mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 Topic: girth hitch your cam sling to a sewn sling to save on biners. Discuss please... Note: do not girth hitch slings to wired nuts or hexes. No need to discuss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 go for it tho with 30 neutrinos on the rack and all gear having their individual biner allows for more options. that way if you come up short at the belay combine gear to use biners. that way yuo can carry less of them! also ihave wc spectra slung hexes so i can girth hitch a sling to them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 nothing wrong with it, but also slightly more time consuming to rig and re-rack.... I'd still want 2 biners per runner, because you don't know if you're going to be using it with a cam or wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lummox Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 topic: my dick suck it please . . . note: your stupid troll on girth hitching slings . . . no need to discuss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 Piss off butthead. Not a troll. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 Only the facts no need to “discuss” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 IceIceBaby said: Only the facts no need to “discuss” Thanks IIB. I did a search, but didn't turn up this article. This is the info I was looking for: Confused? Well, you should probably use biners to link slings in a high load situation. Otherwise, a girth hitch should be just fine if the girthed runners are strong enough. Consider that 66% of 27kN is 17.8kN. An anchor that breaks at 17.8kN will support slingshot loads of 10.7kN. Check your rope and you'll find that it probably limits shock load to 10kN or less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redoubt Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 And in case it ever comes up, one of the interesting things to note in the BD article is that, if you are hitching together slings of different strengths, put the girth hitch in the stronger sling. When you connect two slings with a girth hitch, you are really only putting a hitch in one of them. The other sling has no knot in it at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 do watcha gotta do. I can see more dangerous or less trustworthy options. I'm sure plenty on the board use what Jon Long would call sketchy or improper anchors in his book. Than I am also sure Jon Long has done so himself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 Cpt.Caveman said: do watcha gotta do. I can see more dangerous or less trustworthy options. I'm sure plenty on the board use what Jon Long would call sketchy or improper anchors in his book. Than I am also sure Jon Long has done so himself. u gota do whad ya gad to do agreed ...but it always good to know how to do it better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 Thanks to all (minus 1) so far. Russ, I hear what you're saying about reracking. Good point. Consider this: I can rack each cam individually on a biner. Then I carry single slings across my chest without biners, and a couple of doubles with biners (to weight them and prevent them from tripping me). I'd then chain a few spare biners on the rack for nuts. By racking each cam with one biner, I can girth hitch a single to the cam sling, then move the racking biner to the sling to which I attach the rope. I've taken to doing this lately, but a partner recently raised eyebrows, hence I'm soliciting opinions. I've found the weight and bulk savings to be a relief. Also, I'm talking low to mid 5th class alpine stuff, not super hard--to me anyway--routes. That's not my thing. Yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_Simpkins Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 Sounds like a good way to save weight on those alpine routes. What I do for that is rack 2-3 cams on one biner, 5 total, #1-#3 stoppers, every other size to # 12, pink and red tri-cam on one biner, carry about five, 2-biner slings on the harness, and a couple of 1 biner slings on chest, 2 rabbit runners with one biner around chest. Sometimes I girth hitch the cams, depends on the gear left. I've even had to girth hitch a stopper a few times because I ran out of gear. I don't carry a belay device, I use a munter hitch on Petzl Attache for belaying, a doubled up munter hitch for Rappelling, and I usually use a 8.3 mm rope, 30m or 60 m, depending on route. Keep in mind this is my setup for 4th class-low 5th. Sometimes I throw in a # 3.5 cam, or just carry tricams instead of cams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 IceIceBaby said: Cpt.Caveman said: do watcha gotta do. I can see more dangerous or less trustworthy options. I'm sure plenty on the board use what Jon Long would call sketchy or improper anchors in his book. Than I am also sure Jon Long has done so himself. u gota do whad ya gad to do agreed ...but it always good to know how to do it better My suspicion was true: Also, I'm talking low to mid 5th class alpine stuff, not super hard--to me anyway--routes. That's not my thing. Yet. Yes girth hitch the slings together is ok. There are other options but fuck sometimes you just need a sling or anchor and you aint got shit else. If you think it's bad it usually is not that good. IceIce- I think we agree but I think I already suspected the situation All I have to say is welcome to more alpine climbing more. Otherwi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russ Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 mtngrrrl said: Consider this: I can rack each cam individually on a biner. Then I carry single slings across my chest without biners, and a couple of doubles with biners (to weight them and prevent them from tripping me). I'd then chain a few spare biners on the rack for nuts. By racking each cam with one biner, I can girth hitch a single to the cam sling, then move the racking biner to the sling to which I attach the rope. I've taken to doing this lately, but a partner recently raised eyebrows, hence I'm soliciting