bobinc

But of course. It all comes from the ritual violence gene.

Actually, a lot of ophioloitic formations are found in California. Get ahold of Assembling California, by John McPhee.

I always thought it was olivine (like Dru sez, more or less) with high i-ron content (hence the color).

Yes; I think it's like training for bowling.

Josh -- a good friend of mine has explored quite a bit up around there, but not sure if he has gone exactly where you want to go. Let me know if you are interested in contacting him. Bob Davis

I think the Avalung was designed by crash pad engineers. But one could rightly argue crash pads are much more effective.

Sorry to hear about the whipper on POD, Winter. Let's see... -- getting up some RRocks classics, including Ginger Cracks and POD, the latter on Dec 27 with hand warmers under the shoelaces -- Stuart Ice Cliff Glacier in winter conditions (in June); perhaps this could also go under low-lights... -- Lyman Glacier on Chiwawa in perfect weather -- getting up some Yosemite and Josh Classics with an amenable rope gun doing most of the heavy lifting: Central Pillar of Frenzy, Serenity Crack, Bird of Fire, Exorcist, Diamond Dogs Low light: working too much and not climbing enough

Too bad, Allison. The guy that took the bone spurs off my big toes years ago was totally mellow -- painted landscapes and fished for steelhead. And I can still walk. Perhaps the local problem is a consequence of practicing amongst so many Beautiful People. But he's competent, right?

Winter, what happened on POD?

Last I checked (a few yrs ago), one had to get something on the order of 11,000 member signatures to become a candidate for the Board. So much for challenging the "incumbents".

It would be more honest of REI to take "co-op" out of its name. The whole idea of the co-op is to increase buying power for a group of people who can't find what they need through the normal channels. This hasn't been true for a long time, and the dividend is nothing more than a vestigial reminder of the quaint past. In the late 70s, when REI started to feel pressure from elsewhere, it decided to go away from its roots and become the Costco of import clothing and outdoor trinkets to avoid bankruptcy. REI had to get bigger to survive, and this was the tradeoff. Now we have a flagship store that is a monument to excess and waste (it failed 2/3 of the WA State Energy Code), and this design is being replicated in other cities. But REI is able to fool enough people who don't know any better, the bottom line looks good, and so what if you can't find pickets in April?

But Jim, what about all those terrorists lurking behind every sand dune? We must either convert them to our way of thinking or eliminate them, and either path is very, very expensive. For a country with such wealth, we are extremely pound-foolish.

Exactly. I just have to shake my head when I hear people argue along the lines of, "well, now that my kids are out of school, I always vote no on the tax levies." If that's the kind of society you want to have, go ahead and vote no, but also remember, you get what you pay for. Same goes for health care. Apparently, as a society, we have decided we are comfortable with a trade-off whereby the medical establishment makes a very comfortable living but we have somewhere around 100 million or more people who are either uninsured or underinsured. That's living in America, circa 2002. Yes, most of the European societies have "high taxes," but that money goes to fund things that I would think civilized countries would want: single payer health care, free university, and so on. Go ahead and take the libertarian track if you like, but be prepared to argue that it's okay to have a high infant mortality rate, high functional illiteracy rate, etc.

Sad, but true. The flat tab rate did away with one of the few progressive fees we had in this state. It still amazes me how people don't get this. But even more amazing is how they blame the feds for taxes being too high when the real cause is right under their nose: Washington is one of the most regressive tax states in the US.

If the rich could hire the poor to die for them, the poor could make a pretty good living.

Spent 4+ days at Red Rocks and had a blast. One item of interest is that 2 bolt anchors have been added to the first four pitches of Ginger Cracks, so it is possible to rappel the route, if needed. However, the descent down Power Failure is superior, given it is steeper and has many fewer features. I ended up re-climbing the crux of GC to unstick the rope... (But 2 bolts have been added to the crux, too, so...) Crimson Chrysalis is more crowded then ever. We saw 14 people on it the day we climbed Geronimo and there were at least a dozen on it the day we climbed GC. Not to say it isn't worth doing, but if you like to climb to get away from crowds, this isn't your route. Also enjoyed several routes in the Lotta Balls area. Lotta Balls is a blast and there is a relatively new 5.8 to its left that heads up nubbins a shallow corner. Enjoyed Rabbit's Foot, too, which requires a couple of fun moves to pull an overhang. Alcohol Wall (10ish face and thin crack climbing) looks inviting, but we ran out of time (just as we felt to be ready for something a bit more challenging, of course).

I like Forrest's plan but use factory-second cotton long sleeve shirts (usually abt $10) because cotton feels better in hot weather. These shirts are also good on the glacier since you can roll up sleeves, undo buttons, etc as the day warms up. Also amazes me how people pay $30 or $40 for sunhats with the "cancer curtain" when you can get the same effect with a gimme baseball cap from the paint store and a bandanna.

Matt -- are you doing any of these sessions?

Yeah, Cinderella area is very confusing. However, there was a good thread in here last spring, I think, that seemed to have good beta. Denis98 was the source.

Well said. The main question at hand should be, "what kind of society do we want to live in," regardless of our position in that society. Just because I am relatively well off does not mean I stop caring for everyone else's rights and standard of living. If we take ourselves and others seriously, we cannot assume our actions have no effect on others.

Perhaps a good public works project in Oregon would be to glue the entire contents of Smith Rock State Park together so they could be enjoyed in perpetuity by both climbers and sight-seers alike. (Having said this, though, I think all assembled would agree it would be much cheaper to have a crew of illegal aliens do the work.)

Yes, I think Balance of Power was TOO civil. I guess it's back to insulting each other. Or perhaps we might actually want to talk about climbing....

The Invisible Hand will take care of everything, including directing traffic. (Actually, once we reach terminal gridlock, this will no longer be necessary.)

Uh -oh, we need a decision! I don't think Greg or Trask will disappoint, however. I'm eager to see how they rule on this.

DFA and Dru: you are adding too much complexity to this "debate." The beauty of the Republican "platform" is that it only has one or two planks (lower taxes, save the unborn/kill the bad buys) so it's always easy to look between one's feet and be reassured...