billcoe

Glad you guys worked it out. Now we shall soldier on, think it over, and Endeavor to Persevere.

I suspect that it is the closet thing to world class we have here for BMXers. Bicyclists have been offroading for decades around the Butte too. I noticed that the last time the X games came through, @ a year back, after the performance had ended, a couple of trailers showed up (in front of the complaining woman's house no doubt) with a bunch of sick world class riders just having a total ball. These kinds of activities and places are irreplaceable and great for the cities reputation as an outdoor mecca. Maybe they can just move those massive jumps back in the woods a tad along the freeway. I've seen just regular guys launching and doing crazy full back flips on bicycles there. I suspect that having a road for ambulance access may be a mandatory requirement. Hope they don't shut that down.

Serious Suncups! The pic was worth the wait, bet you left yer skis at home or in the car!

Yeah, what Dave says. Mostly it rained here today, you missed it Ivan.

Yes I do: a very good friend of mine did it. I wasn't there when it happened although I think others were, but he has been very well spoken and constant on his position on this issue, and about everyone else is in agreement. He will tell you that he doesn't own it either, but that these things are for future generations. One of the things I really appreciate about him is that more than almost any other person I know, he'll do things for future generations, and make those considerations on even little things and small choices. Very unselfish and not a self-serving person. VERY. As far as bolts go, he does want a aid line up the center, where bolts would intersperse hook moves, again this is for others: so that the next generation of climbers have a place to train for aid and try and get tuned for Yosemite while Beacon is closed. This stuff isn't about "Him and his trip" as he'd say, or "me and my trip", but about all of us, and especially those who will come later when we are gone. Those who know me well know a few things as it relates to this discussion very clearly Kevin. 1st) I am pretty damn lackadaisical about bolts for the most part. LINK Maybe you recognize your words? 2nd) I'm not perfect, sooo far from it in fact. 3nd) I am a fiercely loyal person to my friends. Especially good friends. You might read #3 again as it takes precedence over all else for me in this instance. The fella who chopped them turned me on to that place. I am very appreciative of that. At that time he was very specific of what he wanted for the area and he asked me to buy in. Much of what I put in the opening paragraphs to the route list to the place was either a word for word echo or verbatim from him, and this is what that says: " This place is unique and different from The Ozone. One thing which differentiates it is the restraint of bolts. Although there are a few bolted routes here and there, it could have been possible to put in a bolted route every few feet. Yet it was desired that this area remain like a more traditional climbing area, where folks could learn and practice with gear. This gives the place a different feel than a bolted area, and it's good spot to develop a "lead head" and learn real technical rock climbing. Please help keep it this way for future climbers and restrict the use of bolts. As of today, all the routes on the main cliff to the right of Dwarf Toss to the Eastern trail have been done. Blank faces between the cracks were left as toprope climbs on purpose. There are multiple top ropes and route variations throughout the area, some of which are described and some of which are not. Although this area should not have any “Do Nots”, please DO NOT think that just because there are no bolts stuck in a face, that by putting in bolts you are doing a first ascent and a new route. You are not. It's a small area and nearly every inch that does not have loose rock has been climbed. What you are doing is sticking bolts into an area that was looked at, climbed on, and left alone intentionally (it did not have bolts installed on purpose) by earlier climbers. It was left that way for a specific reason by those many climbers who were here first, often after extensive discussion amongst themselves about it. That means it was left as a toprope climb, on purpose, to try and avoid the gym climbing mentality. If you have just come of of the gym and don't know your head from your ass, here is an ancient, involatile rule to get you started and which all climbers should follow: NEVER PUT BOLTS IN SOMEONE ELSE'S ROUTE WITHOUT THEIR PERMISSION FIRST! If you plan on putting in bolts in opposition and disagreement to what all the previous climbers who have and continue to climb here, despite what they all thought and/or think, then plan on having your “new” bolts quickly removed and your alleged route erased. You may want it to look like the climbing gym, but those who came here before you do not. If the static and unchanging nature of this bothers you, dear reader, the suggestion is that you head back to the nearest gym, where you can screw in new holds and bolts and change the routes to your liking and feelings of the day without bothering others. This place can remain for those who appreciate the deeper and different challenge of natural gear lines, and Ozone for those who seek out bolt clip ups. The one piece of kit all climbers will benefit from carrying here is a small whisk broom. These can often be had for a buck at the dollar tree stores, so get some for you buddies when you're there. If everyone just whisked a bit here and a bit there pretty soon the entire area would be as clean as your kitchen counter....perhaps cleaner." Did you read it all? ...hope that helps you. Remember that although I'm nowhere close to perfect I am one loyal son-of-a-bitch. The text seems clear to me and although some of it doesn't apply, the desire to leave it as a primarily natural gear area does stick out does it not? Again, this was and is my friends most deepest wish for the area. One he is not alone in wishing. Black and white, cut and dried. Know also that my friend is pretty specific that he thinks this internet stuff is total bullshit, and that sitting down and having a fair fist fight (OK, I think he means talk eye to eye: just like we all did on this very issue, the chopper, choppee and myself all did just that yesterday as we were all out there at the same time) is the way to solve these things. So he feels bad that he had to do this - but saw no other alternative. I know everyone wishes that the communication had been better, I sure do, but that's the hand that was dealt. Either what he and others have always wanted for the place remains there - or it wouldn't and a bolted line would get squeeze jobbed in where it shouldn't be. Frankly, I'm doing some new bolted routes at another area that has no cracks and where bolted squeeze jobs will be welcomed. But that a long way away, radically different rock, and necessarily a totally different vibe. I think it's important to recognize that here we are talking only about preserving this location for mostly gear climbs. Plenty of places to bolt routes in the gorge elsewhere, I've enjoyed climbing at some of them myself. So in respect to my old buddy, this is all I have to say on this subject on the internets.

