first set of crampons

[Blakej]

I looking to buy my first set of crampons and I've been looking hard at the grivel G 12 and grivel Air Tech. The question would be what am I loosing by going with the air tech besides weight. Are the shorter spikes going to effect me much? Are there any other models to look at for just basic first set type deal?

[Ade]

As always... What do you want them for?

[Blakej]

basic glacier travel and the general washington climbs. Not really planning on vertical ice but would like somthing that could substitute for shits and giggles if I want to try the vertical stuff but basically I'm new to glacier and snow travel so I need somthing to make those first steps but hopefully give some growing room into the more technical stuff. I would prefer step ins. any suggestions.

[Mark_Husbands]

I think the G12s are a good first choice. i have a pair with newmatic bindings that i like for classic mountaineering. because the steel is good and the points pretty long they work on ice also, certainly until you want to invest in a steep ice specific crampon (i have G14 and like them).

[thelawgoddess]

both will do fine for general mountaineering but the g12 is a little more aggresssive. if you think you ever want to try any steep stuff, get the g12's - they offer more stability for frontpointing. and if you think you will ever want to try vertical ice (particularly without having to buy a 2nd set of crampons) get the g14's.

Edited April 5, 2004 by thelawgoddess

[willstrickland]

BD Sabertooths.

[thelawgoddess]

pfft.

 

sorry, will, but i must say that the grivel g14's way rock over the bd sabertooths.

(of course, if you're not doing anything steep or vertical i guess you wouldn't really care. )

 

but even then ...

 

grivel

[Chad_A]

I, too, was looking at the sabretooths, until I discovered the G14s, and I haven't looked back. They walk pretty good on everything, and I lead my first WI climbs in Utah this year in them, as well; I love gear that is multi-purposed

[cj001f]

and I lead my first WI climbs in Utah this year in them, as well; I love gear that is multi-purposed

That's right. No one ever climbed WI, or new wave mixed in Sabertooths They're just one trick ponies.

 

Sabertooths are great crampons.

[John Frieh]

For what Blakej is planning on using them for (esp. out here) he should look at (in no particular order)

1) BD sabertooths

2) Grivel G 12s

3) Petzl Vasak

 

Though the air techs and other models (BD Contact) would work just fine for WA volcanoes, the option to do steeper/more technical routes is not there where with the above list he could transition into those types of routes. Blakej should also recognize that the Petzl Vasak is merely a slightly tweaked S-12/Black Ice and assuming he settles on Petzl should just pick up a pair of S-12s/Black ice for super cheap (as everyone is clearing them out... you might have to search under the name charlet moser S-12/black ice though).

 

And of course the G14s rock over the sabertooths... they are made for different styles of climbing. If you want to compare the G14s against something similar, try the Petzl Sarken. Or maybe not, as the Sarkens easily outperforms the G 14s and weighs 8 ounces less.

 

It should be pointed out that Kim Csizmazia won many ice/mixed climbing comps wearing a pair of sabertooths (pre bionic days). Winning usually meant on sighting M9ish. Point is ultimately gear won't help you if you can't climb. So what are you waiting for?

[willstrickland]

pfft.

 

sorry, will, but i must say that the grivel g14's way rock over the bd sabertooths.

(of course, if you're not doing anything steep or vertical i guess you wouldn't really care. )

 

grivel

 

 

Umm, yeah. TLG I climb mostly in a pair of Rambos (which have the same frontpoints as the G14) so yes, I'm in the Grivel camp too. I also have Sabertooths, which I really like for almost anything.

 

That said, the Sabertooths are cheaper than the G14 by about $35, lighter by around 10oz, and one of the best all-arounders to be had. They probably beat the G14 in everything except pure, steep WI. And in that case I'm climbing in the Rambos anyway. Mixed? Give me the Sabers, Iffy snow? Sabers.

 

Have you ever climbed with Sabertooths or do you just want to slag on them?

