Sigg water bottles?

[Jens]

Anyone have much experience with these?

 

I just bought one and seem to like it but noticed it has a james bond trick sport squirter opening that has lots of of little metal moving parts that may be prone to leak, freeze, or break. Can I buy just the other regular lid and swap out the sport bottle opening? Do the bottles perform OK in winter conditions? The bottles don't weight anything and are swiss quality. I'm reading more and more science updates on "man boobs", estrogen levels and the like from every type of plastic bottle (nalgene etc.) leaching chemicals into the water. -and I'm tired of the plastic taste. I guess tons of alpinists in Europe are using Sigg bottles. Anyone have lots of experience with them and care to weigh in? I'm contemplating buying some more.

[BreezyD]

Jens -

 

Sigg ... love em'. I picked up my first ones when I was in Munich in '99 and they are still in great shape. They can withstand me throwing them around, don't freeze (although they do stay nice and cold), and don't leech a taste into the water.

 

All of my bottles have the standard screw top, but would imagine that you can replace the sport top with the screw top if they have that narrow (inch and a half?) opening.

 

One trick ... pick up some of the Bottle Clean tablets if you haven't already. If you are filling with anything other than water, your bottle can take on a funk after a while that is tough to get rid of. I clean mine with the tablets once every few months. Below is a link to a retailer that carries Sigg and most accessories. Haven't found one stateside yet.

 

Hope this was helpful,

 

Brianna

 

http://www.adventureshop.co.uk/sigg/accessories.htm

[catbirdseat]

Are we talking here about the aluminum water bottles that bear a striking resemblance to fuel bottles?

[chriss]

 

"trick sport squirter"

 

How does this thing squirt?

You can't squeeze the bottle without crushing it can you?

 

Oh and not to scare you, but read up on aluminum in the body.

 

I'd just worry about it getting crushed or dented in the pack or cracking if it froze.

 

chris

[BreezyD]

After 5 years on the job ...

 

Crushed? Not yet.

Dented? Yes. (Call them battle scars.)

Cracking in freezing conditions? Not yet.

[olyclimber]

Brunton makes them too. I'm drinking Crown Royale out of one them right now...

[snoboy]

Oh and not to scare you, but read up on aluminum in the body.

 

The water bottles are lined with enamel, no contact between aluminum and beverage.

 

I'd just worry about it getting crushed or dented in the pack or cracking if it froze.

 

I used one of their fuel bottles for years, and it never got crushed. It had some dents, but never leaked. Freezing might be an issue.

 

Maybe cbs can figure out the relative pressures of water freezing vs. white gas being warmed up...

[graupel]

I found one that had been left behind on a mountain, likely by a european. It was housed in an insulated bottle holster. For those worried about freezing, that looks like the way to go. Not sure where you would get them though. Maybe some place in Canada?

[Jens]

Snoboy, what is enamel? Is it on our teeth? What is it made out of?

[Dru]

e·nam·el ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-nml)

n.

A vitreous, usually opaque, protective or decorative coating baked on metal, glass, or ceramic ware.

An object having such a coating, as in a piece of cloisonné.

A coating that dries to a hard glossy finish: nail enamel.

A paint that dries to a hard glossy finish.

Anatomy. The hard, calcareous substance covering the exposed portion of a tooth.

[catbirdseat]

Oh and not to scare you, but read up on aluminum in the body.

 

The water bottles are lined with enamel, no contact between aluminum and beverage.

 

I'd just worry about it getting crushed or dented in the pack or cracking if it froze.

 

I used one of their fuel bottles for years, and it never got crushed. It had some dents, but never leaked. Freezing might be an issue.

 

Maybe cbs can figure out the relative pressures of water freezing vs. white gas being warmed up...

There is no question that water freezing creates much more pressure in an inelastic container, such those made of aluminum than elevated vapor pressure of gasoline (modest temperatures ~120F).