opinions. I've found the weight and bulk savings to be a relief. Nothing wrong with doing it that way, but it's a little unusual. One of the cool things about doing things in a more 'standardized' mode is that you can climb with new partners and have minimal explain of how you do things. You just climb... It inspires confidence and a certain amount of trust. Having to think through your new partner's system could cause undo stress at a critical time. I understand wanting to reduce bulk and weight. I rarely put runners over my head for that reason, and use Neutrino's to save weight. Pro on the rack, runners 'tripled' and clipped to the harness. When seconding, I re-organize gear as I clean, so change overs are clean and efficient. You probably know all of this, so ignore my rambling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 All I have to say is welcome to more alpine climbing more. Two turntables and a microphone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary_Yngve Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 two weeks ago i girth-hitched two doubles together to reduce ropedrag on a pitch (i guess i could have just not placed the piece, but then the runout would have been pretty big...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lummox Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 mtngrrrl said: Topic: girth hitch your cam sling to a sewn sling to save on biners. Discuss please... Note: do not girth hitch slings to wired nuts or hexes. No need to discuss. mtngrrrl said: Thanks to all (minus 1) so far. yo beeotch! you dint ask no question in earnest. instead you wrote some kina mike myers/koffee klatch style smart aleck bullshit. for that you get my bullshit response. if you really want to know more about gear strengths and the effects of hitchs knot and wraps on those strength be straight up. if you concerned about girth hitch causing gear failure (fucking rare btw) avoid it by joining two slings by having one doubled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redoubt Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 mtngrrrl said: Consider this: I can rack each cam individually on a biner...... By racking each cam with one biner, I can girth hitch a single to the cam sling, then move the racking biner to the sling to which I attach the rope. I've taken to doing this lately,..... Mtngrrrl, I'd encourage you to think carefully about making this your standard procedure. Most alpine climbers (including me) will definitely do whatever needs to be done when the gear runs low (or threatens to). But keep in mind that, at least according to BD testing, two slings girth hitched are about 30% weaker than two slings connected with a biner. With high strength slings, that will likely still be sufficiently strong. But excessive strength and redundant safety are good things in climbing if they don't cost much, and neutrinos are pretty damn light. I have girth hitched slings, slings to wires, and come up with whatever else I can think of when lack of gear dictates, and I definitely will do those things again when I guess wrong about my gear needs. But I typically head up with what I at least think is enough gear to avoid doing any of them, and that includes enough neutrinos to avoid girth hitching slings. If there is anything comforting about girth hitching when you run out of biners, it's that typically this will happen toward the end of a lead when there's plenty of rope out and the force on your placement will tend to be less than it would be down low. If you continue to do this, you might at least do it selectively when you think the fall factor is low, and use your biners to connect slings in higher force situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted August 29, 2003 Author Share Posted August 29, 2003 Thanks Redoubt. All good ideas to work in. Mixing it up is always good. Lummox, I think you've been staring at your little animated gif too long. You're fried. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attitude Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 Trad Girl's discussion on this topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dryad Posted August 29, 2003 Share Posted August 29, 2003 I was wondering the same thing a while back and the consensus among the people I asked seems to be that it works, but is just more futzy and takes more time than using biners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 dryad said: I was wondering the same thing a while back and the consensus among the people I asked seems to be that it works, but is just more futzy and takes more time than using biners. I do it all the time, but if/when you ever take a fall on it, you'll have to work at the webbing for some time to get it all untagled n stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necronomicon Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 erik said: go for it tho with 30 neutrinos on the rack and all gear having their individual biner allows for more options. DMM Prowires. As light and as strong as the Neutrino, but with a larger gate opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 Necronomicon said: erik said: go for it tho with 30 neutrinos on the rack and all gear having their individual biner allows for more options. DMM Prowires. As light and as strong as the Neutrino, but with a larger gate opening. and you know i have ben suffering like a mofo with that 1mm less of gate opening! go with the better price! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted September 2, 2003 Share Posted September 2, 2003 erik said: Necronomicon said: erik said: go for it tho with 30 neutrinos on the rack and all gear having their individual biner allows for more options. DMM Prowires. As light and as strong as the Neutrino, but with a larger gate opening. and you know i have ben suffering like a mofo with that 1mm less of gate opening! go with the better price! Dmm Prowire $9 BD nerdtrino $11 at MEC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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