Fairweather

Huh????

I think this is one of the stranger ideas you've put forth. Clearly Clinton did try to bring the North Koreans into the world community, but the agreement that he and Carter inked with the "dear leader" was based entirely on trust. Trust that the North would stop its nuclear ambitions in exchange for food, fuel oil, and a light-water nuclear reactor. They took our good will and SPIT on us. Additionally, Clinton and Albright were so fucking dumb that they "forgot" to include uranium enrichment bomb production methods in the agreement. Clearly the North K's knew the intent of the deal and went forward with their entire program anyhow! You say that Bush "threw it out the window"??? I say he's been pretty patient. If China won't control their rabid neighborhood dog, I say we shoot that dog.

They ARE terrorists. "Eco-Warriors", MY ASS. Let 'em rot.

Sounds like a locomotive ...or a U-Boat! How would you generate the electricity for the motors? Diesel? I've recently read an article that diesel/bio diesel soot has been found all over Greenland's icecap and may be more responsible for it's annual loss than global warming. (I'll see if I can find a web-version of the story.)

The Audi A4 is one nice ride! I see it comes in convertible now too. If my employer takes my company car away and goes the 'milage payment' route, I'm looking at the Acura RSX. Great milage and a little power too. No catalytic converters on cars in France?? I had no idea. Certainly not a picture of progressive society. How you been, Matt?

That Hidden Valley/tent picture is awesome! Nice color too. Film or digital? (Not that it matters on my shitty CRT monitor.)

Of course you NEVER see a wealthy Seattle liberal driving a Volvo VX XC 70 wagon or a Subaru wagon, or a mega-polluting 1970-80's era VW mico-bus. Oh no! Marketing/image has NO EFFECT what-so-ever on the 'educated' metro-dweller.

...and less freedom too. Does that factor into your equation? Fuck Western Europe. Fuck Chirac too. The power hungry bastard is simply trying to make the UN and EU his personal imperium. The newly liberated euro "east-siders" appreciate our freedoms more anyhow. Surprisingly, I don't disagree with this part of your post. FTR, I drive a 2WD 1996 Toyota T100 3.4ltr V6 pick-up truck that gets about 22mpg on the hwy. When I finally get around to replacing it someday, I'll get a higher mileage vehicle, for sure. Maybe a Toyota Tacoma Quad cab (4cyl) @27mpg, or one of those Honda Elements ... roomy and get about 28mpg hwy. 30 mpg should be the goal, but ultimately the free market will decide. I don't think the "shaming" of SUV owners that is constantly being dished out by the left has been successful at all.

Ok. Even though I don't like your enviro-politics, and your desire to lock me out of MY mountains is an outrage, I can't help but offer you my last experience on this route.... My brother and I did the traverse in one day car-to-car on July 1, 2001. From my log book: It took us 3 hours to reach Upper Lena which was thawed out, but had some snow around the shores still. A sign directed us to Scout Lake, but the trail was soon lost in snow. The sheer mass of Mount Bretherton is revealed from the ridge traverse. It's huge! After a couple of minor off route adventures, we arrived at Deerheart Lake, a beautiful little tarn that looked like it would provide some good camping for overnighters. We soon dropped down some, and arrived at the so called "difficult traverse". Class two or three, but nice tree roots to hang on to. It would have been more difficult with heavy packs, but only the most timid would have any trouble at all. (No rope required) Scout Lake is visible below this point, but it is quite a bit off of the route. We regained some altitude and picked our way through the trees back up to the ridge line. The "Stone Ponds" were completely snow covered, but avalanche lillies were begining to bloom around the edges of meadow areas. Saint Peters Gate was plainly visible ahead. A large perennial snow field that descends from Mount Stone was crossed here and a huge square block of rock the size of a small house was passed en route to the pass. Nice step kicking, not too steep, no rope needed. (Ski poles or axe advised. DO NOT go to the left "pass". St Peters Gate is the obvious u-shaped notch...Don't second guess yourself here!) We arrived at St Peters Gate...7 1/2 hours from the car. Lake of the Angels below still 90% snow covered, but dry terrain down climbing (easy class 2...if even that!) on this side of the pass to snow just above the lake. We could have bypassed Lake of the Angels and saved some time, but this is one of my favorite mountain places, so we hung out here for half an hour. Hiking down from the lake the trail was almost immediately snow free. I slipped backwards on wet tree roots, instinctively threw my ski poles back, and listend to one of them snap as I fell hard to the ground, landing on my tailbone. Shit! The hike out the Putvin Trail was uneventful. (Dont worry about the "difficult section" here either. Just watch your step and use dry tree roots to llower yourself down one easy move.) We had stashed mountain bikes at the trailhead, and rode them back to the Lower Lena trailhead for a round trip time of about 12 hours. I have a friend who did this trip last year, but continued on to Gladys Divide and Flapjack Lakes. He said the section beyond Mount Skokomish involves much elevation loss and moderate to heavy bushwacking. PM me if you need more info. I'll post pictures if can ever get my slide scanner to work again with Windows XP! Oh yea...thank me by supporting the reopening of The Dosewallips Road! Brian

