1930s Mystery Wall - Do you recognize it?

[PhöQ]

Check out this image from Lundin. the valley topography looks familiar as does the little hump on the right of the side rappelling shots.

 

Summit View Linky Linky

 

 

 

[curtveld]

The background skyline in the left picture is the key clue. If you could identify that peak, I think the mystery would be solved.

 

 

Hmmm...anybody else see a resemblance of the "background skyline" to the shadowed left-hand skyline in Paul's pic:

 

Works nicely with the Lowells topo...especially if the crag is lower on the eastern flank of Lundin.

Edited February 3, 2009 by curtveld

[Alex]

 

Likely obvious to everyone, but the photo of the person abseiling on the left are the same person about 12 feet lower, but the same exact spot, as the image on the right.

[obwan]

I was just about ready to side with MattP and Jens - who woulda thunk. His memory at 97 is better than mine.

The rock quality and terrain are starting to add up.

[j_b]

The far rock ridge behind the rappeler seems to gain the better part of 500' or more in a nearly vertical section. There is nothing like that on Red. I'd say the relief on that ridge combined with the crag exposure pretty much rules out the Snoqualmie peaks. Also, I don't think the rock looks right for Lundin.

[Lowell_Skoog]

The far rock ridge behind the rappeler seems to gain the better part of 500' or more in a nearly vertical section. There is nothing like that on Red. I'd say the relief on that ridge combined with the crag exposure pretty much rules out the Snoqualmie peaks. Also, I don't think the rock looks right for Lundin.

 

Good points. I've been having trouble with that too.

 

Here's another thought: How about the area around Slippery Slab Tower and Thunder Mountain, south of Stevens Pass? There's some really good rock in that area, it's accessible, and the peaks are about the right elevation for the alpine look of those pictures.

 

[Stefan]

I am very intrigued by the angle of where the photographer is standing at. It appears the photographer is at the same elevation as the climbers when the climbers are on the rock wall.

 

If that is so, maybe the photographer is standing on a ridge and the rock wall is directly across from this ridge.

 

The photographer is NOT looking up to take the pictures of the guys on the wall in some of the pictures.

Edited February 3, 2009 by Stefan

[beckstead]

A quess: may be the reflection Lake practice area.The Tacoma Mountaineers used to practice there.Somehow, the bottem right photo does not fit, but then again it's a side shot with a background that's a bit hard to place.

[obwan]

Regarding rock bollards, it makes sense for running belays. You guys were really hardcore.

[obwan]

Here is yet another analysis. A Park Ranger friend took this photo of the Reflections Lakes area last summer, it was taken about 100 yards east of The Castle. It appears that the lakes are about a mile away in the photo - matching the TOPO and old photo; if it's less than a mile then maybe it is the practice rock area. A shot from the NE corner of The Castle would be close - being a bit more west and also higher, only issue is the rock quality. Where's Beckey?

[j_b]

You guys were really hardcore.

 

Easy there, I am not that old I know from pictures that rock bollard belays were commonly used before pitons, and my natural tendency to stack the odds in my favor have led me to use them when I wouldn't otherwise set up a belay with anchor.

[j_b]

The slippery slab and thunder mtn area are granodiorite, whereas the rock at mystery crag at times looks like a meta-something. It is just an impression as I can't be sure.

[klenke]

Okay doke, with the help of obwan's second post above, I think I have found where this photo was taken:

 

Here is an image I took of the East Face of The Castle in winter. The area we will be focusing on is the left end of the long snow apron on the lower part of the face where the apron meets the snow slope at circa 6,200 ft.

Here is a summer shot taken by wildstar. Here it is below with an arrow pointing to a particular area of the face:

 

If we zoom in on this face we can see what looks very much like an overhang left of the magenta arrow:

 

With a little detective work, some things match up:

An upper crack (1) of block (4) meets up with a lower crack (3) to meet at a vertex (2). Nearly directly above this vertex is a small feature of rock (5) that looks like a vertical crack. And a little right of the vertex is the overhang (6) the lead climber is underneath. All this is pretty close to the deck (7), which might explain the apparently nonchalant character of the belay. The match up of (1) through (7) is annotated in the two images below:

 

 

Am I 100% positive? Of course not. But this at least gives us something to go on for a future in the field investigation. But that will have to wait until spring when the snow has sufficiently melted back, as my snowy picture above indicates.

[obwan]

Good work Klenke - I knew someone would have a good photo, I take back the comment about rock quality. You have some great photos of the area. It even has a ramp to the left for the photographer mentioned earlier about a level shot. The 100% clincher view would obviously be right up there at the base.

j_b - I think I meant to say "those guys were hardcore" (I'm probably older than you are); that traverse looks pretty hairy and like their sketchy belay, I guess it's ok as long as you don't fall on it.

