Norman_Clyde

From Seattle, the Brothers is the only obviously double-summited peak. It is straight west from downtown, without any other high peaks nearby on the skyline.

I camped just West of the Monte Cristo townsite in early May 1998-- as I recall the snowpack was much lower that year. We really had no idea where we were going to camp before we got there. While we were exploring the townsite and checking out the old railroad turntable, one of the old timer residents came out to say howdy. He was very friendly, and once he found out we were decent sorts, he advised us to camp in a cleared spot in the trees just SW of town. There was even a fire ring. I imagine all this is under snow at this time. But if you're respectful to the natives and not too big a group, you can probably camp anywhere reasonable.

I think Fairweather's point is that those of us who stand for preservation of the wilderness need to keep an eye on the bedrock principles we exercise, and if even a small fringe group stands in favor of destructive action for the sake of wilderness, it erodes the credibility of the entire movement. You might look at what a hard time Yasser Arafat has maintaining his credibility whenever Hamas claims responsibility for another suicide bomb (I know, different context, but I hope you get the point). I agree that some development projects seem to have been defeated simply by wearing down the developers with various forms of non-terrorist harassment. But if you want to be a leader in the moral debate, and you want to keep the public on your side, you should keep your principles very high and not commit some action that you can't justify morally. Eco-terrorists may destroy property with "peaceful" intent, but with this tactic used repeatedly, eventually someone will be hurt or killed as a result, and the whole wilderness preservation movement will have a bloodstain that will be very hard to wash off. Tree sitting is a much more powerful, Gandhi-esque statement than tree spiking, and will gain you a lot more supporters among the otherwise complacent public.

I can't pass up a pub club so close to home, but what if I can't get there until after 8? How long do these events last?

Exactly, I dress for work and my fenders aren't the best, so I only stay "dry" if I keep it slow. One of these days I'll get some better fenders-- or maybe even trade in my vintage 1980s rockhopper for one of those flashy titanium monoshock units at Gregg's. But I'd rather buy climbing gear than spend fifteen hundred bucks just to cut my commute down to 2 minutes.

One mile round trip. (There is one tricky intersection, though.) I bike to work most days and also ride home for lunch. Of course, today I drove because it was a little wet. Maybe I'll switch to the bike for the afternoon-- does that count?

TG, when you perform this direct technique, you set up an anchor/prusik system first, right? (I have this picture of myself trying this system, then slipping and getting pulled right in after my partner.) If you do, then you would definitely need a 3rd partner to attend the prusik, since you would not be staying in one place while you haul. Also, I'm having trouble visualizing the C within a Z. Or is this just adding one more zigzag?

That is my point also: a 5.11 one-pitch leader might be unaccustomed to the exposure and weather considerations, but if he/she's got reasonably good judgment, he'll be an alpine climber soon enough. How are you gonna keep 'em down in Texas after they've seen the Cascades?

For those of you wondering how a person can be a consistent 5.11 trad climber and be uncertain about his skills on an easy alpine ascent like Ingalls: try living in central Texas sometime. I started out climbing while living in Dallas, and we used to drive 90 miles just to get to Mineral Wells State Park, which had a small area of 20 foot cliffs that crawled with centipedes, daddy longlegs and copperheads. The closest multipitch climbing was the Ouichita Mts. in Oklahoma, 4 hours from Dallas and more like 7 or 8 from Austin. A 5.11 gym climber would probably feel intimidated on Ingalls, but Philih, if you've had to do any routefinding at all, you should not have a problem. Take 2 or 3 days and grab Stuart West Ridge while you're at it!

Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa. I am aware that a bergschrund is technically where the head of a glacier separates from its headwall, due to actual movement of the entire glacier rather than settling of the snowpack. (I'm talking about my 4/27 post re:Chair.) But I figured that "bergschrund" was more descriptive, while technically incorrect. I should have known I would never get away with this linguistic infraction, not with you glaciologists checking up on me.

Good for you guys. I called the forest service a few months ago, and they told me the road was washed out 6 miles from the end. I thought the Constance trail was about a mile before the road end, so I was figuring on about ten extra miles for this climb-- but 7 miles is not as bad, still maybe shorter than starting at Tunnel Creek. The rangers also said that the washout was so deep it was unsafe even to climb into it, much less haul a mountain bike. Sounds like you guys did not have difficulty crossing. Is it possible to haul a bike across?

My axe will probably be playing hide and seek until later in the spring. I strapped it back on right below the gully, so if it fell off early then you all would have gone right past it. Not much point in looking until more summery conditions prevail.

