letsroll Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 I put this in the rock forum instead of the gear forum. Seemed a more direct place to get my questions answered. If this is not correct please feel free to move. I am thinking about picking up some ascenders. My choice is between the Peztl ascention or the Black Diamond nForce. The Peztl is the classic and the ones I would have purchased till I read the review on RC.com. The reviewer noted that the BD ascenders would be good one icy ropes, in the big wall book I am reading the make also note that ascenders of a simular type are good on icy ropes. I don't want to buy more gear than I have to, so one set is the goal. Has anybody used the DB nForce??? Would the Peztl work as well as the DB style in icy conditions??? The reviewer on RC said that the BD were not too bad to work, or not at least any harder to work than the Peztl. I am going to do some aiding next month but would like the option of having the gear for some bigger climbs in the winter that I have my eye one if I get things figured out this fall hence the icy rope question. But mostly I just want to buy only ONE set Also I noticed on the Peztl and the Yates ascenders that they have two holes on the bottom to clip into. How important is this?? I guess the Yates are an option as well, are these any better than the others? While I am asking questions there has been refereces to offset nuts. What are these? How are they different than regular nuts? I have the BD nut set for reference. (please forgive any spelling errors) Quote
Sherri Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 As I understand it, the patent for the Yates Rocker was bought by Singing Rock, so you may have better luck locating one if you search for it under the new manufacturer's name. Link to website selling new Rocker. I tried mine out for the first time this weekend, TR soloing some short easy stuff. Love it so far. Quote
counterfeitfake Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 Hey, if you EVER jug an icy rope, make sure you come back and update this thread with your impressions. Quote
rob Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 While I am asking questions there has been refereces to offset nuts. What are these? How are they different than regular nuts? I have the BD nut set for reference. offset nuts have different widths on either side, which helps in flaring placements Quote
letsroll Posted August 14, 2007 Author Posted August 14, 2007 Well Counterfeitfake there is nothing like planning for the worst and hope for the best. Maybe that is just me. I hope to god I never have to jug icy ropes and don't plan to. To be sure if I ever have to I will let you know how it went after I clean out my shorts. Rob thanks for the info. I just have not come across those and have yet to see a placement for them. But I have not been looking. Offset cams yes, but not nuts. Quote
fenderfour Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 I like the simplicity of the Petzl Ascenders. There are a few other companies (Yates, Jumar, etc..) that make a similar unit with a single pivot. The new BD nForce ascenders have multiple pivots. These could get crudded up over time. When aid climbing, simple is almost always better. Any toothed ascender will grip an icy rope. The Petzl units have been used on Everest and Denali for years with no trouble. Offset nuts kick ass. The old HB aluminum offsets were good for free climbing as well as aid. THey set in big pin scars like nothing else. Sadly, they are out of production. DMM has picked up the design and will be shipping new anodized sets in April. In the meantime, pick up some larger brass offsets. I have a couple sets of Metolius Astro nuts and a few sets of BD micros. The biggest 5 sizes are good replacements for the #1-4 nuts that come with a regular set of stoppers. Quote
hemp22 Posted August 14, 2007 Posted August 14, 2007 the offsets nuts are hard to find - they used to be made by HB before they went under. The smaller ones (brass) are now only available at http://www.yosemitegifts.com/hboffsets.html the larger ones are theoretically going to be re-released by DMM next summer. Quote
billcoe Posted August 16, 2007 Posted August 16, 2007 Letsroll, 1 word, 1 word for the graduate: HB. If I was only buying 1 set, I would buy these: HB Ascenders $79 for 2 - heavier duty and better trigger release than the Petzls. Joseph bought a set of the Nforces, they are heavier, and I don't like the way the teeth open, I could see myself f*ucking my skin up if I didn't have a wall glove on when taking it off a rope. BTW, I love the small offset nuts have several sets. The larger ones are OK, but ....eh....they're OK, some folks think they are special. I bought a set, if you want to see them, let me know and I'll drag them over and you can compare them heads on to the Petzls. Quote
Highlander Posted August 16, 2007 Posted August 16, 2007 (edited) Petzl Ascenders are the Standard, I have used mine for many years and have been up El Cap numerous times, in my opinion no other ascender is close. They are light weight and are the easiest and quickest for unclipping on and off the rope, which is a big plus on steep walls. The BD's are a bit ackward to unclip off the rope. Edited August 16, 2007 by Highlander Quote
DRep Posted August 16, 2007 Posted August 16, 2007 I have used the petzl ascensions and just bought the N-Force. I think the ascensions work good and smooth, but the N-Force does in fact feel more secure. I am happy with them because they are much more sheath friendly than the petzl/yates/HB/anyothers due to the angle of the teeth. People say that the N-Force is more harsh on the core of the rope, but when BD tested them to failure, the rope actually faired better than all the hardware!!! It's up to you, but the N-force are definitely awesome. and if you like to take pics when ice climbing you're probably going to jug an icy rope!!!! Quote
dan_forester Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 HB Ascenders $79 for 2 - heavier duty and better trigger release than the Petzls. that sounds like a really reasonable price! BTW, I love the small offset nuts have several sets. The larger ones are OK, but ....eh....they're OK, some folks think they are special. know anyone wanting to sell of a set of small offsets? Quote
JosephH Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 Yeah, I have both Petzl Ascensions and BD NForces. My conclusion? I want the NForce teeth on the Ascensions. So far I'm preferring the Petzl units. HB aluminum offset nuts - it doesn't get any better, so I guess I fall into the category of folks who think they're special. I stocked up on a few sets when HB went under and am glad I did. I'll believe DMM will get them out when I see them hanging in a store. I'm also bummed out that they changed the colors on them and aren't going to epoxy them both of which really sucks - one you could easily do something about, the other is a bit more difficult. Neither is an "improvement". Oh, and I'd happily buy any #8 or #9 HB aluminum offsets from any of you folks who think they're just ok. Quote
Otto Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 Jumars are the Standard! Not saying HB or Petzl aren't better, though, just not the Standard! Quote
billcoe Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 Dan, have you looked specifically at the HB's? Otto, they cost more and weigh more. Work good. Quote
dan_forester Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 bill, you mean the hb ascenders? I'm not looking for ascenders but if I was I'd consider taking advantage of that price. I've got a pair of the petzels which seem to work pretty well. Quote
billcoe Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 Highlander = Dan BTW, WTF you been? Yer growing old dude....don't let it pass ya.... Quote
dan_forester Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 ? you know what, that's some good advice, as usual. Quote
Highlander Posted August 17, 2007 Posted August 17, 2007 Highlander = Dan BTW, WTF you been? Yer growing old dude....don't let it pass ya.... I got addicted to wall climbing, and spending way too much time in Yosemite. Quote
letsroll Posted August 18, 2007 Author Posted August 18, 2007 Thanks for info guys. I will look into the HB's. I hope to give the Petzl's a try some time soon. I am going to set up a traverse in my garage to pratice cleaning a traverse. Can't quite picture it in my head after reading about it, so better try it on the ground than on the route. If I find any offset nuts then I will grab some and let you all know. Think I will try to borrow all the gear I can this trip just to test it all out to ensure I know what I am looking for. Fenderfour, How many sets of the BD micro's do you have and how many sets of the Metolius offsets do you have?? Quote
billcoe Posted August 18, 2007 Posted August 18, 2007 I got addicted to wall climbing, and spending way too much time in Yosemite. Is that even possible !? Quote
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