For the Newest User, Climb4Christ

[Dru]

4 Satan

[Necronomicon]

"All I said was 'This Halibut is good enough for Jehovah'"

[minx]

 

christonapogostick that's funny

[nolanr]

Dr_Flash_Amazing said:

i am tired of a) the overwhelming amount of public christianity to which i'm exposed b) the vanity of people who think i should accept it quietly c) the fact that people think that christ would care what hobbies they do for him.

 

At the risk of opening up a whole new Pandora's can of fish, DFA has a few thoughts on the above.

 

a) Imagine, then, how Christians must feel being exposed to the vast majority of un-Christian stuff out there? For all people's talk about respecting others' beliefs, people get pretty bent if those displaying that belief happen to do so with crosses. Hell, those "clever" little bumperstickers referencing paganism in some way (oooh, you're a Born Again Pagan - ha HAAAA!) have got to be on at least as many cars as the "clever" die-cut praying Calvin stickers. If Christians are supposed to shut up and accept that other people believe differently, why shouldn't everyone else do the same?

 

b) D'you suppose there's a certain degree of vanity involved in any public display of one's beliefs? You don't have to accept it quietly, but if you're not going to accept PDC (that'd be Public Display of Christianity) quietly, why should any Christian accept a constant barrage of un-Christian input quietly?

 

c) Christians probably tend to claim they're [fill in the blank]ing for Christ because Christians are, ideally, supposed to live that way. It's perhaps analagous to dedicating a book to someone, or making every day Earth Day (stinky hippies), or some such. So, from a Christian point of view, it's perfectly natural to assume that Jesus would give a flying know what people are doing "4" him.

 

Well said. I think there's some kind of ironic thing going on in the US, people pay all kinds of lip service to religious freedom and tolerance and celebrating diversity and what not, but if you pipe up w/ anything resembling traditional Christian values or doctrine they wanna shut you up right quick. I also think "seperation of church and state" is probably the most misunderstood and misused part of the Constitution. People have interpreted it pretty liberally and run w/ it and basically tried to make it "complete removal of church from the state." I don't think that's what the founding fathers had in mind at all. Take a look at your money. Does it not say "In God We Trust?" I think most (although not all) of the founding fathers were devoutly religious and they would be rolling over in their graves to see what the whole seperation of church and state thing has turned into. Just my opinion though.

[fleblebleb]

Nothing short of a classic example of DFA arguing his lungs out just because most everybody else seemed to disagree

[Dave_Schuldt]

glen said:

 

why not PubClub4Beelzebub ?

 

What a great idea, we will dedicate the next one to the cool guy down below. Since I don't belove in religon it will be a good joke. Sin on suckers

[glen]

PubClub4Beelzebub alliterates well too...

[Off_White]

nolanr said:

Well said. I think there's some kind of ironic thing going on in the US, people pay all kinds of lip service to religious freedom and tolerance and celebrating diversity and what not, but if you pipe up w/ anything resembling traditional Christian values or doctrine they wanna shut you up right quick. I also think "seperation of church and state" is probably the most misunderstood and misused part of the Constitution. People have interpreted it pretty liberally and run w/ it and basically tried to make it "complete removal of church from the state." I don't think that's what the founding fathers had in mind at all. Take a look at your money. Does it not say "In God We Trust?" I think most (although not all) of the founding fathers were devoutly religious and they would be rolling over in their graves to see what the whole seperation of church and state thing has turned into. Just my opinion though.

 

Balderdash. 46% of Americans describe themselves as fundamentalist or born again Christians, including our illustrious leader. This is not a discriminated against minority, but a large movement full of overweening pride and self-importance, who believe that everyone should believe what they do. Christians are discriminated against? I'll wager you'll see a woman, a black and a Jew elected president before an atheist comes anywhere close. Of course, I'm an atheist, so freedom from religion suits me perfectly. Christian culture and speech is all over this country, from the President's speeches to the parade I attended in Tacoma yesterday. Christians complaining about being locked out of the mainstream are like folks griping that there aren't enough white people in this country anymore.