I lost my Glencoe Walker axe up high in Chair Peak basin yesterday. It must have fallen off my pack while I did a low-angle glissade using my poles for a brake. I had used a wimpy Velcro loop to hold it because the original loop on my pack was torn. Oops. I will probably not be free to get back up there until Memorial Day, so I bet someone from this page will be up there before me. If you come across it, please send me a pm. Thanks.

I got up early this morning and climbed Chair Peak solo via the SE route, using the more rightward (North) of the two gullies. Left the parking lot on snowshoes at 5:45 am. The temperature was just above freezing, with the commonly seen icy fog obscuring the peaks. There was absolutely no wind. Snow was heavy without crust, with between 1 and 2 inches of fairly light new snow on top. At Source Lake there was the expected old avalanche debris, but nothing new. Snow did not firm up much until after the Thumb Tack. There was some deeper new snow in a few wind-sheltered terrain traps on the way up, but no slabs. In the upper basin the light was very flat, and it was difficult to assess conditions. Fortunately, the mist lifted a few times, and I could see that the southernmost gully (the lowest angle approach, which I had planned to take) was in good shape without cornices. On the other hand, the SE gully straight to the West looked excellent. Beckey says to avoid this chimney, but I think he means in the summertime. A big cornice loomed at the top, but at this altitude it was colder, and the surface was firm at last. I ditched snowshoes and donned crampons. The gully gradually steepens to I'd estimate 60 degrees for the last three hundred feet. I had not intended to solo terrain this steep, and was a little tense to see the snowballs I dislodged take off like rockets down the slope, but it's easier to climb up than down at such times. There were no rocks in the fall line, just avalanche debris, although I know how hard those soft-looking snow piles really are. Conditions in the gully were ideal: the snow was firm enough to take crampon points but soft enough to take the axe shaft. I did use the pick on a few stretches but there was no water ice. I traversed under the 8 foot cornice and heaved over the top with relief. After this it was moderate slopes to the summit. I decided not to cross the last 20 foot gully to the true summit, and was not able to scope out the N face and NE buttress from above due to large cornices. I descended the long way, rounding the "tooth" South of the main peak and down the more moderate gully. (I had brought a rope and there was a good rap station above the steep gully I had ascended, but a single rope would not have gotten me far enough to avoid the steeper stuff.) Snow was heavy and soft in the southernmost gully, and it would have been a real slog to flounder up this one. These routes aren't going to stay in shape for long, if it keeps warming. I stowed axe and crampons, donned snowshoes, and after a few steps decided to glissade. This resulted in the only bummer note of the day: my axe, my beloved Glencoe Walker, came loose from my pack somewhere on the glissade and lies high in the basin East of Chair Peak. This is completely my fault for substituting a cheap Velcro loop this morning when I found that one lower axe loop on my pack was ripped out. I carried two tools the whole way up and down--more foolishness because I'm really not in the league that uses two tools without a belay; so if I'd just left the short tool at the car, I'd still have my axe. But at least I know where it is, for the time being. The upper basin East of the peak would have been decent for skiing, but below there it was the worst kind of mashed potatoes, heavy as lead. It had warmed up by the time I descended, and though the wet snow I kicked up glissading didn't propagate, there were some small sunwheels forming, 6 inches or so. This was the extent of the snow hazard that I encountered. (All right, on the way up I did also plunge unexpectedly into the bergschrund E. of the face, to a level about two feet above my head, because it was snow covered and I thought I'd already rounded the end of it. Fortunately, no more snow fell in on top, and it was easy to climb out. I did question my wisdom in climbing solo at that point.) 3 hours 2 minutes car to summit. 4 hours 45 minutes car to car. I'm going to post my axe on the lost and found page, but if any of you cc'ers are up there and find a Glencoe Walker, please email me and I'll come pick it up. I figure that anyone who goes up there must already own an axe anyway.

If you really want an earful on energy utilization for endurance athletes, go tothe phil maffetone web page. This guy has a very unorthodox approach, but I happen to believe he's on the right track. He's down on the heavy carbs and more into balancing it out with protein. For me, this approach has been essential in keeping me from bonking, not only on a climb but even in a normal day at work. It may not be true for every person's metabolism, but for some of us the tendency to rely too heavily on carbohydrates leads to a chronically high insulin state, which means if we don't constantly fuel ourselves with carbos then sooner or later our blood sugar will plunge, with unpleasant results. I have found that if I add a protein source to my meals or snacks, this keeps me from getting hypoglycemic and ravenous in a few hours. I can keep going on what seems like fewer calories, and avoid the crash.

Are the expedition mitts for sale?

