goatboy

I thought there was a story on this site years ago from the West Arete route on Eldorado which involved a party holding a simulclimbing fall -- a quick search yielded nothing, however...anyone remember that?

I assume that the damaged road has been patched up? Nice photos and nice job. Also, what's up with the "ice cliff" at the Pearly Gates? I've never seen it form up quite like that before...

My favorite climbing trip is the climbing trip during which I had the most fun... So, that might have to make it a combination of the last nine thanksgivings in a row, which we have spent with a small core of great friends at climbing areas around the SW (J Tree for 7 of the 9, red rocks once, and cochise once). We deep fry wings and turkeys, drink a lot of tecate, and climb whatever's warm and sunny...so fun...can't wait for J Tree next November!!!

Frikadeller, That's super-weak. I hope a moderator deletes your post soon.

You asked, so I'll answer: Yes, you are just crazy. You may have climbed in "these conditions" on Denali, but were you following a well-marked cattle path or seeking someone buried beneath up to several feet of fresh snow? Were you moving from one established camp to another, or probing an accident scene in hopes of finding and supporting someone in need? In other words, "climbing" and attempting to rescue are pretty different functions... I think your comparison of the two situations is very reductionist and silly. So there you go. You asked, and that's my answer.

As I recall, SS Creek is very near where they gate the road for winter...are you thinking of the pullout on the road below the wine spires, considerably further up the road? If so, that's not SS Creek.

I bet going up Silverstar Creek, camping up there somewhere, and climbing SS in the winter would be great. Both summits of SS are enjoyable snowy objectives... Probably a bit harder to get into Gardner, I would think...

Do you have access to a snowmobile?

What routes on slesse are you referring to?

I've seen people with computers there - so I would guess that they do. Maybe the library, too? Or even Sleeping Lady Resort?

Tone? Can you hear me? I wish I couldn't...

Ivan, I don’t make the rules, just going by the standards put in place by our lovely moderators and service folks. So far on this thread you are the first person the use the work climb. This should be on spray, by the CC.com definition. If the thread would have started as “Im going climbing want to know about the road conditions”, that would be different. Either way is doesn’t matter really, nobody listens to me. In most situations, does your passive-aggressive, whiny attitude and judgmental tone lead people to listen to you? Why do you suppose it doesn't work here?

Mt Lemmon is much more approachable than Granite Mtn. More like J Tree in terms of roadside routes and time spent climbing vs. hiking....if I only had ONE day, I'd go to Lemmon... What about Paradise Forks?

Sooooo.......no takers I guess?

Hello all, Does anyone in the Seattle area have a copy of Kerry's guidebook to Cochise that I could borrow? I am heading down there soon and all I have is the Falcon Climbing Arizona guidebook....would love a copy of the Kerry book to borrow if possible -- will provide beer to the kind donator and promise to take good care of the goods.... Please reply here or PM if you can help. Thanks in advance, Steve "Goatboy"

Perhaps I am naive, but the statement that most people on this site probably don't pack out their own shit surprises me .... and then it dawned on me that you probably mean "shit" literally, as in feces...which would almost be a certainty that most people don't pack it out. LNT practices recommend catholing feces when in the proper environment to do so (organic soil that can break it down over time) or blue-bagging it and packing it out. Of course, some NP sites have backcountry composting toilets... Having said all that, when in LARGE groups, it's much better for them to blue bag and carry it out and I applaud those who have chosen to do so...

Is it in the crack of infinity area?

I don't know that the answer is a finite number of days climbing or peaks climbed -- I think the answer is more based around conscious competence -- does the instructor know what they're teaching and WHY it is the way it is? In other words, if a student asks why this belay technique is used in this situation, or why the load strand is here vs. here, or when you might want to consider using a different technique (i.e. wet, icy ropes, etc) - the instructor needs to know how to answer those questions (which only comes through experience) rather than parroting, "that's what they taught us in the intermediate class last year, so that's how I do it...."

It seems like there's an inherent cultural assumption in the last post (by downfall) that everyone WANTS to climb 5.10 in the mountains and just wish that they could do so, but lack the partners, skills, body fat percentage, or courage to do so... I would say that this assumption, like most, doesn't apply to all climbers, mountaineers or otherwise...though it might certainly apply to many. Just pointing that out that there may be other goals besides climbing hard...like after-climb for example!

I kinda remember the hard part being right off the ground on P.1 -- the rest of the dihedral decreases in angle the higher you get....is that right?

Outward Bound also offers professional-level Outdoor Educator and Wilderness Instructor Training Courses (separate and distinct from their own in-house training for newly-hired staff). Being Outward Bound, it's probably more balanced between teaching skills, facilitating groups, and the technical wilderness skills being covered. I imagine that the NOLS course touches on all of those aspects but emphasizes the technical skills aspect more than the others.

I just replot...

MAYBE MORE THAN A PATCH OR TWO?

Seems to me that it's not always right to equate "instructor" and "guide." Many guides INSTRUCT on their climbs - AAI has their NW Mountain School, extended trips aimed more at skill instruction than on summitting... Other guides (usually on shorter trips) are pretty much aimed at getting their group of paying clients to the top and back again safely. Some Instructors (i.e. NOLS or Outward Bound) primarily aim at teaching skills, and occasionally go into "guide mode" when summitting a peak beyond their students' ability to lead the way... BUT it's more common that Instructing can look, and encompass different skills, than Guiding... It's possible that to INSTRUCT mountaineering requires MORE skills than GUIDING mountaineering does -- it depends, however, on the complexity of skills that you're instructing, the skill level of the participants, the environment you're doing it in... I think it's entirely possible that a beginner course could be taught by someone with (approximately) the level of skill which is outlined above...or, it could be disastrous if they overstep their skill level and go into terrain, or identify course objectives, beyond their ability to manage. But the IDEA of having clearly outlined minimum criteria or qualifications for instructors is obviously a good one, if it hasn't already been implemented... My two cents...

I have a betalight too. For most of my purposes, it's big enough -- though there are occasions where the MEGAlight would be better (i.e. three people). It's very light and very compressible...high recommendations. - GB