scott_harpell

is this the litmus test? i think we should hold ourselves to a higher standard than to the average climbers opinion whose rationality is tainted by their selfish need to climb something no matter what the cost. or perhaps it is their need to see their names in print. and rudy... i dont give a shit what they climb. if i can climb 5.15 can i carve my name in the rock and 'tag' the base? because this is exactly what we are doing when we put up routes for self glorification. no matter what, we are glorifying ourselves by altering the rock rather than glorifying nature which is the reason i like to climb, hike, etc. Mabe i am making this stand alone(probably) but i dont like the idea of bolted climbs period. i also dont think how well a person climbs should decide whether they have the authority to dictate my experience in the outdoors. we all have a say whether you climb 5.15 or 5.5 or even if you dont clmib at all because other people use these areas for other purposes too. mabe i just have a different understanding of the outdoors. i also feel that the muir hut (and especially the RMI hut) should be taken out. later kids.

another way to look at this is that without overbolters, there would be no bolt yankers. true bolt-cops exacerbate the situation, but the situation is created by people with too much bloody money and not enough action.

ignorance is no excuse. doesn't work with the law. "mister officer! i didn't know that you aren't allowed to drive on the shoulder in grid-lock traffic!" riiiiight

oil is old school. you wont catch me using it.

mt. kenya is beautiful... i would like to hop on one of those ice routes, but i hear they are dissapearing fast.

first of all it is a flake. right above the bottom bolt is a bomber nut/ tcu placement and even a pod for dru's tri-cams. well shit we might have to bolt libra crack as it si in danger of expanding same with city park... granite is sketchyyyyy! edit: also nice looking nut placement to teh right of the second bolt. if the flake is as sketchy and chossy as you say, why would you wanna climb it.

nah man! keep up with the ethics of the area! its a gnar-gnar mixed route.

sport climbers beware!

where is that?!? if a bolt gets chopped at a crag, and there is no-one there to hear it...

me too. i have another semester. just for one class. i thought i was done.

put your kilts on and grab your tools!

Mmm i am in a film class right now. gotta love wireless internet. uninhibited spray potential. everyone here concurs that movie is the shits, so is the director.

I concur. QT is over-rated but still entertaining. somebody tell that to the dumbass film majors that i am in school with. they are spoiled little rich kids with director's cuts dvd's and have nothing so say. they are like 6 year olds with 144 different colors of crayons. tarentino is one of them. just copies everything from every cinematographer of note and casts it off as his.

fo shizzle!

howdy y'all. wonderin what the consensus is on bolting TR'able climbs. seems unnecessary dontchya think?

top-roping.

get laid punter.

nor do i, but it seems with each generation, ethics are being watered down more and more. i just see the pattern and i do not like what i see. i dont like the idea of bolts period, but the extrapolation i see is that it is getting out of control. it is ludicrous at 38. how long until it hit other areas with more tradition. we have already seen this started with the repeated bolting of Dan's Dreadful Direct and other arguably historic climbs, or climbs in areas with strong low bolt or anti-bolt ethic.

i am glad tho' that i am not hangin' with the family. everytime it ends up as a discussion as to why i am not married. What? Why aren't you married yet? Wait till you are 35 at least. 34 was definately too young. whew! that means i have 13 years to climb uninhibited by the fairer sex! no arguements here!

so bolting does seem to be getting progressively worse? perhaps kassidy's predictions are not too far off. you have quoted europe as a place where bolts and hikers co-exist because of aesthitic relativity, but there are also post WWII via ferrata routes in europe. this is the same phenomenon that kassidy predicted. as you have admitted, bolting is becomming more and more problematic as we dumb down the rock to our level. when will this degredation of the rock and of our sense of duty to nature cease? when we have wheelchair access shitter at the top of every former grade VI that is now a 4 hour 'cable' route?

matt, i am curious what side of the fence you are chillin on as per climbers impact then and now. you make statements which allude to both sides. the quote above seems to suggest that the 'golden' years did not have such a problem or it was not so prevalent.

Yeah...you can't see bolts from the road - especially if they're powder coated, but you can see the cleaned off rock "trail" and ensuing chalk marks. To me the visual impact of all are related. exactly. so why not try to minimalize where we can? i do not use chalk ever because of this very reason. every activity has an impact to some extent (especially in nature) and it is our responsibility to minimalize this in every way we can. i am drinking beer in order to consume less freshwater keep the power brotha! did you read that west van. residents use more water than anywhere else in the world? i think i will help you save the world on beer at a time. but i only have one more granville island winter ale left

hey kids! no name calling! keep the spray in spray!