ASmith Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 I am setting up a few trips for next year to Rainier and to Denali and would like to get any feedback on which guide services are prefered. I am considering RMI, Alpine Ascents International and International Mountain Guides. You thoughts and comments please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron_Goodman Posted October 21, 2007 Share Posted October 21, 2007 (edited) I did a Denali Prep trip on the Ruth Glacier with American Alpine Institute a couple of years back and have signed up for a Denali climb with them this spring. All my experiences with them have been very good. A friend did their alpine course on Baker and was satisfied. Edited October 22, 2007 by Ron_Goodman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASmith Posted October 21, 2007 Author Share Posted October 21, 2007 Thanks for the input. I am preparing a private, 6 day Himalayan Seminar, probalbly three camps with a night or two at the summit on Mt. Rainier in June/July 2008 and have a spot or to open???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody48 Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 Since I am from Massachusetts and had never climbed in the Cascades before, I climbed with RMI when I climbed Ranier a few years ago. We had signed up for the Camp Muir Seminar and had a great time including getting to the summit. With this training and experience we went back to the cascades and climbed Hood and Adams this past summer independently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goatboy Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 In reading your post, it sounds like you're planning to spend a night (or two?) on the summit of Mt Rainier??? Please discuss your trip objectives and how this itinerary will help you meet them. Also, I am curious as to how this Cascade Climb will constitute a "Himalayan" Seminar??? Best wishes, Goatboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 Yeah, I'm curious about this Himalayan seminar on top of Rainier. I don't think the top of Rainier is high enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 Yeah, I'm curious about this Himalayan seminar on top of Rainier. I don't think the top of Rainier is high enough. It'll prepare you perfectly to sit on your ass in base camp while the sherpas do the actual climbing. I imagine they'll throw in some short roping for when the guide drags your ass to the top and perhaps a "tortured triumphal summit picture 101" section to capture that epic moment for posterity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Couloir Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 Yeah, I'm curious about this Himalayan seminar on top of Rainier. I don't think the top of Rainier is high enough. RMI offers a 6-day Expedition Seminar in both the summer and winter. Perhaps this is what he's referring to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 Learning technical skills is a good thing when you're just starting to climb. After that I would say just go climbing on your own. First pick some easy goals then up the pace. If you feel like your still missing something then maybe sign up for a short course in the subject or do some more reading. The whole concept of expedition training is beyond me, and I've seen folks who were being guided on Denali and Everest. All I can say is you better work hard at saving money if you want to be guided in the Himalayas. If I were to make a plug for a buddy I'd say sign up for a course with Mountain Madness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Climzalot Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 (edited) http://aai.cc/guideservices.asp Some info on factors to consider when choosing a guide service from the American Alpine Institutes's Denali page. The idea of an expedition training program in a low altitude environment, and in conditions that are likely to be very different than what you would encounter on the actual expedition is contrived to say the least. That having been said, such a program is a great way for guides and climbers to get to know each other, and spend some time learning about the strategic and technical differences between the expedition approach as it compares to the alpine style that most folks are familiar with. Since most guide services have their own unique strategies when it comes to expedition climbing, I think most of the benefits of the training would be lost if you train with one company/group and climb with another. It makes a lot of sense to keep it all within company and/or group of climbers. Edited October 22, 2007 by Climzalot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faster_than_you Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 If I were to make a plug for a buddy I'd say sign up for a course with Mountain Madness What's actually going on over there? I found this in the Seattle Times. It doesn't seem very positive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 If I were to go with a guide I'd spring the $$ and hire a private guide to build up a good relationship - the same as I would with a climbing partner I planned to go on a big, long, expensive expedition with. edit; Mountain Madness sold for <$200,000 back in 1997? Goddamn there is no money in guiding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 What's actually going on over there? I found this in the Seattle Times. It doesn't seem very positive. I disagree. The article suggests the appraised value of the company was not as high as the inheritor wanted. The value of this business, like other service businesses, may lie primarily in its brand and/or the cache of its service providers. The younger a business, the more the value lies in its providers. If a key provider leaves or dies that will diminish the value of the enterprise. Older businesses, with more established track records and brand recognition, will take less of a hit when one or two key people leave. These factors would be true of any guiding business, so I don't think it speaks to the quality of MM as a guide service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 If I were to make a plug for a buddy I'd say sign up for a course with Mountain Madness What's actually going on over there? I found this in the Seattle Times. It doesn't seem very positive. All I have to say is Big Ron rules. Of course one would have to know a Tippy Turtle to know what I'm talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythosgrl Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 I use mainly the BHGS (Blake Herrington Guide Service). However, when I was 18 I climbed Mt. Rainier with my dad and we used RMI (i am embarassed to admit that now that I know how to do all that stuff we paid them to do for us). Our guide was really knowledgeable and had climbed all over the world. We had a great time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faster_than_you Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 What's actually going on over there? I found this in the Seattle Times. It doesn't seem very positive. I disagree. The article suggests the appraised value of the company was not as high as the inheritor wanted. The value of this business, like other service businesses, may lie primarily in its brand and/or the cache of its service providers. The younger a business, the more the value lies in its providers. If a key provider leaves or dies that will diminish the value of the enterprise. Older businesses, with more established track records and brand recognition, will take less of a hit when one or two key people leave. These factors would be true of any guiding business, so I don't think it speaks to the quality of MM as a guide service. I think the article says a lot more. It mentions some misinformation (withheld) during the search. It also mentions the poor working relationship w/ others during the search. That reflects on everyone involved. It also mentions a greiving mother who somehow doesn't feel too connected w/ the company her daughter owned. That is supported and reflected by an absurb comment from the chairman of the board who actually said to the press about the entire affair, "Disappointment was born of expectation." What sensitivity! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted October 22, 2007 Share Posted October 22, 2007 I've taken a couple classes with North Cascades Mountain Guides, and really like them....the guides and the classes. They are very amenable to doing small custom trips. That said, I'm not sure how much they get involved with big mountain expedition type climbing. They mostly work out of the Washington Pass areas I think. Last I talked to them over there, they were hoping to get a permit under the new Rainier system....not sure how that shook out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
