RMI loosing control

[ketch]

A friend came up to me last week in town and asked about that other guide group on Rainer. I told him I thought RMI still had a monoploy. Today he showed up with a flyer from the park service advertising Mount Rainer Alpine Guides in addition to RMI.

 

I guess it shows that I don't stay dialed in as to what's goin on down there. Can someone fill me in on this group?

[rhyang]

"Mount Rainier: A Climbing Guide" (Mike Gauthier, 1999) actually lists four other guide services, also listed on the NPS website here :

 

http://www.nps.gov/mora/climb/climb.htm#guide

 

I recently talked to a guy who enjoyed a trip led by these folks :

 

http://www.cascadealpine.com

 

I'd also be interested in hearing about the other guide services, since I'd like to go up in '05.

[layton]

The American Alpine Institute regularly guides on Rainier.

Good guides.

[cluck]

Last I knew.... RMI had dibs on the routes from Paradise (DC). Other guides work over the east side stuff (like Emmons).

[ketch]

R, thanks for the link. I seldom do the trail on Rainer and not in several years. Cluck, your right I guess RMI has dibs out of paradise and and others get to guide on the Emmons and Winthrop.

Can you have half of a monopoly?

[chris]

Here's the deal. RMI has the only guiding CONCESSION in the park, and have exclusive guiding rights up the Muir corridor. The other guiding services (whom I can't recall) have permits - when their allotted number of permit days are filled, they're season is done.

[JoshK]

Fuck RMI.

[chris]

Fuck you too, Josh. RMI provides a legitimate service to the public, and I've watched a lot of independent climbers who only reached the summit because of RMI's traffic on the DC.

[ketch]

MtnFreak, Thanks for the info. I don't follow the run around on Rainer and you helped in what's going on. It's cool that other groups get some shot at guideing. I kinda like having a service that keeps most of the gumbies in one place so that the rest of us can avoid them if we want.

[John Frieh]

Hmmm... if anything I have heard people start earlier on the DC so they don't get stuck behind the gumbies on route as passing is dangerous...

[cj001f]

RMI provides a legitimate service to the public

Sort of like a dogwalking service, only with people?

[Bill_Simpkins]

FYI. RMI also guides on other routes like Success Cleaver and Liberty Ridge.

[chris]

Your welcome, Ketch. I forgot to mention that the other guide services also have exclusive guiding priveleges on the Emmons glacier corridor.

Together, all the guide services and the public have equal access to the rest of the mountain.

[johndavidjr]

"Sort of like a dogwalking service, only with people?"

 

I've been the dog lots of times, but not there. I don't mind guides, but hope my days of being guided are mostly over.

----

[JoshK]

fuck you too mtnfreak. How can you consider multiple guide services fighting for one route while RMI can guide on the entire rest of the mountain fair? They got a hookup, and now it's better off to get rid of that favor and allow some competition.

[chris]

"fuck you too mtnfreak. How can you consider multiple guide services fighting for one route while RMI can guide on the entire rest of the mountain fair? They got a hookup, and now it's better off to get rid of that favor and allow some competition."

Josh,

I've calmed down a bit, but you still need to get your facts straight. RMI, due to its concession and history, gets exclusive guiding rights on the Muir Corridor. The PERMITTED guide services have exclusive guiding rights on the Emmons Corridor, and to the best of my knowledge the don't fight for space. This system was set up to allow outside guide services to build experience on Rainier so that they could make realistic bids for guiding concessions when those should open.

ALL of the guide services compete with the public for space on other routes on the mountain.

I am a guide, a supporter of multiple guide services at Mt. Rainier and elsewhere, and have posted here stating my points. Why cuss the guide service for taking advantage of the government's tradition? Josh, shouldn't we be cussing the Park Service? If your beef with RMI is that it has the sole concession, that's not RMI's fault, but the fault of Mt. Rainier National Park.