Without giving it a whole lot of thought...George Bush Sr. He has lived an incredible life from WWII dive bomber pilot, to CIA director, to China Ambassador, to President and IMO was a true moderate. Clean Air Act, a case in point. I sincerely believe he deserved a second term. BTW....Clinton didn't receive 50% either.

I can't believe you guy's buy into this shit. First he's just a willing dupe for Cheney and Rumsfeld, and now he's a paranoid power hungry mad-man! Well, which is it? Off White. Shall I add your name to the black helicopter club too?

Ruth Bender Ginsburg is here and wants to discuss an upcoming case with a NOW representative right here on cc.com. Something about a speaking fee too. It's OK though, because everyone knows that liberals like RBG answer to a higher calling than those low-life republican conservatives. When she breaks protocol it must be for a very , very good reason.

Pope has become quite the JFKerry cheerleader. I think that in the spirit of full disclosure, he should state - for the record - whether he is a paid campaign-Kerry official or on the payroll of the Wa State Democratik party. If he isn't, he should just stop trying to relive his college-activism days and grow old gracefully. Actually...I voted for Kerry...right before I voted against him. Gotta go! Teresa's here with the SUV and wants to get back to our multi-million dollar estate so she can ship some more Ketchup manufacturing jobs overseas before the sun comes up in China.

True, but legal. Besides, the only 'evil' lobbyists belong to the 'other side'.

I would celebrate the passing of Yasser Arafat. Nobel Peace Prize...my ASS!

I think you give them too much credit. Fringe right-wing christian groups are mostly balanced out by moderate-to-liberal Catholics, and mostly-liberal black Southern Baptist churches. Regardless, as long as any group works within our system of laws, I have no problem with them. The 'checks and balances' of our secular republic remain in effect.

In all fairness, you have to really measure all these guys against their era. In effect , you could consider Lincoln a racist today, since he didn't really support abolition until it seemed nescessary to hold the union together. One of Teddy's big accomplishments was stemming the tide of big business gaining more and more power. Unfortunately the trend seems to be reversing today... Lincoln was an abolishionist all along. This is (mostly) why the south hated him so. He just didn't issue his emancipation proclamation as law until it became politically expedient to do so.

Teddy was a conservationist, but I doubt he would submit to the label, environmentalist.

"Progressive" only by the standards of his day. Certainly not a liberal by standards applied then, or now.

Theodore Roosevelt. Most "moral" president: Jimmy Carter

A nice quotable! And how true.

Since you asked.... 1860/61. Lincoln stumbled headlong into a civil war that his very election helped create. He raised an army to suppress the southern rebellion, and then pushed them into offense before they were prepared. McLellan was right to hold back. Lincoln relieved him of his command. Consider this: a Union Army, superior in both sheer numbers and weaponry, was largely slaughtered - by an almost 2:1 margin! - and by a fairly rag-tag southern fighting force, under brilliant southern generalship. Lincoln had his victory in the end, but at a horrible.. and avoidable cost. 1863. Lincoln had draft riots in New York put down with brute force. 1000 dead. (Mostly new Irish immigrants unwilling to fight as draftees for the union.) Closed unfriendly newspapers and suspended Writ of Habeas Corpus. 1864. Unleashed General Sherman on the south. During his 'march to the sea' he vowed to "make Georgia Howl". Untold thousands of southern civilians died at the hands of union troops. Southern cities burned and looted. The slaughter of American Indians by union troops continued unabated in the west, including the massacre of Arapaho and Cheyenne as they awaited surrender terms on Nov 29, 1864 at Sand Creek. Only when public support for the war was waining did Lincoln issue his Emancipation Proclamation. Remember, four Union States had remained slave states prior to this! Don't get me wrong, I think The Confederacy was an abomination. And I think the credit Lincoln gets for holding the United States together is well deserved. But the price he paid was very, very high.

....Back to the thread title: I have given this some serious thought over the years and I believe that the worst and the best American president is one-in-the-same....

Did I say censorship? Re-read the post, asswipe. Then go bury your head in the sand so you don't have to hear ideas and opinions you don't like.