[marylou]

Ok no flaming please.

 

What would be bad about having aluminum crampons as one's first pair?

[cracked]

You'll trash them before getting an idea of what they can/can't do. Get the G12s or BD Sabretooths.

[Rodchester]

G-12s rock.....

 

Air tech? You mena the ice axe? Good axe, but the BD Raven is WAY better.

[thelawgoddess]

Have you ever climbed with Sabertooths

yes, i have. i didn't say they're bad crampons and i actually think the secondary points are pretty awesome for walking around on glaciers. but imho the g14 is a great technical "do-it-all" 'pon that lies between something like the sabertooth and something like the rambo.

 

blakej, you'll learn to adapt to whatever crampons you get so don't sweat your choice too much. there are lots of great quality mountaineering 'pons out there and you're really not going to go "wrong" no matter what. just get some and get your buns out there.

[thelawgoddess]

Air tech? You mena the ice axe?

rodchester: check it

[lummox]

i have grunted up more than one wi5 in sabertooths so i dont reckon they suck at vertical ice. they be real good on neve and mushy ice too.

[iain]

I really like the BD sabertooths. The secondary points make very secure feet on moderate snow and ice routes like those found in the cascades. They can also handle the steeps well too.

 

I really dislike the new heel adjustment system they use, however. The screw in the back has been replaced by a silly plastic spacer that you move above or below the hinge to adjust half sizes. I can never get it quite right for one of my ski boots, and I'm constantly adjusting them for leathers and ski boots. The sabertooth with the charlet-moser s12 heel piece would be really nice.

 

I don't think you can go wrong with one of the brands listed above, they're all very good. I think it's funny that someone has to badmouth a product like that, as if it's a philosophy or something. Almost as funny as the people who put climbing company stickers on their cars.

 

I would recommend a steel crampon first. They are much more durable and multipurpose in my opinion.

[thelawgoddess]

I think it's funny that someone has to badmouth a product like that, as if it's a philosophy or something.

yeah; ha, ha. if you're talking about me you should re-read the posts. the sabertooths are a great crampon. but why is it wrong for me to say that i think the g14 is better? for what i do i honestly believe it is. end of story. i wasn't badmouthing anything ... or anyone. geez.

[iain]

classic cc.com material. I'll see if I can work in some angle about how the bush admin is responsible for the new heel piece on the sabertooths.

[Rodchester]

Air tech? You mena the ice axe?

rodchester: check it

 

Gottcha

[Stephen_Ramsey]

Bakej,

 

You can't go wrong with either the Sabretooths or the Grivel G12s. Note that the G12 is almost an ounce lighter, per crampon. That may not seem like much, but for the long approaches on many Washington climbs, it can matter to some people. That said, the BD Sabretooth is a great crampon. I think the Sabretooth excels on mixed climbing.

 

Actually, more important than the vendor of the crampon (Grivel, BD, or whatever) is the choice of binding. Probably a new-matic binding system would work best, as it would allow you to use a wider range of boots.

 

The G14 is a great crampon, it is my first choice for waterfall ice. But it would not be my first choice for an all-around crampon for use in the Cascades. This is because of weight, insufficient front-point area, and cost.

 

If you ever plan to do any mixed climbing (even moderate stuff), or climbing snow/glacier interspersed with rock, or climbing in winter, I would recommend against aluminum.

 

-Steve

Edited April 5, 2004 by Stephen_Ramsey

[Blakej]

Thanks for the bad-ass thread of replies. so many opinions to sort throught I think I just pick the toughest looking pair. As my climbing mentor used to say "Remember grasshopper its not the first one up its the one that looks the coolest doing it."

[thelawgoddess]

you will go far in the mountains.

[jaee]

The G14 is a great crampon, it is my first choice for waterfall ice. But it would not be my first choice for an all-around crampon for use in the Cascades. This is because of weight, insufficient front-point area, and cost.

What's wrong w/ the G14 frontpoints?