[anotherlin]

I have a 1L Sigg aluminum bottle, looks like a fuel

bottle with a swiss cross on it. Bought when I lived in

Paris. It is about the same weight as a 1L (32oz)

nalgene, maybe even a little less.

 

It's a nice bottle but it has two problems. First, it is

really easy to dent. I can almost do it with my fingers and

I really don't have strong hands. If you like to throw your

pack around, you'll have tons of dents on it. Mine's is

litteraly covered with dents.

 

Second, and the biggest one, it has a strange taste. Not

plastic, but there's definitely some strange taste, maybe

due to the inside coating? I've only put water in it, and

I've washed it quite often.

 

Otherwise it is fine, no leaking for instance. No problem

in winter or summer. Regarding the lid, I have the regular

one. I guess you can switch between them, because in europe

you can buy the sport opening upgrade.

 

My opinion is that I would stay with Nalgene or

platypus. So far, I have no taste problem for both. Nalgenes

are almost unbreakable, and the platypus are very light

and take almost no space when empty. The other thing is

the price, I paid my Sigg bottle 10 euros which is a

little bit more than a 1L Nalgene or platypus.

 

Now regarding the science stuff about man estrogen. I

don't know what to think about it. I mean the sigg bottles

are aluminium, and there's an inside protective coating,

much like in soda cans. This coating may just be as

dangerous as the plastic. For plastic, what sort of

plastic? Nalgene = lexan = polycarbonate. Platypus =

multi-ply polyethylene, same as most water or coke 2L

bottles. Camelbak bladder = polyurethane. Not to mention

teflon on non-stick frying pans, or the various polluants

in the air you breath.

 

Hope this helps

[snoboy]

enamel = glass more or less, and AKAIK, glass is one of the more inert substances around... I kind of wonder though, as most enamel is a bit brittle and would usually crack if the container was dented.

 

Bottle Racket

 

On plastic water bottles

 

 

by Umbra Fisk

 

02 Aug 2004

Questions relating to the environment?

Ask Umbra.

 

Several readers have sent in questions about the dangers of chemical leaching from plastic bottles. A composite version:

 

Dear Umbra,

 

I've read some conflicting things about the risks associated with reusing plastic water bottles. For instance, the generally trustworthy folks at the urban-legends site snopes.com have criticized a widely circulated email that claims regular water bottles are not safe for refilling because the plastic breaks down. The commonly offered solution is to refill only bottles made from stronger plastics, which are meant to be washed and reused, such as Nalgene bottles. But then I read in Daily Grist that even Nalgene bottles may leach a dangerous chemical into water. Is there some kind of bottle I can reuse without running these risks?

 

Conglomerate Reader

Everytown, U.S.A.

 

Dearest Conglomerate Reader,

 

The mysterious world of plastics: convenient, yet filled with vague and shadowy dangers. Lest we get overly mired in those dangers, let's take a moment to recognize the incredible advances -- in medicine, for example -- that plastics have brought to our lives. Not only does plastic serve valuable purposes, but its manufacture is in many cases no more hard on the earth than the manufacture of wood-based products. Paper versus plastic bags? It's a draw.

 

Now that we're through with plastic appreciation ...

 

Manufacturing plastic is resource-intensive and yields various nasty emissions that contribute to global warming and degradation of water quality. It's made from non-renewable resources, and for all intents and purposes, it never biodegrades (although some specialized variations have been made specifically to do so). Yes, we'll run out of oil eventually, but we'll always have our plastic garbage. Add to this the growing suspicion that plastic use may lead to serious health problems.

 

Evil, evil plastics!, it would seem, and in some cases correctly. I would generally advise against using plastics in food- and beverage-related applications.

 

Let's talk specifics, though, because you point out an apparent conundrum in your question. The contradictions you see in the press are a mix of confusion about types of plastic, misinformation, and bona fide scientific uncertainty about the effects of an entirely new group of substances. Snopes.com addresses purported links between PET (#1) and DEHA (di-2-ethylhexyl-adipate), a potential carcinogen, links which are apparently based on a study later shown to be bogus. PET evidently does not contain DEHA, and the carcinogenic properties of DEHA itself are hotly debated.