[MervGriffin]

Fuck you too, Josh. RMI provides a legitimate service to the public, and I've watched a lot of independent climbers who only reached the summit because of RMI's traffic on the DC.

 

Hey Potty-Mouth. Do you work for RMI?

Do you speak to the clients that way?

Do you also regularly make disparaging comments about "independent climbers" as many RMI guides do?

[Dru]

Fuck you too, Josh. RMI provides a legitimate service to the public, and I've watched a lot of independent climbers who only reached the summit because of RMI's traffic on the DC.

 

Hey Potty-Mouth. Do you work for RMI?

Do you speak to the clients that way?

Do you also regularly make disparaging comments about "independent climbers" as many RMI guides do?

 

And more importantly, do you exaggerate Lou's bigness at every opportunity?

[cj001f]

Why cuss the guide service for taking advantage of the government's tradition? Josh, shouldn't we be cussing the Park Service? If your beef with RMI is that it has the sole concession, that's not RMI's fault, but the fault of Mt. Rainier National Park.

And RMI is welcoming the new guide service's with open arms "They want to cut my business by two-thirds, but they didn't give us much say in the matter,"

[MervGriffin]

And more importantly, do you exaggerate Lou's bigness at every opportunity?

 

His Lou-ness IS BIG!!!! No exaggeration necessary!

Check it out!!!

 

[Greg_W]

He shouldn't bitch. He's had an uncontested (and probably illegal) monopoly for a long time.

[Bill_Simpkins]

Fuck you too, Josh. RMI provides a legitimate service to the public, and I've watched a lot of independent climbers who only reached the summit because of RMI's traffic on the DC.

 

Hey Potty-Mouth. Do you work for RMI?

Do you speak to the clients that way?

Do you also regularly make disparaging comments about "independent climbers" as many RMI guides do?

 

I know a a few climbers off hand who have only made it up because of the cattle paths and/or following RMI up in bad weather. My main climbing buddy is an RMI guide. These things are true. There ARE some indepentent climbers that only make it to the top from RMI traffic.

I don't think it is being disrespectful at all. Those indepentent climbers that I know said first hand they only made it up because of RMI.

[Climzalot]

RMI, due to its concession and history, gets exclusive guiding rights on the Muir Corridor. The PERMITTED guide services have exclusive guiding rights on the Emmons Corridor, and to the best of my knowledge the don't fight for space........ALL of the guide services compete with the public for space on other routes on the mountain.

I am a guide, a supporter of multiple guide services at Mt. Rainier and elsewhere, and have posted here stating my points.

 

Good summary. A few points of clarification though. With regard to the term PERMITTED, the 4 guide services besides RMI that are currently allowed to guide on Rainier are able to do so by working under an IBP (incidental business permit) which has been granted by the Park Service. This IBP is a temporary solution inacted by the park to sate the publics demand for some competition amongst guide services and the guide services request for the ability to guide on Rainier. Basically the IBP system was/is a "here are some trips until we get the concession thing figured out" sorta deal. RMI is the only concessioned (permitted by contract) guide service on Rainier. They have exclusive rights to the Muir Corridor and, I am fairly certain, the the abilty to guide other routes (minus the Emmons) elsewhere on the mountain. The other 4 guide services guide and only guide on the Emmons route. The number of and dates for their trips, the number of clients they can take on a trip, client-to-guide ratio, camp locations, and many more things are all regulated and assigned by the Park.

 

Perhaps these things have been addressed elsewhere or in other threads and this information is redundant. Just wanted to make sure that these points were understood.

 

Last I heard the Park was still in the process of reviewing the data and feedback they collected during the public complaining, I mean comment process. Anyone know more?

[JoshK]

He shouldn't bitch. He's had an uncontested (and probably illegal) monopoly for a long time.

 

Exactly what I am saying.

 

And, AFAIK, climzalot is right, it's everything for RMI and Emmons for the rest.

[TJD]

Does any body ever wonder If big Jim Would have waited,like Barry and Lute did . I do not know him, I just wonder.