Hola Troy! Hope law school is treating you well these days!

That last bit of pro in that pic or the very first picture tips us off:-) ps, it looks like a human in that first pic, but it would be easy to miss with a cursory glance! W00T! You Dane?

Yes, it's been 95% this:

Fap fap fap!

The top of The Dragons Spine Pinnacle. There is a full 60 meter pitch that gets part way off the ground. Not sideways, but still about 300' off the deck on top. The top picture was taken from the tree between the 2 pinnacles, you can see the tree in the lower picture of the other side in this distance shot. The Old Witch on the left in the sunlight, The Dragons Spine on the right with belays marked with white xx's and oo's (The Old Witch summit). That's the Cathedral Formation out at Gothic Rocks area from the side. I am predicting that The Old Witch will be the most climbed Pinnacle via the currently non-existent route called Bewitched in Oregon within 3 years. Straight up the left side of the left hand pinnacle there....it's in my dreams. Oh yes, she will be mine.....[insert sick fixation picture here] Putting the rap sling on top of the Old Witch last Sept. Hey, I've got some cams left over on the rack! Big shock, esp. since the nearest crack is @ 20 miles away. The profile that shows the Witch's head. Same same but showing where the mouth is.

.....and Patek Phillipes too for under $80! That's much less than $10,000. WooT!

.....but ya have to love the new Clinton Arkansas state quarter. Bush doesn't have his own qtr! ah hah!

I wuz wondering where you'd gotten "Off" too. Good to see all is normal and good.

bill... stfu u big fucking pussy 303 886 5797 if ur feeling like a bad ass I just realized you are gone Andrew. Your last 5 posts were less than 5 min apart yet it's been 5 days since you posted. It's interesting that no one has noted your absence till now. There should be an office pool on if you had an aneurysm, an OD or just a standard flame out. You know who I really miss? Off White? Where's Doug been?

