Question for the engineers.

[MATT_B]

I have spent the last 7+ years working in a consulting engineering firm doing plumbing and HVAC design. I will finally be finishing up my BSME this spring. I’m thinking about changing gears once I graduate. I’m thinking about getting into product design, machine design, manufacturing or something like that. I would love to hear thoughts on things like work environment, challenges, hours, long term prospects in your field, what skills are good to know and/or learn for your field, or anything else you feel like sharing about you line of work.

[RuMR]

contact Mr. Radon...

[fenderfour]

Big companies like Boeing are killing the marketability and the salary of engineering fields.

 

To be more marketable anywhere - get your PE. This could be difficult due to the work requirements. It is worth the effort.

 

Product design is very cool stuff, but it's like architecture. It's hard to break in to and when you do get there, the pay sucks for a while since it is such a desirable field.

 

Manufacturing is less glamorous, but there are lots of opportunities all over the world with all of the automation going on. Same goes for machine design.

 

Hours, work environment, etc all goes with where you are working, not the job.

 

Long term prospects are varied but usually come from the larger companies/firms. These are the places where the work will (generally) be less interesting.

 

If you chose to contract you will make good money with an uncertain future. Contracting is a good way to open doors and gain experience in multiple areas while you are younger and less worried about health issues and retirement.

 

 

 

 

[ericb]

Get some work experience, and then go get your MBA.....this is a great combo that many companies recruit, and the pay can be much better!

[selkirk]

Big companies like Boeing are killing the marketability and the salary of engineering fields.

 

To be more marketable anywhere - get your PE. This could be difficult due to the work requirements. It is worth the effort.

 

Product design is very cool stuff, but it's like architecture. It's hard to break in to and when you do get there, the pay sucks for a while since it is such a desirable field.

 

Manufacturing is less glamorous, but there are lots of opportunities all over the world with all of the automation going on. Same goes for machine design.

 

Hours, work environment, etc all goes with where you are working, not the job.

 

Long term prospects are varied but usually come from the larger companies/firms. These are the places where the work will (generally) be less interesting.

 

If you chose to contract you will make good money with an uncertain future. Contracting is a good way to open doors and gain experience in multiple areas while you are younger and less worried about health issues and retirement.

 

Getting your PE can be very usefull if your practicing in ME or CivE. I'm in Aero. and unluckily it means jack. Which is kind of a bummer as I only need 2 years and my exam to get mine. Might still do it, but it caries no weight in Aero. For us it's all about the DER-ship which takes a good long while.

 

Contracting is usually good for about a 20% higher salary, and increased flexibility. Some sick leave, but "vacation days" are unpaid. The other twist is that where I am, all of the program management stuff gets funeled to direct hires. So even though some folks have more experience than I, I often end up with more responsibility.

 

Not sure about the Boeing effect on salaries but I have a few friends who enjoy working for them, and a good number who left disgruntled. Seems to be difficult to advance there. The saying is that you have to leave Boeing to get a promotion... Of course I've only been in the Aero. work force for 18 months or so now. Would be happy to talk to you about it if your interested in Aero.

 

Good luck!

Engineering does seem to be in big demand still

 

The MBA/Engineering degree combo can be very marketable, but only if you want to manage engineers, with a heavy dose of management. You'll be doing way more MBA stuff, and probably little or know technical engineering. Pay can be good, but make sure it's what you want to do!

 

[bstach]

Its not to late to become a gastroenterologist. They make bank. You still have to work with assholes, but they are mostly sedated.

[Couloir]

And prolapsed.

[cj001f]

my cynical take, speaking broadly:

 

As an engineer your prospects for a salary increase or meaningful promotion within the same employer are less than in other disciplines, because in corp. orgs of today straight engineers just aren't promoted. You need to leave engineering or the company to get a big promotion (MBA comment earlier). Salary raises at the same company are possible in the 5-10% range (depending more on the external job market than other factors), changing jobs can get you 20%. Expect to change employers. Make sure there are several where you want to live. Unless you are chosen as someone to be groomed for greater things when you are hired, you just won't go places.

 

On job duty:

Traditional manufacturing in America is dieing. System integration "manufacturing" is what's taking it's place, but I give that 10-20 years, tops. System integration is much more managing - suppliers, assemblers, your managers, your customers, than down and dirty technical engineering (but you need to have that down cold though)

 

Engineering is a good education, and better than average job, but not necessarily a good career

[olyclimber]

My advice is this: Throw some more coal on the fire!!! WWWHOOOOOOOWOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

 

 

[John Frieh]

I am a little cog in a really big wheel. The crank turns. The wheel spins. The sun never sets in a flat world. It is 8-5 somewhere in the world. Always.

