Raindawg Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 First, may God bless the memory of Ranger Anderson and comfort her family and friends. Next, read this: I was one of the people held in lockdown up at Paradise for 16 hrs yesterday. I can not over state my admiration and appreciation for all of the park personell from the rangers to the food concession workers and the many volenteers. Law enforcement also needs a great thanks for keeping us safe in a difficult situation. Lastly, human nature really shined during our stay at "Paradise Hilton".Everyone was very kind and considerate. Now read this: "Kind and considerate" eh? Evacuations wrapped up overnight of about 125 visitors and 17 staff members who were holed up at the Jackson Visitors' Center in Paradise. They were brought to fire station in Ashford, where they were interviewed by FBI.Crews had initially planned to keep everyone in a basement with guards. But it was determined to be "better to do it (evacuate) under the cover of darkness than daylight," Pierce County sheriff’s spokesman Ed Troyer said.Evacuee Dinh Jackson, a mother from Olympia, who came to the mountain to sled with family and friends, told The Associated Press that officials ordered people to hurry into the lodge after the shooting.Jackson said officials had everyone get on their knees and place hands behind their heads as they went through the building, looking at faces to make sure the gunman was not among them."That was scary for the kids," she said. Glad I wasn't there. I'd remain standing, throw them my driver's license, and proceed to strip down to my polypro. Go ahead...taze me...those forced-to-kneel families and kids who came up to enjoy snow at Paradise that day aren't the Taliban. Our system should be so much better than that! _______________ Quote
keenwesh Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 seems like a reasonable measure after a ranger was shot and killed less than a mile away... REALLY NOW WHAT WOULD YOU DO? Quote
Raindawg Posted January 3, 2012 Author Posted January 3, 2012 seems like a reasonable measure after a ranger was shot and killed less than a mile away... REALLY NOW WHAT WOULD YOU DO? What I said I'd do above. Where do you think you live, man??? Putting the public ON THEIR KNEES WITH THEIR HANDS BEHIND THEIR HEADS is about two steps beyond what anyone should tolerate. I have no problem answering a few polite questions, showing my driver's license or even putting my hands up to show I'm weapons-free...but ordering a general crowd down like that???? This ain't Damascus! Quote
KirkW Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Dawg, you are right on the money with this one. No one seems to notice that we're living in a police state. Too bad about what happened to all of this guys victims but just because somebody else does something horrible doesn't mean I have to give up my basic civil rights. Quote
FFSummers Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Might have been a little heavy handed, but how would you feel if some dude just shot YOUR coworker? I'm sure they were very upset and, although I DO agree that we live in a police state, in this instance I think they were just doing their jobs in the wake of a terrible trauma. They weren't busting the crowd for dime bags, they were looking for a killer. Quote
olyclimber Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 I would have paid money to see them taze you bro! But I would prefer that you keep your clothes on. Quote
112 Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 ...Putting the public ON THEIR KNEES WITH THEIR HANDS BEHIND THEIR HEADS is about two steps beyond what anyone should tolerate... Even a potential killer??? Seems like you assume everyone was necessarily innocent, but the authorities were still analyzing the situation. It sounds like once the authorities felt they had secured the area, everyone was allowed to stand back up. I had a teacher in 6th grade tell a story about him and his kid face down in the dirt with ants on their face because he matched the description of a recent shooter. Once his identity was established he was free to go. No need for an apology... Quote
keenwesh Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 cops that stop and beat up black people because they're racist fucks or any of the multitude of cops that have harassed me personally for doing nothing is not alright. I have a deep mistrust of police officers because I know firsthand that they will break the law to fuck over people. However if a asshole like this guy just shot up a ranger in a national park and could be trying to conceal himself within a crowd of tourons up at paradise go ahead and get people to kneel and be checked out. better than letting them drive down the road and get the shit shot out of them by a Siega-12 wielding madman. next time you find yourself in such a situation please start whining about your rights and get tazed by a nervous and overeager rook. sure you could sue him afterwards but I think you'd be missing the point. Quote
dougd Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 If ever I saw a thread that should be headed for spray, this would be it. JMHO d Quote
Rafe1234 Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Dawg, you are right on the money with this one. No one seems to notice that we're living in a police state. No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. The police locked down the area to catch a deadly psychopath, whom was far more dangerous to the lives of Americans than a short lockdown of a mountain lodge. Quote
pink Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) Dawg, you are right on the money with this one. No one seems to notice that we're living in a police state. No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. The police locked down the area to catch a deadly psychopath, whom was far more dangerous to the lives of Americans than a short lockdown of a mountain lodge. other than driving, i rarely experience un-polite americans. but then again it doesn't rain every fucking day where i live Edited January 3, 2012 by pink Quote
