bellemontagne Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 Yeah, I know this is *a little* off topic, but I have some questions about a backcountry boot and binding setup for my snowboard (a lovely Ride Timeless). I am purchasing, new boots and might go with Salomon or Northwave boots and strap bindings. However, I am contemplating purchasing hardshell step-in bindings (they have a front and rear bail-they look like crampon bindings) and using plastic mountaineering boots instead of a traditional snowboard boot/binding setup. Has anyone used this kind of setup for snowboarding before? Likes / dislikes / raves / complaints? Let me know if you have any kind of experience with this setup. Thanks!! Quote
fleblebleb Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 Off topic? The hell it is! Doesn't someone here know all about this? Cuz I sure would like to find out, too. I want to be able to split board up to an alpine climb in winter conditions, do the climb on crampons or aiders in the same boots, and ride back down. I wouldn't mind buying one new pair of boots for all of this, but would be way happy if I could just continue to use my trusty Salomon M9Gs. Anyone? Quote
payaso Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 I've been pondering the same question for a while now so I'm interested as well. I currently ride an original K2 (back when they were made in the good ol USA) Eldo board with clicker bindings and don't want to enter the real backcountry with this system. The boots aren't comfy enough for a lot of climbing, etc. Mostly I would look for a comfortable set of boots that you can comfortably ride in, and wear snowshoes in, and strap on some crampons. A subtle yet important combination. When I get the cash this is on the ever present "to buy list." I too would like to hear from some successful backcountry boarders out there!! By the way, what's the product to secure your board to your pack. I don't really want to buy a whole new pack for carrrying this one piece of equipment. Quote
freeclimb9 Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 the professional set-up, as described to me by pro-climber Steve Koch (who's on his way to completing his "Quest" to ride the seven summits) is Dynafit LTLAT boots with Burton step-in bindings (they're like crampon bindings) and board. However, the bindings are tough to find (I'm not sure Burton makes them anymore). An alternate binding is the plate binding made by Voile. Koch rides a solid deck. With regard to a split board, the Voile is said to be not as rigid as the Burton split board. But the Burton board doesn't have as durable construction. This set-up makes more sense to me than strap bindings because 1) weight and 2) bulkiness are minimized. They'd carry more easily on a pack than strap bindings, plus it's easier to kick steps with a hard boot. With regard to using mountaineering boots for boarding, it's fine in the powder. But for holding an edge on crust, there's just not the same ankle support, and it's tough on the lower leg muscles. I've used Makalus and Salomon M9guides on my board (after boot-packing a trail --I don't have a split board. Yet.), and it's doable. But I've been thinking hard about investing in the Dynafits and a split board. (I'd use the Dynafits for resort boarding too, if I got 'em). BTW, the Dynafit boots are crampon compatible, and climb ice well. Complaints about them are pretty much limited to the delicacy of the buckles. Dynafit boots: http://www.life-link.com/dynafit.htm Voile Plate bindings: http://www.voile-usa.com/snowboards/index.html#1120 There's heel throw and toe throw models. I hope this info helps. Anybody have other ideas, or suggestions? Quote
robertm Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 I use my Saloman SMG9 mountaineering boots with Burton Pro bindings... it works great no need for the moon boots. Quote
JasonG Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 Quit your useless hiking and get a split board! I did and haven't looked back. The burton is not as durable (tried it out for awhile last year), and the binding system is kind of a pain. The burton skins are way better than the Voile (full length skins that attach to tip and tail, Voile's only attach on the tips). Still, I've been pleased with this year's Voile 173. Just about as fast as tele/AT gear on the way up and much faster on the way down. Plus you can use you plastic boots in whatever two-strap binding you have and it works fine (if you want to approach a climb for example). Just my two cents . . . Quote
vegetablebelay Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 Heinrich - How much of a problem is traversing steep, hard, slopes when the sidecut of a board only allows the tip and the tail to touch the surface? Quote
JasonG Posted January 14, 2002 Posted January 14, 2002 Traversing icy snow isn't that much fun with a split board due to its width. Possibly with stiffer boots (Dynafit, etc) and plate bindings it might be easier. Voile and Burton both sell crampons that are supposed to make traversing icy stuff easier. Haven't tried them yet . . . Quote