 

My BB beeps. I am arguing on the phone with someone I will never meet.

 

I have email separation anxiety. "Excuse me... do you know the where the closest hot spot is?"

 

I am modern day blue collar. I am a cube farmer. I am a PowerPoint pusher.

 

POR vs ROI: ASPs drop as my cube mates BMIs rise. Soon I will be able to synthesize vitamin D from florecent lights and LCD screens.

 

Another 2 months. Another girl. "you're just too busy for me... you work to much"

 

The crank turns. The wheel spins.

 

[cj001f]

Yes, John sums it up quite well.

[fenderfour]

I am a little cog in a really big wheel. The crank turns. The wheel spins. The sun never sets in a flat world. It is 8-5 somewhere in the world. Always.

 

My BB beeps. I am arguing on the phone with someone I will never meet.

 

I have email separation anxiety. "Excuse me... do you know the where the closest hot spot is?"

 

I am modern day blue collar. I am a cube farmer. I am a PowerPoint pusher.

 

POR vs ROI: ASPs drop as my cube mates BMIs rise. Soon I will be able to synthesize vitamin D from florecent lights and LCD screens.

 

Another 2 months. Another girl. "you're just too busy for me... you work to much"

 

The crank turns. The wheel spins.

 

F*ck that. you are delicate flower. You are special and as unique as a snowflake.

[cj001f]

F*ck that. you are delicate flower. You are special and as unique as a snowflake.

 

Fuck that, I'm the all-singing all-dancing crap of the world.

[olyclimber]

Someday you'll find a special guy who understands you Carl. Until then you can rent.

[cj001f]

Until then you can rent.

 

Your master said you were rent to own. Another 3 years and you'll be mine!

[olyclimber]

What is it with you Portland people anyway?

[selkirk]

I am a little cog in a really big wheel. The crank turns. The wheel spins.

I'm a moderately sized cog in a small machine. It's a pretty good life.

 

The sun never sets in a flat world. It is 8-5 somewhere in the world. Always.

Yep, and sometimes this means problems get solved twice as fast. Though sometimes it means data is transfered at half the rate. I like my French counterparts, great to work with And now I know people in Merignac

 

My BB beeps. I am arguing on the phone with someone I will never meet.

Don't get one until your company buys it. Same with a cell phone.

I still don't have a cell phone! Though it's amusing when I occasionally get home to messages when my Boss forgets that I don't have a cell phone

 

I have email separation anxiety. "Excuse me... do you know the where the closest hot spot is?"

This is your own damn fault. When I'm done, I'm done. If it's critical I'd rather work late and deal with it. If not, will dealing with it now really affect the long term outcome, or is it another part of the hurry up and wait game? A few people at my office share a hot-phone for customer support poor bastards

 

I am modern day blue collar. I am a cube farmer. I am a PowerPoint pusher.

 

POR vs ROI: ASPs drop as my cube mates BMIs rise. Soon I will be able to synthesize vitamin D from florecent lights and LCD screens.

Sounds like you need a different job John!

 

Another 2 months. Another girl. "you're just too busy for me... you work to much"

As opposed to you climb too much? It's all a matter of priorities and keeping them. I worked too much overtime this spring. Now I go home at night to my wife and play with the dog

 

The crank turns. The wheel spins.

And tomorrow is another chance to learn something and play with the dog

 

All this means is be very very careful about the work environment and the position you choose. That won't ever change. Make sure you like what your doing and more importantly like the people you work for/with. Or if you don't be sure that the position is worth the advancement it had better might offer.

 

A ever upward rising career with a continually growing salary may be nice and may be "successful" in many peoples eyes. But at the end of your life, will you have wished you spent more time at work? Success at work won't necessarily make you happy. Being happy is all about perspective and balance.

 

[cj001f]

All this means is be very very careful about the work environment and the position you choose. That won't ever change. Make sure you like what your doing and more importantly like the people you work for/with. Or if you don't be sure that the position is worth the advancement it had better might offer.

 

A ever upward rising career with a continually growing salary may be nice and may be "successful" in many peoples eyes. But at the end of your life, will you have wished you spent more time at work? Success at work won't necessarily make you happy. Being happy is all about perspective and balance.

