sayjay

OMFG that's hysterical .... then again, maybe it's just really scarry

sk - you could be right. if so, here's a few for lhotse in apology: erik - you're only saying that so that next time you'll be able to flatter me out of taking the "big wall" rack

that's cool, 'bone. i was mostly having fun with you ya know... just found l.d.'s need to *twice* point out her annoyance at my "feminism" kinda humorous

quote: lambone: If it had been with one of my regular (ie. experienced male) climbing partners, no we would have never considered calling. sayjay: an experienced female wouldn't do the trick, eh.... damn, you're right, that's some pretty hard-hitting feminist rhetoric, lhotse dreems shit, have a drink and lighten up, girl! just reminding these hard-boys that not all us chicks need to be taken care of in the mountains...

chris, what the hell IS that in your icon pic!?!?!

a bold move, jimmyleg, starting a thread on your first post! you'll fit in well around here... welcome! (oh, and just ignore the local idiots )

quote: If it had been with one of my regular (ie. experienced male) climbing partners, no we would have never considered calling. an experienced female wouldn't do the trick, eh....

quote: lambone said: We did notice high wispy clouds blowing in, but they looked non threatening. They were probably a sign of the changing preasure system, but we didn't know how to interpret that. ...and I said: FYI, the appearance of broad, high, cirrus ("whispy") clouds is very often the first visible sign of an incoming weather system in this area...best bet is to assume bad weather will start to roll in in the next 3-6 hours. let me qualify this a bit: if you see broken up cirrus clouds, it probably doesn't mean much, especially if they are intermittent / coming and going. if you see a pretty solid "line" or wall of cirrus coming towards you and the wind is picking up, probably bad weather is coming in. certainly if you are in the mountains it is best to assume this is the case, even if the forecast was for decent weather. if the height of the cirrus deck is descending with time as well this is a pretty sure-fire sign you've got weather coming in. how long before the weather comes in depends on the wind speed but if you want to be safe i'd assume 3-6 hours. as to the question of where the forecasters went wrong.... i just asked one of the forecasting gurus in the UW atmos sci dept and the gist of it is this: - there really was no big storm that came through. - what did come through on sunday then again monday were two very weak fronts - the forecast for sunday was for nicer weather than what we got because the airmass that hit us on sunday was both cooler and moister than they thought it would be, so instead of broken clouds we got thick clouds. the conditions were very similar to what you might expect on a typical winter day (only warmer), with clearing on the east side and everything. unfortunately, we don't have a lot of instruments offshore measuring the air temp and moisture content so sometimes the air is carrying a lot more moisture than you'd think by looking at other indicators. a few thoughts: 1) forecasting in the pac nw is very difficult -- because small changes in the location of the jet stream can drastically alter the weather; because we have so little data (relative to other parts of the country) about the air upstream of us; because of mountain effects...to name a few reasons -- and we should go into the mountains prepared for bad weather no matter what, even in the summer. 2) forecasts, even for the mountains, are not really geared to 10,000'. the mtn forecasts look at what they expect at 4,000 or 5,000'. the winds lambone and co. encountered at the summit of glacier were not surprising, if you'd looked at a model forecast for that altitude. 3) for a multi-day trip such as lambone's you're forced to look at 3-4 day forecasts, which are vastly less reliable than a 1-2 day forecast. decisions made on day 3 or 4 of a trip should take into account that the weather may not be at all what was forecast. in this case, by saturday they were actually forecasting pretty heavy cloud cover for sunday (at least here in atmos sci they were; i don't know what whopplerdopplerman was saying...). none of this is meant to slam lambone on decisions that were made. just trying to squeeze some learning from his experience- hope this is helpful to someone and not just a bunch of geek-drivel! [ 07-31-2002, 03:03 PM: Message edited by: sayjay ]

quote: We did notice high wispy clouds blowing in, but they looked non threatening. They were probably a sign of the changing preasure system, but we didn't know how to interpret that. FYI, the appearance of broad, high, cirrus ("whispy") clouds is very often the first visible sign of an incoming weather system in this area...best bet is to assume bad weather will start to roll in in the next 3-6 hours. A good lesson/reminder for all of us- Glad you all made it back safe n sound! [ 07-31-2002, 02:00 PM: Message edited by: sayjay ]

when i came down it i wish i had a paraglider

someone posted last week that it was tacoma's turn... t-town folks: are enuf of you going to show up that it should be down there? if so, what venue?

because some day i'm gonna see this view in person...

the hubba and i went into cathedral, also from the chewuch rd., a couple of years ago in late august. stayed at the mine the first night. woke up on day #2 to rain so we hiked up to a lake above and across from the mine -- gorgeous -- and caught some wee small trout. next day did the short hike over to the cathedral area, which like erik said is not very far. but if i were you i'd bring lots of water 'cause you'll loose it all to DROOL as you view cathedral and surrounding rock on the way to the lakes! woke up the next day to cold, wet weather and the day after that to a snow storm. so spent the time catching an eatting trout and hiking around the area. really beautiful. one hell of a long way to haul climbing gear and not use it, but worth the trip anyhow. hiked out via rampart lake, running into one crusty old dude on a horse with a shotgun looking for his lost horses along the way. it's a longer way out but even with all the extra weight it was worth it. stunning high country. HAVE A GREAT TIME and don't forget to post a TR when you get back!