 

 

I'm a Nalgene bottle, baby.

 

Nalgene bottles, made of polycarbonate (#7) or "Lexan," are more closely linked to bad stuff, specifically an ingredient called bisphenol-A (BPA). BPA is an endocrine disruptor that mimics estrogen and has been linked to aneuploidy, adipogenesis, and other scary problems with funny names. Drinking water or eating food containing leached BPA may cause chromosomal disruption, miscarriages, birth defects, or obesity. Eek!

 

To recap what we know so far: #1 bottles are okay; #7 bottles are no good.

 

Moving on, I would categorically avoid PVC (#3), aka vinyl, for food containers or anything else. It truly is an evil plastic, practically a fount of dioxin. PVC containers and PVC film can contain oft-debated ickies DEHP and DEHA, and some contain softening phthalates linked to liver and kidney damage and testicular problems. Also, polystyrene (#6) is yucky -- it's made of styrene, and you don't want any styrene in your precious bod, trust me.

 

That leaves us with the winners of this dubious contest: HDPE, LDPE, polypropylene, and limited use of PET.

 

Still, as I said, keep your food away from plastic. We are just beginning to learn what these chemicals have been doing to our bodies.

 

I'm also a little obsessed right now with a food-related health concern that often flies under our radar: bacteria. Reused, unwashed, and unsterilized plastic bottles are a breeding ground for invisible bacteria that nestle in cracks and scratches we cannot even see. It's not as exotic as BPA and DEHA and styrene, but it is gross.

 

Where does that leave those who want to drink water on the go? After looking around on your behalf, I've put away my handy Nalgene bottle, which I was already feeling guilty about thanks to a rumor I heard several years ago about the company testing on rabbits. (Incidentally, it turns out Nalgene doesn't test on bunnies, but it is owned by an octopus-like corporate conglomerate, another arm of which manufactures laboratory products used to experiment on animals -- thus, it is boycotted by some animal-rights activists. Personally, I will focus my efforts on keeping plastics away from children.)

 

 

Smells like canteen spirit.

 

Glass vessels will work in low-impact situations, and I've seen metal canteens that may suit your needs. As long as we sit still, there's no trouble finding plastic alternatives. It's the biking and hiking and bungee jumping that pose a problem. Maybe those old leather canteens will make a comeback, but until then I think it's the less-evil plastics that will keep us quenched on the trail.

 

Sadly,

Umbra

 

Yours is to wonder why, hers is to answer (or try). Please send Umbra any nagging question pertaining to the environment.

 

The claims made in this column may not reflect the views of this magazine. Neither the magazine nor the author guarantees that any advice contained in this column is wise or safe. Please use this column at your own risk.

 

- - - - - - - - -

 

Umbra Fisk is Grist Research Associate II, Hardcover and Periodicals Unit, floors 2B-4B.

[Ade]

I used to use these.

 

The narrow opening is much more prone to freezing than an Nalgene.

 

They're metal so they conduct heat more than a Nalgene to they're more prone to freezing anyways.

 

You can't flex the sides to get ice off and then shake it up to get more water out.

 

They dent. When they dent this cracks the coating on the inside (not that your should worry about the whole Aluminum issue, it's rubbish). But it does effect the taste.

 

They're heavier than a Nalgene and more expensive - need I say more?

[snoboy]

So, not good for winter use... Hmm.

 

1L Nalgene = 149 grams

1L Sigg = 185 grams

[thelawgoddess]

i have red one with the "sporty" top. i like the narrower profile and how it doesn't leak, but i do think they conduct heat a little too nicely. put ice in it and you almost need to wear gloves to keep your skin from freezing to it! well, maybe i'm exaggerating a little, but anyway ...