They say this may be truer in California real soon. Keep hope alive.

yes, but much more important! "Keeping Teens Out of Tanning Beds FDA panel meets to discuss stricter regulation of tanning industry." His link should read: "Smear Tactic! Bush Wipes Hand on Clinton" while in Haiti.

It's a real, real nice thing to know how to do. I was leading the overhanging east face of monkey and Bob pulled one of my nuts on the traverse right while following it (clip climbing, not jugging). He had on lots of gear and a pack all of which was pulling him over and near upside down. Trying to just stay upright was/is very very difficult, while putting on a temp. chest harness/biner as described will immediacy fix that for ya. 2 shoulder length slings just girth together is the right size and works great as well as a doubled runner in case anyone is reading this who is unfamiliar with this thing.

Wouldn't that be called a homemade chest harness?

1 word, 1 word for the graduate: Gmail ps, 2nd word: Goodluck!

Interesting report on a series of coincidences wherein various militant Arab leaders seem to have substantially shortened life spans ending in bloody death attributed to Israel right after an Al Jerezza (AKA Al-Jazirah, Al's Jisum) interview. translated from http://www.elaph.com/ http://cryptome.org/0001/al-jazirah-hits.htm " Report on Al-Jazirah TV's Suspected Role in Killing, Arrest of Activists Report by Mahmud al-Awadi: "There Are Questions on Assassinations That Take Place After Interviews Conducted by Al-Jazirah. Al-Rantisi, Al-Mabhuh, Siyam, Shaikh, Binalshibh, and Rigi Appeared on Al-Jazirah" Ilaf.com Friday, February 26, 2010 T12:31:29Z Journal Code: 9469 Language: ENGLISH Record Type: FULLTEXT Document Type: OSC Translated Text [OSC is the CIA's Open Source Center, formerly the Foreign Broadcast Information Service (FBIS)] Word Count: 2,269 Many assassinations or arrest of prominent figures happen after interviews, which the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel conducts with these figures. These incidents have raised many questions. Large Arab circles that are interested in political and media affairs no longer have to believe the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel's justification that the assassination and arrest of political, security, and military activists around the world happen by sheer coincidence. Dubai: The assassination of Abdolmalek Rigi, head of the Sunni Jundallah Group, raised questions again within circles that are interested in linking a possible vague role by the Qatari Al-Jazirah satellite Television to the assassination and arrest of political and security activists directly after they finish interviews with the Qatari television. The Al-Jazirah satellite Channel began its transmission late in 1996 creating at the time a great deal of controversy and media uproar and chaos, which, many times, caused political estrangement between Doha that hosts the satellite channel and several Arab and foreign states, which held the view that the television's coverage was biased and not innocent. Doha says it does not interfere in the satellite channel's work. However, it was noticed that the Gulf Emirate intervened at serious junctures to direct, dismiss, or re-form the satellite channel's boards of directors. But the most important question remains: Was Al-Jazirah truly involved in very suspicious matters, as a long list of proofs shows? Large Arab circles that are interested in political and media affairs no longer have to believe the Qatari Al-Jazirah satellite Channel's justification that the assassinations and arrests among political, security, and military activists around the world in general and in the Arab region in particular happened by sheer coincidence. The reason is that logic says a perfect coincidence does not happen in this suspicious way where it is difficult to ignore the connection between an interview conducted by the Qatari satellite channel and the arrest or assassination of those who gave these interviews. One may be convinced that such incidents can happen by coincidence once or twice. However, when they become a phenomenon, they must be considered carefully to dot the i's and cross the t's regarding the Qatari satellite channel's performance and ambiguous role. This is because many Arab circles view the Qatari channel with extreme doubt that sometimes reaches the point of accusation. To date, the channel has refused to give a convincing justification of the ambiguous incidents that happen to those who it hosts. Ilaf asked political analyst Salim Jum'ah for his view of the ongoing talk and the charges against the Qatari satellite channel. He said: It is absolutely not possible any longer to separate the arrest or assassination of activists from the fact that they were hosted by the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel. The reason is that Arab intelligence agencies have information indicating that the Qatari channel presses those who it seeks to interview. When it reaches a deadlock, it resorts to the use of financial incentives to persuade the guests who mostly avoid the media for security reasons. They do not want to appear in the media to avoid being pursued and caught through