Thanks everyone! I was hoping to get a few ideas for places I haven't been before and that's what I got. Oh, and recovery is going well (thanks figure8!). Hoping to be back on the sharp end in a couple/few weeks

Hey y'all, I'm recovering from surgery and can't yet return to technical climbing but I'm dying to get up in the mountains... and I need to get myself back in shape! Looking for a good day hike. Don't need to reach a summit, but a good amount of altitude gain and a view or two are required. Anyone out there have a favorite -- within a couple hours' drive from Seattle but NOT Mt. Si or Pilchuck!-- to suggest?

quote: "It involves three pitches of chimneying and offwidth climbing. Take a dozen appropriate nuts..." Appropriate?perhaps they were referring to the climbing partners you should bring!

"the means does not justify the ends"...

oh, sorry red monk, you're right, my list was not exhaustive... i wasn't saying that there was no way that the example sk gave would make sense, i was just wondering if in this case it did. but since details cannot be supplied: if there IS pro to be had, just not very good pro, like in flares, should it be bolted? or just left for those w/ the balls to climb on sketchy pro?

quote: sk sez: I know of a place where there are many bolts near cracks because the pro possabilities are AWFUL. if there are cracks, how are the pro possibilities so awful? do you mean loose flakes, not cracks? soft rock? and if it's soft rock, how good could the bolts be? and if the bolts aren't gonna be very good, should they be placed? or should the rock just be left along? not being snide here, just wondering...

I used to be an avid tele skier but had to switch to randonee because my feet got all arthritic on me... I expected to not be as happy with randonee but have come to appreciate some of the advantages. If you plan on backcountry skiing as a means to approach climbs (especially technical climbs) then randonee is nice because it's one heck of a lot easier to do alpine turns with with weight on your back than it is to do tele turns. Also, you can wear plastic mountaineering boots in AT bindings, setting you up nicely for the ice climbing you're skiing in to. Finally, it's one hell of a lot easier to learn to ski randonee than it is to learn tele. On the other hand, if you're going to backcountry ski mostly on day trips or with a lighter pack tele IS a lot more dynamic and fun. Not to mention more impressive when done well!

as long as you don't get the green sauce you're okay...

quote: Is there a difference in the type of ski you should look for? strictly speaking, yes: if you go AT the skis should be stiffer. quote: Are the advantages to buying a real 'Randonee' boot worth it? I imagine it would be better. From what I understand with the Randonee set-up you can either make normal alpine style turns, or you can free the heel and make tele turns if you ever get good enough to actually do it. I skied AT in mountaineering boots for a couple of years and managed just fine, but this year I got true AT boots and YES IT'S WORTH IT. I can still wear my mtneering boots when I'm skiing to approach a climb, but if you want to get out and tear it up skiing the AT boots give you much more support through the ankles/lower calf. And yes, you can make tele turns with AT gear -- I do this at resorts for entertainment and so I actually feel like I've gotten some exercise by the end of the day! -- but it lacks the grace of a true tele turn because you're balancing your rear foot on a pinpoint. Also if you buy AT skis they don't make the tele turn as well at true tele skis... Either way, you'll have lots of fun!!!

i count 3.5, with the 0.5 being climbing at the same crag (several times!) but never on the same rope... but i've scored home runs with the other three. and two of them were erik and mattp! whoohoo!

NICE PIC! I got to see some video footage of a buddy of mine jumping Baffin back in the mid-90's (don't recall the exact year) and I've been wanting to go there ever since -- What a spectacular place.

okay, my 0.02: i'm with mattp all the way. spray is fine, but when taken to the extreme that it seems to (too often) hit around here -- and as mattp points out, often outside of the "spray" forum -- it is not only annoying but, I think, destructive. and i disagree that extreme spray is no different from what goes on in the "real" world. i, for one, have yet to see anyone at a pub club accuse anyone else of having a small penis. if you really need that kind of humor in those volumes become a jr. high school teacher. better yet, just go back as a student. oh, and i also think it falls to the users of this board to encourage others not to unwind to the point of absurdity; there's no reason jon and timmy should be stuck with the job of babysitting. climb on!