MtnGoat Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 "While benefits are often reaped by a few (logging mills, etc) the costs are distributed to the public via destruction of habitat, streams, places to hike, etc." *someone* is paying for those logs, and they most certainly find they have personal value, or else they wouldn't pay for them. It's impossible for something being sold in a marketplace, to only have value to the producer, or it wouldn't sell in the first place. Selling something only happens when someone else finds value in what is produced. The benefits of cutting that timber is distributed to each person who decides to trade their labor (money) for the product in question. Looking only at who gets money in a trade is a very popular argument for folks looking to claim only producers benefit, but it ignores the value represented by those who decided to pay for something they'd rather have than the dollar in their pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 double-speak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 He's saying, in so many words, that whether or not to vote is a choice just like who to vote for, and people are free to make that choice. And, as autonomous people, it is OK for them to make that choice. Or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Oh, well why didn't he just say so in the first place? Does everything have to be Greek? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 I hereby vote for DFA to be the offical MntGoat traslater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 No, senor. Unas palabras son buenos en Espanol tambien. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 He's saying, in so many words, that whether or [...] DFA, You forgot the emphasis... "He's saying, in so many words, that whether or [...]" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Well if you're using the economics of the market place then the one thing you're ignoring is that the true cost is not accounted for. Timber sales lose money. The USFS subsidizes the timber industry. If it's a true free market then private interests should carry the true cost of the timber and the cost of clean up of the mess. That doesn't happen. The cost of the sale are generalized to the public through the USFS and the cost of to public land, yours and mine, is distributed to all of us, not the generator of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Well, the Doctor just figured that since the question had already been asked, the emphasis was implicit. In so many words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Thanks DFA. Now go pluck some of those top of the nose hairs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr_Flash_Amazing Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 You dissing DFA's near-unibrow, you fuck? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Is that what it is? I though it was a thin turd across your forehead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 I just love it when laissez faire afficionados attempt to portray corporate welfare as a model of free market economics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 ah yes, the other double-speak tool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Get a room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 why, you wanna watch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 Are you drunk again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 why do you ask? are you looking to take advantage of me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 LMAO I thought he was talking to j_b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 A pregnant silence ensues.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 yes and in the process he forgot to mention that winning a political contest with significantly less than 50% participation cannot confer any legitimacy to perform rollbacks and take decisions in spite of public opinion. These are truly the policies wanted by a minority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 (edited) maybe we should refer to it as squeeky wheel polotics Edited January 3, 2003 by Muffy_The_Wanker_Sprayer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 But jb, don't forget we live in a democracy. It doesn't matter whether 1% or 100% vote. He's still in office, which I think indicates the apathy of the public, more than anything else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 ah yes, the other double-speak tool In turn, I have no need to qualify what you are. Everyone here is fully aware of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allthumbs Posted January 3, 2003 Share Posted January 3, 2003 I am a sexy beast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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