assassination or arrest. There is a very long list of proofs in this respect. Jum'ah added: It is very strange that these activists disappear many years without appearing in the media. During this period, they enjoy complete security, and even professional intelligence agencies that pursue them day and night fail to catch them. But, a little interview with the Qatari satellite channel easily leads to their arrest. As is clear to date, the latest victim of the Qatari satellite channel is leader of the Sunni Jundallah Group Abdolmalek Rigi who was tracked by the Pakistani intelligence agencies even though he hid in Islamabad. He made a short appearance on the Al-Jazirah Channel's "Today's Meeting" Program. Afterward, Pakistan handed him over to Iran, which wanted him dead or alive for his responsibility for bloody attacks on Iranian installations because he rejects the mullahs regime in Tehran. His group's latest attack almost liquidated high-level military commanders of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. His arrest was an astonishing victory for Tehran, which had been looking for him relentlessly. It attempted to catch him several times, but he always managed to escape from the Iranian intelligence service, which did not give up the hope of arresting him. It is certain that Rigi will be put on mock trial that will soon order his execution. According to Jum'ah, the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel's interview with the mastermind of the attacks of 11 September 2001 Khalid Shaikh Mohammed led to his arrest. Khalid Shaikh Mohammed appeared together with his very important aide, Ramzi Binalshibh, on the channel's "Top Secret" Program, which was presented by Egyptian journalist Yusri Fudah. Afterward, Fudah resigned from the Qatari satellite channel for reasons that are unknown to date. With their faces covered, the two men recounted what they termed the road to the invasion of Washington and Manhattan, in a reference to the targeting of the World Trade Center's Twin Towers and the US Defense Department headquarters (the Pentagon). A few days after the Al-Jazirah Channel broadcast the program, Pakistani intelligence forces surrounded the place where both Shaikh and Binalshibh were hiding in one of the villages of Islamabad. Afterward, they handed the two men over to the United States, which considered them a very precious catch. Later, the United States rewarded Islamabad in many spheres during the rule of former Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf. However, following the spread of information indicating that senior leaders of the Al-Qa'ida Organization were very angry and that they held the Qatari satellite channel responsible for the arrest of Shaikh and Binalshibh, the Qatari satellite channel, through mediators, justified the action to the senior leaders of that hard-line fundamentalist organization whose followers are pursued around the world. The Qatari Al-Jazirah television channel said that the Pakistani intelligence personnel may have followed its correspondent Yusri Fudah during his travel to complete the recording of the program, and that Shaikh and Binalshibh may have been arrested after the intelligence personnel found out that they were in the same place to where Fudah went. The Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel said the airing of the program was an indication that Fudah did meet with Shaikh and Binalshibh at that location, and that is the reason why the place was raided. At the time, Al-Jazirah focused forcefully on its justifications that appeared closer to a public apology. Political analyst Salim Jum'ah says: After the incidents of Rigi, Shaikh, and Binalshibh, came the assassination of Mahmud al-Mabhuh, a prominent military leader in the Palestinian HAMAS Movement, in a hotel in the Emirate of Dubai in the UAE. After this assassination, an impression prevailed among Arab parties that there is something suspicious and it cannot be ignored any longer. This is especially true in light of the fact that Al-Mabhuh, whose facial features were known only to the very few people who were very close to him, appeared unexpectedly without a face cover on the Al-Jazirah Satellite Channel. He spoke in length about an operation that he carried out in the 80s of the past century, an operation that shocked Israel when he captured and liquidated two soldiers. According to sources close to HAMAS, Al-Mabhuh was asked by higher commanders why he appeared without a mask and spoke in detail about the military operation that he carried out. In reply to the question, he said that the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel's team pressed him hard to appear without a mask. The Qatari satellite channel told Al-Mabhuh before the interview that its viewers may accuse it of fabricating interviews. Therefore, he has to first appear without a mask and then speak in detail to ensure that there will be no accusation that the content of the interview was fabricated too. The HAMAS sources say that Al-Jazirah seemed as if it was preparing for something other than journalism and ethics of the profession. It seemed that Al-Jazirah sought to show his features to those who were interested in pursuing