preacher Christians yelling and screaming in strangers faces that the strangers are sinners and going to hell. It is not the best way to make the point IMO. Don't think of that as a personal attack either, cause it isn't, I think I'd have a great time getting on rock with you sometime. Take care Bill

Seagal drops the sheep and gets an exotic girlfriend. Congrats on the upgrade Steven. BTW, I was at this very place located in Changdu, China last September-October. They charge $50 to fondle a live Panda or 2. Really. I wasn't gonna go for it unless I could get the "happy finish" tossed in so I passed. Never thought SS would have to pay for it but he's getting old and heavy so there ya have it:-) BTW, how can anyone hate CC.com? Love the climbing pictures that fit in between the Steven Seagal pictures here and there.

Totally and deeply disagree. What "happened" at Smith is not even close to a tragedy. That was pretty much a choss heap with shitloads of loose rock everywhere before the bridge went in. Danny Gates and Steve Strauch pushed and cleaned tons of loose shit off of Super Slab alone just so we can have a clean 5.6 to jump on. Where's all the bolts on that route and bunches of others? Later - Watts, Lester and those guys kicked ass. Go look at the East or North Faces of Monkey and think on it. Show me the bolts on those cracks sir and think of freeing those moves with Rps. Tragedy hell.

Wandered over from The Daily Cafe, little French style food diner in the Pearl to REI tonight. Walked out with $16 in my pocket which they gave me along with a couple of hundred dollars of shit. The little Grey WC, slightly smaller than the smallest Alien $14.93, REI, right now. The larger Zeros are closer to $29.93, still a good price. BTW: they still had some Grey-2" Aliens for $29.50 and DMM wired stoppers (best stopper in the world) on sale along with Faders Sums for $49.50, and Toucans for $19.00 along with some other horseshit too. But the best $ was Edelrid helmets for $19.93 or something close to that.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061208/od_nm/india_condoms_size_dc EW DELHI (Reuters) - Condoms designed to meet international size specifications are too big for many Indian men as their penises fall short of what manufacturers had anticipated, an Indian study has found. ADVERTISEMENT The Indian Council of Medical Research, a leading state-run center, said its initial findings from a two-year study showed 60 percent of men in the financial capital Mumbai had penises about 2.4 cm (one inch) shorter than those condoms catered for. For a further 30 percent, the difference was at least 5 cm (two inches). A poor fit meant the prophylactics often didn't do the job they were bought for, and led to some tearing or slipping off during use. "One of the reasons for a failure of up to 20 percent (of condoms) is the association of the size of the condom to the erect penis," the council's Dr. Chander Puri told Reuters, adding another reason was couples often put them on in a hurry. Puri said many men in India, which has the world's highest HIV positive caseload, were too shy to ask for condoms. "We need more vending machines for condoms of different sizes so people can pick a condom with confidence that is suited to their needs," he said. The Times of India reported the ICMR survey had studied 1,400 men between 18-50 years of age in cities like Mumbai and New Delhi as well as in rural areas in a report. It entitled its story "Indian men don't measure up." ________________________________________________________________ The rumor is that Stalin wanted condoms for his troops during WW2. Roosevelt directed that the largest condom available in the US be made and packaged with the words "small" on it , then sent over to the Soviets.