 

That's all well and good but requires you to be rosy and optimistic about the continued viability of such employers in America. I'm not. To get greater productivity out of the American worker will require longer hours. Sad to say, but it's true.

 

I'd say the 8hour a day engineering jobs are worse - the works boring and the industry is going nowhere. If they want alot out of you they have goals and are going someplace.

[selkirk]

I don't think engineering and high end technical work is ever going to disappear from the US any time soon. We still have the best collegiate education in the world. There is a good reason so many foreign nationals still come here for advanced degrees. What i've been thinking for some time is that America is slowly shifting towards an information based economy. Consumer goods, manufacturing and service will all remain as support to some degree, but in general we can't make stuff as cheaply as most 3rd world countries can. The one asset we do have is the density and availability of higher education, and thats not something I see changing in the near future.

 

As for "good" employers.... I think they exist and will continue to exist. Almost more importantly good groups within bad employers will continue to exist. As for greater productivity from more hours, that's only true to a point. Oh, and for the most part my job is an 8hr a day engineering job. The company is booming and will continue to do so as long as gas is expensive. I don't know that I'll be here indefinitely due to potentially limited upward mobility, but it'll be good for the next 4 or 5 years.

...

 

 

So what made you so cynical?

I'm Gen X and I'm not even that jaded

[cj001f]

No, Engineering and High Tech work will still be here.

 

Employment for anyone over 45 won't be. I've seen enough age discrimnation to know that high tech hates anyone over 40 and with a family. On the flip side of that I'm young and single so they assume I'm a great hire who's willing to workhard to earn them their millions

 

~80% of my graduating glass that went to work in industry was laid off within 2 years. I've worked through or been canned in ~dozen layoffs, worked through 1 SEC enquiry, 3 deposed CEOs, one corrupt founder, one bitchy owner, one corrupt CTO, more than one crony capitalism buyout, and more!

[John Frieh]

If your company is truly booming then it is only a matter of time before you either

 

- get bought out by a bigger wheel

- someone rips off your design and makes it for half the price or

- you go public and then you start working for the stock holders

 

Basically you'll come join me on the big wheel sometime...

 

Then again what do I know? I'm not an engineer... I just yell at them

 

 

[KaskadskyjKozak]

I don't think engineering and high end technical work is ever going to disappear from the US any time soon.

 

It certainly will not disappear. On the contrary, there will be more and more of a shortage for qualified engineers. If you are good, you'll probably always be "golden" although salaries may not stand the test of time.

 

As for "good" employers.... I think they exist and will continue to exist. Almost more importantly good groups within bad employers will continue to exist.

 

I've seen a promising trend in this area from the Agile community with its concept of sustainable pace. However, when all is said and done, the bottom line will always rule.

 

The company is booming and will continue to do so as long as gas is expensive. I don't know that I'll be here indefinitely due to potentially limited upward mobility, but it'll be good for the next 4 or 5 years.

 

Oh, the optimism of youth. 4-5 years is an eternity in high tech.

 

[cj001f]

It certainly will not disappear. On the contrary, there will be more and more of a shortage for qualified engineers. If you are good, you'll probably always be "golden" although salaries may not stand the test of time.

 

I don't disagree. What I will say is it's my belief that if you've got what it takes to be a golden engineer you can be succesful quite a few places - all of them with better pay, better flexibility, better advancement or better benefits (in or out of work) than engineering.

[ericb]

It certainly will not disappear. On the contrary, there will be more and more of a shortage for qualified engineers. If you are good, you'll probably always be "golden" although salaries may not stand the test of time.

 

I don't disagree. What I will say is it's my belief that if you've got what it takes to be a golden engineer you can be succesful quite a few places - all of them with better pay, better flexibility, better advancement or better benefits (in or out of work) than engineering.

 

Absolutely agree....and exactly why I left engineering for my Finance MBA. I'm working ~ the same or less and making more than 2X what I was as an engineer.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

It certainly will not disappear. On the contrary, there will be more and more of a shortage for qualified engineers. If you are good, you'll probably always be "golden" although salaries may not stand the test of time.

 

I don't disagree. What I will say is it's my belief that if you've got what it takes to be a golden engineer you can be succesful quite a few places - all of them with better pay, better flexibility, better advancement or better benefits (in or out of work) than engineering.

 

yeah, but then you might have to deal with people. I hate people.