him, establish his identity, and confirm his admission that he killed Israelis. Then, the Israeli intelligence agencies would have to liquidate him physically. As political analyst Jum'ah says, the targeting of the former commander in chief of HAMAS, Abd-al-Aziz al-Rantisi, is still recalled when the long series of proofs is mentioned. It is reported that Al-Rantisi trusted the Al-Jazirah team in the Gaza Strip and fixed a date to give them an interview many days after he disappeared from public view after HAMAS elected him as commander in chief to succeed the movement's spiritual father, Ahmad Yasin, who was killed by an Israeli missile in March 2003. For 25 days, Al-Jazirah kept pressing people close to Al-Rantisi to persuade him to give a lengthy interview in which he would discuss his new responsibilities at the helm of the Palestinian movement. After their insistence, he agreed to give them a preliminary date in his home, which he had not visited since the assassination of Yasin. When he finished the interview with Al-Jazirah, felt an emotion to see his family, and was about to leave the place, Israeli missiles killed him immediately. Afterward, the movement's leaders who were based abroad asked a lot of questions whether the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel had anything to do with the assassination of Al-Rantisi. However, HAMAS chose not to exaggerate the story with Al-Jazirah because it wanted Al-Jazirah to be its media forum at later stages. Political analyst Salim Jum'ah points out that the same story of the targeting of Al-Rantisi after his interview with Al-Jazirah recurred with the interior minister in the deposed HAMAS government, Sa'id Siyam, during the Israeli war on the Gaza Strip last year. Siyam was good at disguising. He oversaw the endorsement of military plans and ensured internal security in the Gaza Strip in spite of the fierce Israeli shelling at the time. But, as soon as Siyam finished recording an interview with the Al-Jazirah Channel and the television team departed, Israel killed Siyam in a bombardment that did not seem indiscriminate at the time. However, because Israel killed Siyam soon afterward, Al-Jazirah preferred not to air the interview to date, in an effort to avoid more evidences and proofs. Employees of Al-Jazirah say that the interview with Siyam was ready to be broadcast, but instructions from higher echelons froze the interview. Thus, it was not aired. The information available to these employees indicates that what happened with Siyam was expected to happen with the prime minister of the deposed government, Isma'il Haniyah, and prominent leading figure Mahmud al-Zahhar who vehemently rejected any interview with the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel under Israeli bombardment. They made promises many times to give interviews when the war ends. They always said that they were busy following the land battles with Israel and continuously assessing the situation. Nevertheless, this information has not been confirmed by an independent party. In addition, it is not known whether Haniyah and Al-Zahhar knew about the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel's harbored intention. According to political analyst Salim Jum'ah, the arrest of Rigi today sounds the alarm bell for all activists across the world telling them to reconsider any decisions they might take to give interviews to the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel. To date, this channel has not presented any convincing justification of what happens soon after its interviews are aired. Moreover, it recently began to ignore any questions raised in the Arab circles on the recent incidents. Many obscure activists have been arrested in Arab and foreign states, and the thing that linked all these incidents was a contact with the Al-Jazirah Channel to inform it of some issues. After the contact, the callers were surprised by immediate calls from the television's teams asking them about their places of residence so that they may be able to reach them. However, those who reached them in the end were intelligence agency personnel who pursued and failed to find them in the past. But it became easy to reach them after they made a contact with the Qatari Al-Jazirah Channel. It is recalled that the Qatari Al-Jazirah satellite Channel began its transmission at the end of October 1996, creating large uproar that was closer to media chaos at the time, as political analyst Jum'ah put it. Many times, the channel's programs deliberately offended Arab states and governments directly, including ruling regimes in more than one Arab country. Such offences repeatedly caused political estrangement between the state of Qatar in which the channel is based and many Arab states, including Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Tunisia, and Iraq. On the other hand, several Arab writers said that the Al-Jazirah Channel's performance is more like the method of driving a wedge, fomenting sedition, causing chaos, and triggering security disturbances in several Arab countries." (Description of Source: London Ilaf.com in Arabic -- Saudi-owned, independent Internet daily with pan-Arab, liberal line. URL: http://www.elaph.com/)

