Jump to content
  • Announcements

    • olyclimber

      WELCOME TO THE CASCADECLIMBERS.COM FORUMS   02/03/18

      We have upgraded to new forum software as of late last year, and it makes everything here so much better!  It is now much easier to do pretty much anything, including write Trip Reports, sell gear, schedule climbing related events, and more. There is a new reputation system that allows for positive contributors to be recognized,  it is possible to tag content with identifiers, drag and drop in images, and it is much easier to embed multimedia content from Youtube, Vimeo, and more.  In all, the site is much more user friendly, bug free, and feature rich!   Whether you're a new user or a grizzled cascadeclimbers.com veteran, we think you'll love the new forums. Enjoy!
Sign in to follow this  
Retrosaurus

Dan's Dreadful Direct restored

Recommended Posts

It made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside as I levered out the first bolt. And a powerful sense of satisfaction came over me as I hacksawed the bottom (1/2") bolt and hammered the stump of the stud back into the hole.

The route is now in as close to original condition as it has been since some nameless chickenshit recently perforated it with a power drill and studded it with stainless steel. Many of the bolts were a foot or two from good nut placements, not that that should matter. But I guess the retro-bolters didn't have any nuts; they had a drill instead.

I wasn't alone on this project, but was assisted by a couple of other community service minded individuals that I will not name but will let come forward if they choose to. Besides, think of the fun it will be to speculate. Although, that shouldn't be much of a challenge.

Now, one more time.

Does any one know the names of the "experienced, well-respected, PNW climbers" that should have been smart enough to know better than to retro-bolt on Castle Rock. I figure that they owe me $8.59 plus tax for a severely damaged, but still usable 36-inch crowbar.

Not while this dinosaur walks the earth.

Mitch

(Anyone know where I can get a 48-inch crowbar?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What, you want to make this some kind of war?

You think you deserve a medal?

Maybe I should go rally up a posse and go put bolts up next to Godzilla. Then I'll rap down and strip 'em with a crowbar. I'd do it just to piss you lame asses off. I'd be following in Hardings footsteps.

The fact is that what you did is'nt really going to make a difference to anyone. All that it means is one less safe lead climb at Castle Rock. I am sure every climber that passes by that spot is really going to appreciate your handiwork, sure... Why don't you go pull off all those rusty old bolts all over the Lower wall while your at it. No one does those climbs anyway.

Your fighting a pointless battle Retro. Face it man, your ethic is dead in this day and age. Get over it. Let people climb safely and be happy. If you don't like the bolts, don't clip 'em. There are plenty of other climbs with ground fall potential, go find one and get on it. Good luck...

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dude,

You could have just said something to the effect of "DDD has been restored". Why all the swagger? I don't necessarily agree or disagree with what you did. It just seems you're trying to stir shit up for no useful reason.

Jim

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You do it your way.

I'll do it mine.

(Just leave established routes alone.)

(And don't place bolts beside cracks. Even if you only have quick draws; and no nuts.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know what, Jim is right.

I don't even really care about the stupid route, or the whole bolting controversy.

Bolts next to cracks piss me off too.

It's your freakin' attitude that gets my goat, I mean Lamb...

I bet you feel as self rightious as that french guy Luc, who put a chisel to some of the best boulder problems in the world just to prove a point.

I'd just like to see any of you guys get up on DDD now that its restored. I'll give ya a good belay, I promise...

[This message has been edited by lambone (edited 07-20-2001).]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Originally posted by lambone:

I'd just like to see any of you guys get up on DDD now that its restored. I'll give ya a good belay, I promise...

That's just it. I'm not good enough to get up it without the bolts; but there are people who are. It is just wrong to bring the climb down to my level just so that I can get up it.

You need to look at the climb closely. There is gear available all over it. Chances are that if only the unprotectable section had had a bolt added, there would not have been such an issue. Not that adding bolts to an exixting line is OK either; it's not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see your point. I have never placed a bolt, rivit, or chipped a hold in my life. I am not interested in dangerous crag routes, or ones that are way above my limit. I don't go there, please don't start threatening me.

(that goes for you caveman)

My opinion is this: people shouldn't bolt routes only to suite their needs. They are basicaly commiting an act of vandalism on public or private land as it is. Therefore, they should bolt a route in a manner that is safe for everyone that has to look at them. I'm not talking about Vantage 2ft spreads. I'm talking about not hitting the ground. It is selfish, and wrong to do otherwise.

Ok, sure... puting a bolt next to a crack is a different issue. It's lame, enough said. But in my opinion, if someone goes out and retrobolts a route, the damage is done. The scar is there. You might as well make the best out of it. What the hell good does it do to go out and chop a route leaving a gnarly hunk of metal in the rock, just to prove your point.