slaphappy Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 A version of this topic has been discussed before but I will toss my opinion out there once again. I ride in my plastic boots (Asolo AFS 5000) with strap on aluminum baseplate bindings on a 168 Glissade (plastic bindings are too flexible and break). Other than the fore-mentioned plate setup (have tried that as well) there is no better set up for edge control. (Be sure you have the ability to adjust the forward lean on your strap binding.) Although I have never used a splitboard I have friends who do and both have had reliability issues with them this season. Unless your purely using the setup as an approach tool, why sacrifice the performance on the way down by using a split board? Not to mention the difficulties when traversing on hardpack in ski mode. Snowshoes work well with plastic boots and I will sometimes bring along aluminum crampons as well. A proficient freeheeler is a bit faster on the way up but not by enough to sacrifice performance and adaptability. The only drawback I have found is after five or six hours of riding your calves can take quite a beating, but the simple solution to that is to quit riding lift served areas! Quote
payaso Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 It's quite refreshing that this topic on snowboard mountaineering hasn't drawn the usual suspects out from their cubicles yet. They'll find it but it sure is nice without em! Quote
panther Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 Keep antagonizing and see what happens twinkie... Quote
Dru Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 "Steve Koch (who's on his way to completing his "Quest" to ride the seven summits) " ooh that 5m long strip of glacial ice on Carstenz Pyramid must have been a real blast. Or if this is the one he hasnt rid yet he better get there fast before it melts! Quote
freeclimb9 Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Dru: "Steve Koch (who's on his way to completing his "Quest" to ride the seven summits) "ooh that 5m long strip of glacial ice on Carstenz Pyramid must have been a real blast. Or if this is the one he hasnt rid yet he better get there fast before it melts! Yea, it's a contrivance. But apparently marketable. He's just got Everest left to ride. Check his website for a Beastie Boy sample: www.stephenkoch.comHe's done some first descents in the Tetons that are amazing like the Black Ice couloir, not to mention the solo ascents there (like VisionQuest). Closer to the NW, he did the first descent of Mt. Hood's North Face.Pretty cool stuff, IMO. Quote
Dru Posted January 15, 2002 Posted January 15, 2002 sounds like his route with marko prezelj on denali is the badness from last spring. Quote
genepires Posted January 16, 2002 Posted January 16, 2002 Cool topic dude, About using a plate system with plastic boots. The boots used for plate bindings have very little flex when leaning backwards. This translates power on a heal turn. Most plastic boots allow some back leaning which will give you less power on a heal turn. Hard boots are more like ski boots. I have been doing backcountry for many years now, mainly near baker but now around snoqualmie. I've been using the regular snowshoe setup nut got a split board a couple of years ago and really enjoy it. If you got the cash, go that way. Otherwise, a regular board will work. Irregardless of the board you get, get a good board carrying pack. I've carried the split board when the snow is hard. Avi gear of course too.One thing to think about, When using my leather mountaineering boots, I have found that the highbacks are higher than the boots. (unlike regular board boots) That gap between the low boot and the higher highback causes some pain in those long runs. Koflach used to make a backcountry boot that was very high with a rigid full shank sole. Check them out if they still make it. Would be great for mountainerring too.Drop me a line if you are looking for backcountry partners. genepires@hotmail.com Quote
slaphappy Posted January 16, 2002 Posted January 16, 2002 For what it's worth... I found the plate bindings needed to be turned too far forward creating a less stable stance than a normal strap binding that uses a more perpendicular and wider stance. (Of course that depends on the width of your deck and the length of your foot.) The old Burton binding I used had a rear bail and toe lever, similar to a crampon if you put it on backwards. The stance I prefer created way too much toe and heal drag to be tolerable. It is not an ideal setup for general freeriding although, as I said before, your edge control is amazing. This is likely the reason Steve Koch uses that setup to cross large sections of steep ice. Sick! * Gene's comments about plastic boots are accurate. [ 01-15-2002: Message edited by: slaphappy ] Quote
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