I too was worried when I upped my life insurance coverage a few years ago. I have a policy through USAA, i.e. United Services Automobile Assoc., available theoretically only to those who have been in the armed services, but I'm eligible because my dad was in the Navy and my first ever car insurance was through them. Anyway, I filled out the form about "Risky Activities" with some nervousness, but they did not have to attach any rider to my policy or adjust my rate. I figured it was safe to ask them their underwriting policy at that point, and they said: Mountaineering in the continental U.S. is not dangerous enough, in their opinion, to add significantly to people's overall risk. They only need a rider for people who climb in the Himalayas (or maybe Denali). The underwriters must read Rock and Ice!

W, it pains me deeply but I feel I have a duty to inform you: it's spelled grammar, not grammer.

When I went there last Sept. I downloaded a topo from the map machine at REI. As you may know, this spot is near the corner of the quadrangle, so you need 4 maps or else a program that lets you print a map not centered on the quadrangle. I don't know how new this map was, but there certainly wasn't any problem with it. It's not that big a formation.

That's the gully all right. When I went through there in June 1999 we did not rope up in the gully or the ice chute. There was a question of hidden crevasses on the chute, but to rope up would have also required a belay and we preferred to climb it unroped. I timed our passage through the exposed area: 4 minutes on ascent (when you travel downhill thru the gully), 9 minutes on descent. It was way warm by the time we got back down, and we stood around for a few minutes to consider alternatives, but there really aren't any: once you descend below the gully on the glacier you're still exposed. Apparently some parties rappel directly down the cliffs, which would at least reduce the time of exposure (maybe). I have a nice panoramic photo of almost the same spot which I'll have to take home so I can scan it in.

I was on the board this morning and not on Rainier because the proposed climb of Gib Ledges had to be cancelled due to weather and avalanche concerns. But I did not have to work this weekend, and with all the weekends I've been working lately, most any leisure activity is fun (even running around Green Lake in a snowstorm). I grew up skiing at Mammoth and I think it's my favorite ski mountain anywhere. Dave's Run is where I set my personal record of longest uncontrolled slide down a snow slope. Good thing it gets flatter at the bottom when there's enough snow. I used to look West to the Minarets and Mount Ritter and think, What awesome peaks! Does anyone ever climb them? Will I ever climb them? I haven't climbed them yet, but one of these seasons I'll get down there in the summer. When I was 15 years old I climbed Mammoth in the summer. The Cornice bowl was a big heap of pumice sand, three steps forward and two steps back. I found an old tire halfway up, hauled it to the summit and rolled it down.

I'm going to say a few words and then get off. I go to this site mainly for information, and I'm also entertained (sometimes) by the banter and conversations I find here. But it's gotten to the point where I can't log on when my kids are around (yes, some of us are married and have families and still care seriously about the smaller number of climbing opportunities we still have), because the obscene statements and icons have degraded this page almost to the level of a porn site. My kids' eyes are immediately attracted to the colorful icons,and while most of which are harmless, I don't care to explain to my kids what the nastier ones are about,and I'm not keen on them thinking I get off on this kind of humor--it's funny for half a second, and then it leaves a lingering bad aftertaste. I would bet that I could get along with most of you in a pub club setting, because I would bet that people would self censor their questionable remarks before broadcasting something really tasteless to the whole world. I would caution all of usto be hyper-aware of the negative impact of virtual communication on the very important social rules that most of us live by. What is it about the Internet that makes people feel, just because these remarks start as words on a screen silently typed in, that the communication is not grossly public and enduring? Anything anyone says on this page they should also feel comfortable shouting over a public address system, addressing a crowd that includes their mothers, sisters, bosses, kids, etc. If you think your remarks are somehow shielded from the world, you could not be more wrong. If you don't think your remarks are shielded from the world, and you don't care, I ask you: why do you let a computer erase your social judgment? You would not talk this way in public. [ 03-16-2002: Message edited by: Norman Clyde ]

I talked to a party in the Upper Enchantments once who said they had gotten there via taking a right at Nada Lake and proceeding along the north side of Mt Temple Ridge. They said it wasn't too steep, but also admitted they had had to rope up at one very steep and bushy area. Those of you interested in exploring the ethics of roadbuilding and increased access should check out this site: Wildlands Center for Preventing Roads

This was in a recent post, including the link to the site that explains it all. I don't know the best way to search this site for old posts. THey are going to rebuild the bridge over Icicle Creek at Eightmile, so there will be no access that way all summer.

Anyone interested in this subject should follow what's happening to the proposal to ban snowmobiles from Yellowstone, passed by the Clinton administration in its last days and just officially reversed by George W. There was a good article about it in today's NY Times. If you think the Mountaineers are yahoos about access, listen to the snowmobilers!