Proper Belay Technique

[Raindawg]

If you happen to belay with an alpine bod harness or if you do like many old timers do and put your parabiner through both tie-in points on your harness, then your orientation is either "left" or "right", not up or down, as with a belay loop.

 

Hey Cathead: enough of the "old timer"/old "skewl" crap. Why don't you just call it "safe timer"/ safe school. I'm surprised they don't teach the "clip the tie-in points" method at "The Mountaineers".

Ask your buddy Todd Skinner about his new timer/ new "skewl" belay loop.

[hippos_are_evil]

Didn't Todd Skinner's belay loop break because he had a daisy girth hitched to it so that it got worn down in one spot and eventually failed?

 

Going with that, is the main issue with putting a biner through the tie-in points that it can get tri-axial loaded in certain situations?

[billcoe]

Ask your buddy Todd Skinner about his new timer/ new "skewl" belay loop.

 

If you were going for humor Dwayner, you might double check it cause you come off sounding like a cold, mean spirited (insert rude word here).

 

Which I'm pretty sure you are not.

 

Regards;

 

Bill

[catbirdseat]

Didn't Todd Skinner's belay loop break because he had a daisy girth hitched to it so that it got worn down in one spot and eventually failed?

 

Going with that, is the main issue with putting a biner through the tie-in points that it can get tri-axial loaded in certain situations?

This issue has been covered, ad nauseum in other threads on this site and on rockclimbing.com. I have no wish to discuss it.

 

Sorry if you were offended with my comment, but it's pretty much true that the only people who eschew belay loops are those who began climbing in the days before belay loops were standard on harnesses.

 

I don't buy the triaxial loading argument, since the maximum force a belay device can apply is less than the gate open rating of most parabiners. My argument against Raindawg's method is not safety related. It is just less convenient, can bind the rope on rappel, and increases rope twisting on belay.

Edited March 7, 2007 by catbirdseat

[hippos_are_evil]

I was more talking to Raindawg's comment with the skinner belay loop issue than rehashing anything

 

 

[Gary_Yngve]

Here's my interpretation of what CBS is saying.

 

The Mounties and FoTH teach that if you are tied in and using a belay device, your brakehand should be on the same side as the anchor to keep things in line.

 

When belaying a climber at the base of the cliff, it's as if the ground is a virtual anchor, so the rope should run down toward the ground.

[catbirdseat]

I was more talking to Raindawg's comment with the skinner belay loop issue than rehashing anything

 

I just think it is pretty low to use Skinner as an example to support an argument for your own way of doing things. That's like saying we should stop using ropes because ropes can break. What we should be saying is "keep all your equipment in proper condition and retire anything that is obviously worn". Edited March 7, 2007 by catbirdseat

[eric8]

WOW! this thread would be better suited for the mountaineers board or rockclimbing.com

[hippos_are_evil]

I just think it is pretty low to use Skinner as an example to support an argument for your own way of doing things. That's like saying we should stop using ropes because ropes can break. What we should be saying is "keep all your equipment in proper condition and retire anything that is obviously worn".

 

I think it's important to use Skinner's accident to bring up discussion and to evauluate ones own practices.

[rob]

um...wow, this sure turned into a big fucking deal all of the sudden.

[Weekend_Climberz]

[G-spotter]

sOsLPuFOHjM

CBS and Dwayner go at it!

[Weekend_Climberz]

Ew, cat fight. Grrrrrrrr....

 

I always thought it involved mud and scantily clad female hard bodies??

[catbirdseat]

There is not a shortage of non-serious topics these days. One can attract more attention by (trying) to be serious.

[hippos_are_evil]

There is not a shortage of non-serious topics these days. One can attract more attention by (trying) to be serious.

 

Huh? Are you calling someone out?

[Raindawg]

If you were going for humor Dwayner, you might double check it cause you come off sounding like a cold, mean spirited (insert rude word here).

 

Nope...wasn't trying to make a joke...just a commentary on belay loops about which this topic is related, cuz this up and down hand stuff makes no sense unless you're doing the loop.

 

I just think it is pretty low to use Skinner as an example to support an argument for your own way of doing things. That's like saying we should stop using ropes because ropes can break. What we should be saying is "keep all your equipment in proper condition and retire anything that is obviously worn".

 

Hey Cathead: Whatever. You brought it on with this "old-timers" nonsense. I know plenty of folks of various experience who don't use their belay loops for belaying or anything else. Think what you like, "professor", my opinion is that belay loops are bogus....I suppose you can use it as a gear loop to hang stuff off of if you like to get wacked in the Jimmy as you climb. Would you tie into that thing??? I imagine that you don't. Would you rappel off that thing? I wouldn't. So why belay off it? Just another link in the chain to mess you up.

 

 

 

 

[G-spotter]

meow!

[sobo]

Ew, cat fight. Grrrrrrrr....

 

I always thought it involved mud and scantily clad female hard bodies??

 

Sumpin' along these lines...??

 

[high_on_rock]

I support what you are saying cat, and agree with you completely. I also agree that those who do not use the belay loop are either old school or learned the "bad habit" from Old School folks.

[Drederek]

Thanks Mr Bo for making reading this thread worthwhile.

[sobo]

Don' mention it. Consider it my gift to you.

 

 

Thank you, sir. May I have another?

 

[dmuja]

I think brake side out the "top" or "bottom" is much less important than being comfortable, confident, and experienced in what ever technique your used to. Hell, (you'll probly laugh at this but..) half the time I stop falls with my guide hand - at least at first.

[Weekend_Climberz]

 

Now there's some technique we really ought to concern ourselves about :tup:

[Dechristo]

"keep all your equipment in proper condition"

[EWolfe]

All us real masochists prefer the naked hip belay on run-out hard trad.