Raindawg Posted January 3, 2012 Author Posted January 3, 2012 cops that stop and beat up black people because they're racist fucks or any of the multitude of cops that have harassed me personally for doing nothing is not alright. I have a deep mistrust of police officers because I know firsthand that they will break the law to fuck over people. However if a asshole like this guy just shot up a ranger in a national park and could be trying to conceal himself within a crowd of tourons up at paradise go ahead and get people to kneel and be checked out. better than letting them drive down the road and get the shit shot out of them by a Siega-12 wielding madman. next time you find yourself in such a situation please start whining about your rights and get tazed by a nervous and overeager rook. sure you could sue him afterwards but I think you'd be missing the point. Stand on your feet....allow a frisk...they'll find the weapon if you have one....leave the women and kids out of it if they're not suspect. "Put down your snow-play sled, happy family, and run into the happy visitor's center...we'll take care of you....after we got you on your knees with the assumption that you're possibly a deranged killer." I just saw a brief clip of the action in a news report...rows of visitors somehow compelled into Center and lined-up in a humiliating fashion. Maybe they got a soft-serve vanilla ice-cream cone for compensation! I got no problem with them hunting down the perp. and dealing with him....it's how the other folk are treated in the process. It doesn't have to be that way. Quote
Raindawg Posted January 3, 2012 Author Posted January 3, 2012 If ever I saw a thread that should be headed for spray, this would be it. JMHO d You got your wish, dude. Happy new year. (now down on your knees!) :[] Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. Wrong.....we do live in a police state. They have the power to order you around and if you do not comply, you get taszed or beaten or arrested. That is a police state my friend. Quote
rob Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Dawg, you are right on the money with this one. No one seems to notice that we're living in a police state. No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. +1. Calling America a "police state" proves you don't have any fucking idea what a police state is. That doesn't mean there isn't anything wrong with America, but hyperbole never fixed anything. Quote
rob Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. Wrong.....we do live in a police state. They have the power to order you around and if you do not comply, you get taszed or beaten or arrested. That is a police state my friend. the fact that Bone thinks this is a police state proves my point. Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Dawg, you are right on the money with this one. No one seems to notice that we're living in a police state. No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. +1. Calling America a "police state" proves you don't have any fucking idea what a police state is. That doesn't mean there isn't anything wrong with America, but hyperbole never fixed anything. I agree it is not as bad as other places....but a police state it is. Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 No one notices because America is not a police state. People who live in a police state tend to notice. America has laws and police but is certainly not a police state. Wrong.....we do live in a police state. They have the power to order you around and if you do not comply, you get taszed or beaten or arrested. That is a police state my friend. the fact that Bone thinks this is a police state proves my point. You have your opinion....I have mine. Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Police state. You didnt follow my orders....therefore I am arresting you. [video:youtube] Quote
rob Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Please tell me what about this is not the police abusing their power? He felt threatened by her standing there? BS....what about the other 12 people standing there? [video:youtube] Yep, and the fact that he's "abusing his power" is exactly why we are not a police state. If we were a police state, the charges against her wouldn't have been dropped (they were) and her pending lawsuit against the city would not be pending. Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 "Police really need to get it through their heads that they have no right nor authority to simply order anyone they please around and expect it to be done. You are servants. Start acting like it" [video:youtube] Quote
rob Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 You're always going to be able to find examples of retards, kevin. Even among the police. But that doesn't make America a police state. See the distinction? Quote
kevbone Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Police_state A police state is one in which the government exercises rigid and repressive controls over the social, economic and political life of the population. A police state typically exhibits elements of totalitarianism and social control, and there is usually little or no distinction between the law and the exercise of political power by the executive. The inhabitants of a police state experience restrictions on their mobility, and on their freedom to express or communicate political or other views, which are subject to police monitoring or enforcement. Political control may be exerted by means of a secret police force which operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional state You think you are free because you can choose between McDonalds or Burger King. Or travel from here to Cal without papers? You wont be free until you can tell your government "no". Quote
rob Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) Tell them no about what? "No, you can't arrest me for murder?" "No, you can't tax me?" Are you saying the government shouldn't be able to control you for anything? That anyone should just be able to say, "no thanks" ?? What the fuck does that even mean, kev? Anyway, your world view seems to be very black and white, with freedom and anarchy on one side, and totalitarianism and tyranny on the other. But, there are many, many people living in REAL police states that would probably LOVE to change places with you. God, you're like a spoiled kid. No wonder people hate americans -- comparing our country to real police states like North Korea really makes you just kinda sound like a dick. Just saying. Edited January 3, 2012 by rob Quote
wetslide Posted January 3, 2012 Posted January 3, 2012 Police have to have some super-ordinate level of authority over citizens. If they don't- we are basically talking about anarchy on the streets. This does not usurp the rights that we have, but it can infringe on the privileges we enjoy if we violate the law. Quote
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