layton Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 Choose the American Alpine Institute. Great guides and great staff...and they teach you a lot. I learned to climb with them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cj001f Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 What's actually going on over there? I found this in the Seattle Times. It doesn't seem very positive. I disagree. The article suggests the appraised value of the company was not as high as the inheritor wanted. The value of this business, like other service businesses, may lie primarily in its brand and/or the cache of its service providers. The younger a business, the more the value lies in its providers. If a key provider leaves or dies that will diminish the value of the enterprise. Older businesses, with more established track records and brand recognition, will take less of a hit when one or two key people leave. These factors would be true of any guiding business, so I don't think it speaks to the quality of MM as a guide service. I think the article says a lot more. It mentions some misinformation (withheld) during the search. It also mentions the poor working relationship w/ others during the search. That reflects on everyone involved. It also mentions a greiving mother who somehow doesn't feel too connected w/ the company her daughter owned. That is supported and reflected by an absurb comment from the chairman of the board who actually said to the press about the entire affair, "Disappointment was born of expectation." What sensitivity! Aren't you a guide? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jens Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 Do go to Europe. ---------------- Don't go with NOLS (if you call it a guide service). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 I remember thousands of times in the mountains when a partner and I would see a guided group. More often than not I would here somebody say: Fuck Another Guide or FAG for short. Take some classes, but real climbing is done with yourself and a partner you trust. If you're going to some foreign country then you may be required to have a liaison officer. A guide might help if you need to understand local politics, but past that I wouldn't use one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bug Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 Guides need to make money. That is where you come in. At ropeup this year there were at least a couple guides hangin with rest of us. And while they are good climbers and totally respectable, I would not consider them to be a cut above many of the other climbers present. So, what Feck says is true. Climb. Find a compatible partner/partners and get out there. As for the Himilayan seminar on Rainier, I am sure they know what they are doing. Altitude tollerance is probably not a big part of the seminar I would guess. However people who are very sensitive to altitude will find out on Rainier. There are a lot of other things to learn about techniques, styles, and logistics. What better place to learn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 Guides need to make money. That is where you come in. At ropeup this year there were at least a couple guides hangin with rest of us. And while they are good climbers and totally respectable, I would not consider them to be a cut above many of the other climbers present. So, what Feck says is true. Climb. Find a compatible partner/partners and get out there. As for the Himilayan seminar on Rainier, I am sure they know what they are doing. Altitude tollerance is probably not a big part of the seminar I would guess. However people who are very sensitive to altitude will find out on Rainier. There are a lot of other things to learn about techniques, styles, and logistics. What better place to learn? Bug - Good climbers are not necessarily good teachers That said, I think you are an example of a very experienced alpinist who likes to take Noobs out and show them the ropes....a lot of great climbers are not so inclined. If they had the choice between spending a Saturday creeping up the R&D route, or sending a tough 5.9/5.10 grade IV alpine route, they'd choose the latter. If you have an experienced climber buddy whose willing to show you the ropes, go for it, but I think many folks would not feel comfortable asking an experienced climber to sacrifice their own ambitions to teach them. The nice thing about a guide is you pay them the bucks, and they are literally at your service. You don't have to feel bad about bogging them down with questions and skills teaching. I've taken two classes from North Cascades Mountain Guides and one from Mountain Madness. I've also tried to climb with more experienced people than I. By taking the classes, I felt more confident to commit to climbs with folks as I didn't feel like I'd be a liability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bug Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 HEY! Back off. I have more shrimp. Yes you are right but what usually happens is you find someone about your own level and do the climbs you can. As you gain experience, you also make better use of info from reading books, this board, and talking with other climbers at rope up, pub club, rockfest, feathered friends events etc. If you are "cool", some better climbers will be willing to go out with one or both of you and you pick up skills by watching and cleaning and talking. If you can afford guide then go for it. Around here, there are a lot of good ones. The list of "bad" ones is probably a lot shorter than the list of good ones. My main point is, no matter who you are with, you still have toget out there. If you get and climb and keep doing it, you will get better pretty fast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Posted October 23, 2007 Share Posted October 23, 2007 I think the article says a lot more. It mentions some misinformation (withheld) during the search. It also mentions the poor working relationship w/ others during the search. That reflects on everyone involved. It also mentions a greiving mother who somehow doesn't feel too connected w/ the company her daughter owned. That is supported and reflected by an absurb comment from the chairman of the board who actually said to the press about the entire affair, "Disappointment was born of expectation." What sensitivity! _________________________ I agree with all your points. I expect that the press worked to ferret out any conflict and controversy to put in the article, so the portrait may be a little skewed. Peace and harmony just doesn't sell copy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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