If you say that bolts shouldn't be placed when you can toprope a route, well then hell you'd better buy alot of crowbars! You'll be up in the Icicle for months.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

quote:

Originally posted by lambone:

Ok, sure... puting a bolt next to a crack is a different issue. It's lame, enough said. But in my opinion, if someone goes out and retrobolts a route, the damage is done. The scar is there. You might as well make the best out of it. What the hell good does it do to go out and chop a route leaving a gnarly hunk of metal in the rock, just to prove your point.

You need the benefit of before and after pictures.

The damage that was done is now minimized.

The route is returned to its original climbing condition; no easier, no harder.

The "gnarly hunk of metal" has been hammered below the surface of the rock and can be patched to further restore the original appearance.

And that crowbar. $8.59 PLUS TAX!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Excellent work guys. If you hadn't done that one long time climber/Leavenworth resident was fixing to do it. You saved him some work. I look forward to going to Castle rock to check out your job. It sounds like you did a good job.

I hope the bolters learn a little about seeking a true concensus before bolting.

Poor lamebone one less sport route for you to climb. tongue.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disgusting Mitch! You should have just left it alone. (especially if your not going to step up to the plate and lead it) I don't know why they bolted it, there is plenty of new lines to be done, but I definitely don't feel it should have been chopped! Keep your crowbar, you can use it to pry your head out of your ass!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

asdf

 

[This message has been edited by Cpt.Caveman (edited 07-20-2001).]

 

[ 09-19-2002, 11:05 AM: Message edited by: Cpt.Caveman ]

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

quote:

Originally posted by lambone:

Ok, sure... puting a bolt next to a crack is a different issue. It's lame, enough said. But in my opinion, if someone goes out and retrobolts a route, the damage is done. The scar is there. You might as well make the best out of it. What the hell good does it do to go out and chop a route leaving a gnarly hunk of metal in the rock, just to prove your point.

If you say that bolts shouldn't be placed when you can toprope a route, well then hell you'd better buy alot of crowbars! You'll be up in the Icicle for months.

Lammy, the only bolt that was left in was the bottom 1/2 incher so the rock is not scarred as you might think. We will go back and cover that one up soon as well. The damage is not done and that is simply a weak statement in support for the act that occurred.

As for needing a lot of crowbars in the icicle I dont think so. I personally think of established routes on the Castle are historic and should be left alone. I this situation I don't think this is a war but more like a restoration with a small message is all.

 

-Cpt

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bravo, guys. Job well done.

Retro, I'll send you a private e-mail and would be more than happy to reimburse you the $8 and some cents. How much for the crowbar?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes bolts next to cracks should be chopped!!! every time you see them. It sends a message to the people bolting the cracks, that its lame and it wont stay that way. Have some balls or find something else to do and dont threaten people on the internet thats totally balless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was the third chopper.

It should be noted that we did leave the two "lower off" bolts and ring in place for future top-rope ascents/rehersal.

The route and rock appear much better and in character with the rest of the crag. The bottom bolt is chopped (if there was any confusion), although being a 1/2 incher it required hacksawing and tapping the shaft back into the hole. The coming hole patch will render it invisible and there is no shaft protruding from the rock. The remainder of the bolts came out in their entirety. At least three of the offensive bolts had very good gear placements within an easy arms-reach of the bolt. These were not "dangerous" or "sketchy" placements, if they were aid pieces they would all be A1.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, goody! I was wondering what stupid redundant topic we were gonna rage about for the next few months. I'm trying to be objective and hold my tongue but this is just too much. Climbing's version of a drunken brawl. This should make everyone so much more open and cooperative. Kinda reminds me of a child custody battle. Everyone walks away but the kid (rock) is the one who suffers. Sleep well my vigilante heroes.

By the way, how is that climb, anyway? I know it's too hard for me, but surely you guys ran a few laps while you were up there.

Oh, yea, I've got $8.59. I'll trade you for the hangers you pocketed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well just my opinion, I think you guys have done a good thing, in increasingly bad style.

Do it and then just shut up!! The way you're going on about it, you look like a bunch of idiots.

A little reserve and humility go along way.

Rgds

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Viktor,

If the retro-bolter(s) had been "open and cooperative" they would have:

1. Admitted to being the culprits instead of hiding their identity.

2. Respected the future of trad climbing and never bolted an established trad-line in the first place.

I know for a fact that the bolter(s) were aware that their identity was requested to be divulged. They declined. They were offered the chance to remedy the situation themselves, again they declined.

Talk is cheap. We can sit here at our little boxes and rant all day, but until someone steps up and puts forth the effort to right the wrongs we're just a bunch of spray-lords. We took that step and made the effort. Pontificating may make the work day pass more quickly, but until you've looked at the history of the route and area and, the line itself (before and after), and the gear placements, you're just making noise. The line is now more aesthetic, and the tope rope anchors can easily be reached, nothing had been taken away from those who may want to climb the line but aren't up to leading it and the challenge has been restored for those who want to rise to the occasion. Anyone clipping the bolts and then claiming a "lead" of this route are disillusioned at best. "Action photos" will be forthcoming. Maybe we'll even put on a clinic on how to chop effectively. YMMV

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×