Too much needless name calling. We should all remember that we shouldn't think people don't care just because they don't think like us. Well spoken sir. It sadly won't happen, those who try to rise above the 2nd grade level of discourse here seem to get shouted down and buried in name calling by ignoramuses.

May the good lord bless all of Charlie Browns descendants and may they all prosper and live long life's. Dude was more than a good man, they don't make many like him any more and we are all the worse for it. Bless them all! __________________________________________________________ - careful with that sauce, "spicy" is way too mild word to call that stuff. Good food, :tup: when they are open. ________________________________________________________________ Too expensive for what you get IMO.

The Soloist works great for toproping laps Steve. Need a chest harness they say, and that is a little screwy though. I'd choose another device for leading, as this one won't lock if the fall is inverted. I've taken an inverted lead fall (not with a Solist thank God), and it's not something you can plan well -it just happens. Soloist.

Hopefully you remember what they look like and catch them later. The exact same thing happened to my friend Kelly Warden, Silver Bullet as well, years ago. He caught them on top and read them the riot act. In 1986 Talbot Bielfelt wrote an article for Outside magazine in which he detailed some interesting encounters, one of which involved some kids starting to unclip my shit a few years previous. That stuff has been happening for years. I only got up to the Butte @ 5 times last year. I'm hoping for more this year. Probably be Tuesday and Thurs evenings, although I get kind of sore enough that once a week is enough. Maybe just Tuesdays. Last night I got up and used a regular GriGri to do a TR lap on Birds of Paradise. I don't know if it was because I'm out of shape or it's early in the season, but I felt somewhat stilted. I quit after one trip up, and the whole time on route I was thinking of your story and also had that visual of the kids starting to unclip my stuff and it all played in my head all the way up. The wired nuts I carried so as to be able to get a piece in if that very thing happened seemed small consolation. I did a single non-flowing lap and gave up and went and bouldered. Soooo, just wanted to thank you for the visual:-) ps, I'm resolved to spray the poison oak on top of and inside the Wisdom Tooth crack (next route west from Birds) and wipe it out. Anyone who doesn't like it (Cough* Larry * Cough *) get yer ass up there and pull it out. I hit it on top last fall and got 96% of it. I won't get to it right away so you have time, but that route will be climbable this year - I'm committed to it. If you do jump on that route, and it's a great one: one of the best there if you're a 5.11 climber, closely watch the death flake that looks like a massive 3-4' sized ear with a rurp crack straight through it @ 40 feet up as it might finally choose this year to pull off. Last time I was on that one, it slightly wiggled, and with some freeze thaw action it's probably close to pulling off. Furthermore, and not to cause anyone to mess their panties - the woman who lives in the closest house had assured Sean and I 3-4 years back that the whole cliff is actually moving there, so I'd back those chains up with a tight rope to a stout tree, don't know if that would help if the cliff goes though. We looked at it carefully at the time and didn't see evidence of it. Figure it's not shaking off in an earthquake it's probably not going anywhere. Take care all

Well, we know which President sent it back to Britan anyway: INITIALS ARE BO -LINK