Jens

There is a lot more exposed ice on i t right now vs. a regular year for this time. It is fairly broken up but still very climable. This cirque is never really a place to dilly dally. We climbed it car to car two days ago. We encountered a short AI3 sect ion of ice, but the rest of the route was moderate. Keep moving, look and listen while you are moving. There has definitely been some stonefall and icefall activit y up in that cirque in the last week. Nothing came down on us for the 3 hours we were on the climb. The descent down the sherpa couloir/glacier is in good shape right now also.

Ups I meant Saturday.

Was that you hiking up the moraine below the ice cliff glacier on Sunday when I yodeled across from the flanks of the sherpa glaicer?

The bolts in question on DDD are rather in poor taste. It doesn't have to sound like a witch hunt, but I am curious who put them in. I have climbed the route prior to the bolts being added. If my memory serves me correct , from about 40 off the ground to the finish, there are bomber gear placements, yet it is a bit far apart so just prepare for a big safe winger. The first 3rd of the route if I remember was a different story. It had some sketchy gear. If nothing else, the route could have been equiped with two bolts down low, and then only by a few people. Dana's arch is a different story. The bolts adhere to the Yosemte ethic and even Bachar wouldn't blow his top. Having free and aid climbed the thing (in the rain) , pins will destroy parts of the flake, stoppers try to lever out and cable stemed cams will torque in a wierd way . The bolts were added to save the feature, much like wheat thin on the cookie cliff by Bridwell in t he 70's, Sure one could do the thing on gear if he or she had to but the logic is different. As for Numbah ten, how much is the climb getting tried now? Does anybody know? Wasn' t Tom Herbert the only one to ever onsight flash it with no beta? I hope my comments don't sound to much like they belong on the spray forum. I'm bored. Great topic discussion starter. Everybody's got an opinion.

Great Route-- much better than the serpentine arete. *Don't Bivy if possible *The Wide pitch took a big bro (7 inch?) down lower and then offered a few good small gear placements up higher. Try to spot the pitch from down low as some people have gotten lost. * The fin is a cool feature * I would bring either crampons and a ski pole or an axe for any time of year. It will be a lot faster that way. * We did it in 7 pitches and roped up at the base of the wide pitch

I am hearing that some people are suggesting that we should rethink conventional wisdom about supportive taping of fingers for rock climbing. Does anyone have any knowledge of the subject? Should tape be applied to prevent injury of fingers (middle & ring finger)? What if one was trying to climb while nursing an injury, or doesn't want to take a major long layoff? Is taping bad? One school of thought is that ligament injuries in fingers should be taped while tendon problems should not be taped. How does one tell the difference without consulting a doctor?

Haven't been ski mountaineering on Adams lately but was up touring near the Sahale Arm last Sunday. Quite a bit of new snow was on the ground and it was snowing lightly off and on during different times of the day. The turns were fun and more winterlike up high. It got wet and a little heavy down low. The whole day felt more like march.

I haven't climbed the route...... but why so many chains!!#@!!?????

Many of us are looking at the bigger picture about stringing bolt lines up mountian faces. Debating that is very good and provides hours of chat. My point is simply this: The WA climbing community doesn't need a rap-bolted, power drilled, top to bottom sport climbing, clp-up on the ESE face of south early winter spire-- And I love sport climbing and have done my share of rap bolting. I have studied this face in great detail and have scrambled around the base of the whole thing. Here is why this route will not do a service to the community: 1. Granted, a cool free line on this face would require a few bolts. But if you look carefully enough cracks are found all over the place EVERYWHERE. Why not just use a few bolts to link protecable systems? The face is steep enough that you wouldn't get hurt if you took a big winger. 2. This is the mountains not the crags. I don't care that you park 30 minutes away, It is still the mountains. Just because we sport climbers won the bolt war of the 80's doesn't mean it is manifest destiny to bring our doctrine to the high mountains. 3. A rivet or a drilled bathook aid ladder is not done from top to bottom and rarely takes up more than 5 percent of the total veritcal feet gained. Even on the big stone. Just because the route has been started doen't mean it has to be finished. Please let it rest in peace. ps. as you ascend thin red line, who put all the bolts around it?