[denalidave]

Now who is going to go to the same route and re-create the same photo? Should be a fun project for someone nearby next spring.

[Stefan]

The analyst Klenke strikes again!

[G-spotter]

Good work Inspector Klenke!

[Dayhike Mike]

You sure about that Klenke?

 

Here's a tweaked version of the mystery pic and a view from the route up the NE Buttress on Chair Peak.

 

Note the talus field in the foreground, swath of cliff in the middle, and the band of trees that break through that cliff.

 

[img:left]http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3062/3248985425_439ed18aa2_o_d.jpg[/img] [img:right]http://static.flickr.com/93/277947810_b1984fd65f_o.jpg[/img]

[klenke]

Ding Ding Ding! I think we have found the real winners (Chair Peak and Dayhike Mike). At least my erroneous post got you to create a log in and post your correct answer. It is quite obvious to me you are correct.

 

This is why I said I "think" I have found the answer and that I am not 100% positive.

 

Good work. I love peer review.

 

This now makes me think that the rest of the photos are in the Snoqualmie Pass area too.

[Dayhike Mike]

Nah, I just enjoy a good mystery.

 

Besides, I can't take all the credit. I tweaked the pic to bring out more of the image, noticed the lake in the background, and posted it in our Name the Lake thread.

 

Borank was the one who suggested the lake in the background might be the tip of Snow Lake and I simply looked through photos from Chair until I managed to find a matching image that had a similar angle and orientation.

 

It'll be interesting to see where the rest of them are from -- if they're in this same area on Chair, nearby in the ALW, or somewhere else entirely.

[obwan]

A good mystery it was - what, no colored lines? Good work tweaking the definition in the photo - looks like you have the right area, now we just need a close up with those 90 degree blocks. Some of this thread has kept the Pass area alive, due to the type of rock.

Good job!

[Lowell_Skoog]

Bravo!

 

I could have sworn that Klenke's location was correct, but Mike's observations of the cliff and tree patterns have convinced me. I presume that Wolf and Jack are near the base of the east face of Chair Peak in O.P. Dickert's old photo. It would be interesting to duplicate the perspective shown in the photo.

 

Now if we can figure out the textured wall location...

 

I was looking through my notes to refresh my memory of Wolf Bauer's early climbing techniques. The best description is in a 1974 interview conducted by Harry Majors. The interview tape is in U.W. Special Collections. I don't have a copy of it, but my notes can be found here:

 

http://www.alpenglow.org/ski-history/notes/comm/bauer-wolf.html#bauer-wolf-1974-aug-27

 

Wolf talks in this interview about "friction climbing" and "friction belays." He contrasts these techniques with the use of pitons, which he tried to avoid as much as possible. I think when he says "friction" he means something a bit different than what rock climbers mean today. He means using the features of the rock alone, both for holds and for protection. Here's an excerpt from my notes:

 

Tape 182, side 2: In those days, Wolf's philosophy was to try not to "knock iron into the breast of the mountain." Pitons were a necessary evil to be used only when absolutely necessary. He was totally against stepping onto a piton for direct aid. They used rock belays instead of piton belays whenever possible. They climbed using short pitches of "friction climbing" where today you would use long pitches protected with pitons. This technique was slower, and the climbers stayed closer together.

 

I think the O.P. Dickert photos illustrate Wolf's concept of friction climbing, where the rope is passed over features in the rock to protect the climbers. Wolf's 1935 Mountaineers climbing course taught those techniques only, but in 1936 Wolf added instruction in the use of pitons. They used them on the first ascent of Mt Goode that summer.

 

The Majors interview tape at U.W. is 35 years old now. I believe there is only one copy and no complete transcription has ever been made. It would be a great service to Northwest mountaineering history if somebody would make a duplicate of this tape and then convert it to a digital file.

 

 

 

[Stefan]

good job dayhike mike. I wonder if even those are some of the same trees standing there in the new pictures as in the old picture.

[j_b]

Good find Mike. It now seems obvious, doesn't it? . I too thought that Klenke was onto something solid. In case someone is interested, the rock in the picture is a metavolcanic with some other stuff in it.

 

Now, where is mystery crag?

 

Lowell, didn't Dickert also spend some time climbing in the Tetons? but, this might be a wild goose chase.

[Lowell_Skoog]

Now, where is mystery crag?

 

Lowell, didn't Dickert also spend some time climbing in the Tetons? but, this might be a wild goose chase.

 

Yes he did. His collection includes a few pictures taken during the 1939 Mountaineers outing to the Tetons, when the Hossack-MacGowan route was established on the Grand. There are no action shots from that trip that I've noticed. I don't have a list of the participants handy, but I'm pretty sure Wolf Bauer was not on that trip.

 

Wolf himself said recently that he thought the mystery wall pictures were taken on Lundin, but it's hard to know whether his memory is correct on that.