Poor kid, sad shes paying for her parents - an others - poor judgement. http://www.wftv.com/news/10496730/detail.html Girl Mauled By Captive Cougar At Children's Birthday Party POSTED: 3:21 pm EST December 8, 2006 CORAL GABLES, Fla. -- A 4-year-old girl was mauled at a children's birthday party by a cougar that had been brought in by a wild-animal business to entertain the youngsters, authorities said. The girl was attacked on Nov. 18 at the home of Goya Foods president Francisco Unanue during a party for his 7-year-old child and suffered severe cuts to her eyelid, cheek and ear, authorities said. Doctors sewed back part of her severed ear. Police said Wild Animal World owner and trainer Corinne Oltz removed the leashed cougar from its cage to show it to the children, but the girl sneaked behind Oltz and startled the animal. The declawed cat took the child's head with her teeth. The 62-pound cougar was destroyed last week so that it could be tested for rabies; it did not have rabies. State wildlife officials said Friday they were considering charges against Wild Animal World, a company that provides wild animals for parties. Wild Animal World, which has run afoul the law in some previous attacks, did not immediately return a call for comment. The attack was videotaped by a man hired to film the party, authorities said. Wild Animal World's Web site says it offers a "wide variety of educational, exciting and professional interaction with exotic animals." A one-hour birthday show costs $270. The company's animals include Charlie the ringtail lemur, Popeye the anteater and Cookie the Guyanese porcupine. Oltz was cited for a wildlife cage violation in a similar attack in 1999, court records showed. In 2001, a Wild Animal World leopard attacked a child at a company picnic. Oltz received probation for wildlife-possession violations, records showed. Unanue's lawyer did not immediately return a call Friday.

Anyone interested in hearing about my new "pet sitting" business? We'll take yer dawg or cat off yer hands and you go right on out foer the vacation of yer dreams.

You assholes. ____________________________________________- There was no penetration. Swear to God. We wuz jus sleepin. I swear. Tryin to stay warm and all. BTW Goddamit, that wasn't me with the duck either. or the chicken......... Christ.

XL only damnit. Hey Ivan, great harness dude!

3hours later they have none but are advertising the "Spy Clint Sunglasses", Named after Clint Eastwood, for $28.90

Yeah. Add Dwight Bishop to the list. I can't hear Metalicas Unforgivin with out having my palms sweating now. So rare - that ability to cut loose like that.

Took the words right out of my mouth. Thanks for the different persepctive Pope (and raindawg), but if I could figure out which city they are talking about, I'd probably go. Mike Volk is a pretty good guy.

Guilty!

Absofrigganloutly, bet it rides plush too. How much time and money do you think you have in it e?

oh ohohohoh how the hell did I forget Ivan, dudes TRs may occasionally be the best writing on the planet. Not this planet mind you..... Dwayner/raindawg too can light up a post.

Just got my very first Neutrino 11-23. Someone had bailed by wrapping a sling on a big chockstone stuck back in the chimney on like @P4 of Epinephrine, and rapped on a single Neutrino. Unlike John, who truely only wanted to learn more on that route and that pitch so was trying to fish the person out as it's so rarely done, I am just chestbeating. Wish I could get my wide ass up Girth Pillar.

You dudes aren't even going to make the pretense of climbng first, gonna just hit it.

P-l-e-a-s-e-e-e-e-e ____________________________________________________ KG, hey, they make that film stuff in color now. Is that Kunza?

Hmmm: do I get a runner up point for this one? "Heinrich Himmler speaking on October 6, 1943 to a meeting of Gauleiters and Reichsleiters in Poznam. The quote was recorded by Erich Goldhagen "I must ask you only to listen to what I tell you in this group and never to speak about it. We were asked: What about the women and children? I made up my mind to find a clear solution here too. You see, I did not feel I had a right to exterminate the men -- i.e. kill them or have them killed -- while allowing the children to grow up and take revenge upon our sons and grandsons. We had to reach the difficult decision of makeing this nation vanish from the face of the earth." Blessed be the lord that Himmler worshipped.

Dru would be number 1, but he waters down the good stuff with a bunch of other stuff in between. Donnybaker is high on the list, Iain has good posts under a few Avatars as well. Arc isn't on the list but sometimes Kevbone is and Dan Forester too when he's awake. For interesting reality, Wayne, Layton, John and a few others too who are not as prolific bring the whole package of great climbing pics and interesting text all over the place. Theres a bunch of people posting under assumed and hidden names who bring it occasionally: like Glassbonghits and Seagul: he's on that list sometimes and others too.

Get better? Damn, I can't wait cause that stuff is great.