Many of us are looking at the bigger picture about stringing bolt lines up mountian faces. Debating that is very good and provides hours of chat. My point is simply this: The WA climbing community doesn't need a rap-bolted, power drilled, top to bottom sport climbing, clp-up on the ESE face of south early winter spire-- And I love sport climbing and have done my share of rap bolting. I have studied this face in great detail and have scrambled around the base of the whole thing. Here is why this route will not do a service to the community: 1. Granted, a cool free line on this face would require a few bolts. But if you look carefully enough cracks are found all over the place EVERYWHERE. Why not just use a few bolts to link protecable systems? The face is steep enough that you wouldn't get hurt if you took a big winger. 2. This is the mountains not the crags. I don't care that you park 30 minutes away, It is still the mountains. Just because we sport climbers won the bolt war of the 80's doesn't mean it is manifest destiny to bring our doctrine to the high mountains. 3. A rivet or a drilled bathook aid ladder is not done from top to bottom and rarely takes up more than 5 percent of the total veritcal feet gained. Even on the big stone. Just because the route has been started doen't mean it has to be finished. Please let it rest in peace. ps. as you ascend thin red line, who put all the bolts around it?

I pray the rumors are not true about several individuals wanting to or in process of rap bolting a new sport route top to bottom on the magnificent face on the southeast side of South Early winter spire. It is an awesome face that already sports several routes including much free climbing. Cracks are found all over the place. And don't use the comparison of the Direct East Butress Route. That's a pretty lame argument. The Huber brother sure wouldn't do it! Bolts OK- but keep those top to bottom clip up routes with a bolt at your ankles, waist, and eyes routes (North Bend Style) out of the mountains. (The kind that have more clips than moves). You don't need to rap bolt in the high mountains to be cool.

I guess I have a story that relates to the previous discussions. I started rock climbing every day I could at 13. As time progressed, I trained for and entered some of the early comps down when the old original vertical world was on elliot. I'm almost 28 now and am an alpinist. I rarely sport climb anymore. Yeah, some of those kids will not be climbing in 10 years but a few will. And perahps even a couple might become "mountaineers" Those few will be the ones tearing it up. Having a sport background all their life will make pulling that rad mixed move with a big pack on seem all the more sane. Obsessions with bouldering as kids will provide mucho emotional support in the mountains and on the ice. Those new kids in the gym in these modern times can really pull!

Same story with me. Ticks seemed be a thing associated with eastern WA climbing areas only until recently. The two ticks I have had in me from Western Washington have been from south facing exsposures either in or near vast clearcuts. Somebody looking for a master's biology thesis?

If enough of us boycott, it will foil the system. The fee and permit deal to climb is WAY OUT OF CONTROL! Take a step back and analyze the system. It's nuts. Permits to park, climbing quotas, trailhead registrations, summit fees, sno-park permits, the list goes on. The situation here is making those rabid Yosemite rangers seem like mellow dudes. Speaking as one who has been harrased by them more then on more than a few occasions.

My brother currently has lyme disease. The tick that gave it to him was found in the canyon that goes from Ellensburg to Yakima. He was pretty sick for a couple of days but has been OK ever since. The medical community still knows very little about the disease, but they know enough to know that he has it. Cragging at the tieton can get pretty bad as far as ticks go. Does anyone know anything about a vaccine?

I think it would cool or at least amusing if we had a "rant", "spray", or "misc." catergory on this site. Or at least a place to read and write "vent" sessions. jon or tim?

I think it would cool or at least amusing if we had a "rant", "spray", or "misc." catergory on this site. Or at least a place to read and write "vent" sessions. jon or tim?

I had a pair of the plastic boots they made. I got them in 91'. They were OK, they had vibram soles which was nice, but the liners took forever to dry and they were a bit clunky. They were endorsed by Messner. I thought the company went out of business but apparantly they are back.

That's Vantage for ya' I've heard stories that some local teenagers carjacked over some of the real big columns in the days of yore. Why the place is so popular with climbers is beyond me.

Does anyone in Western Washington sew webbing or resling friends? I know that I can mail them off to some far destination but I don't want to. Thanx