 

With regards to "in god we trust" on the money, I must reiterate: poppycock. The founders did not insert that phrase into anything, and the motto Thomas Jefferson came up with was E Pluribus Unum. In 1861, the Reverend M.R. Watkinson persuaded the secretary of the Treasury to try to introduce 'In God We Trust' as a motto on the coins of the land, arguing on the theological premise that in a Judeo-Christian nation, 'There is but one God.' Congress, then beginning to be responsive to the religious community and the votes that it was presumed to control, passed the Coinage Act of April 22, 1864, which designated that 'In God We Trust' be put on coins 'when and where sufficient space in the balance of the design' would permit it. The phrase first appeared on the short lived 1864 two cent coin, and didn't appear again until 1908. It was 1916 before it made it onto the dime.

 

And while I'm at it I'd like to point out that "under god" was added to the pledge of allegience in the 50's as part of the whole McCarthy era fear of godless communists, not as some sacred intent from the founders of the United States. And now the President goes on television to spout off about god guiding us to victory. There is not enough separation of church and state for me, not by half.

[gregm]

giant squid have been referenced to in a number of threads in the spray section, and now this one as well.

 

also, i've changed the subject title.

 

[Fence_Sitter]

PubClub4Beelzebub alliterates well too...

that is not alliteration i dont think....

alliteration is like...

glowing green grass or something like that...

PubClub4Beelzebub alliterates well too... is what we call rhyming...

 

[Dave_Schuldt]

SATAN SAVES!

[RobBob]

Anyone see a resemblance?

[glen]

PubClub4Beelzebub alliterates well too... is what we call rhyming...

 

I stand corrected! Too much calculus in a day dulls your verbal skills.

 

 

I second what OW said.

After doing a quick google search on "church and state" I came across this tidy little graphic on a born-again site.

 

 

Not particularly relevant, but kinda funny.

[minx]

Off_White said:

Balderdash. 46% of Americans describe themselves as fundamentalist or born again Christians, including our illustrious leader. This is not a discriminated against minority, but a large movement full of overweening pride and self-importance, who believe that everyone should believe what they do. Christians are discriminated against? I'll wager you'll see a woman, a black and a Jew elected president before an atheist comes anywhere close. Of course, I'm an atheist, so freedom from religion suits me perfectly. Christian culture and speech is all over this country, from the President's speeches to the parade I attended in Tacoma yesterday. Christians complaining about being locked out of the mainstream are like folks griping that there aren't enough white people in this country anymore.

 

 

thanks! that's more what i was trying to say originally but i certainly lack your elegance.

 

so...YEAH! WHAT HE SAID!

[nolanr]

Off_White said:

nolanr said:

Well said. I think there's some kind of ironic thing going on in the US, people pay all kinds of lip service to religious freedom and tolerance and celebrating diversity and what not, but if you pipe up w/ anything resembling traditional Christian values or doctrine they wanna shut you up right quick. I also think "seperation of church and state" is probably the most misunderstood and misused part of the Constitution. People have interpreted it pretty liberally and run w/ it and basically tried to make it "complete removal of church from the state." I don't think that's what the founding fathers had in mind at all. Take a look at your money. Does it not say "In God We Trust?" I think most (although not all) of the founding fathers were devoutly religious and they would be rolling over in their graves to see what the whole seperation of church and state thing has turned into. Just my opinion though.

 

Balderdash. 46% of Americans describe themselves as fundamentalist or born again Christians, including our illustrious leader. This is not a discriminated against minority, but a large movement full of overweening pride and self-importance, who believe that everyone should believe what they do. Christians are discriminated against? I'll wager you'll see a woman, a black and a Jew elected president before an atheist comes anywhere close. Of course, I'm an atheist, so freedom from religion suits me perfectly. Christian culture and speech is all over this country, from the President's speeches to the parade I attended in Tacoma yesterday. Christians complaining about being locked out of the mainstream are like folks griping that there aren't enough white people in this country anymore.

 

With regards to "in god we trust" on the money, I must reiterate: poppycock. The founders did not insert that phrase into anything, and the motto Thomas Jefferson came up with was E Pluribus Unum. In 1861, the Reverend M.R. Watkinson persuaded the secretary of the Treasury to try to introduce 'In God We Trust' as a motto on the coins of the land, arguing on the theological premise that in a Judeo-Christian nation, 'There is but one God.' Congress, then beginning to be responsive to the religious community and the votes that it was presumed to control, passed the Coinage Act of April 22, 1864, which designated that 'In God We Trust' be put on coins 'when and where sufficient space in the balance of the design' would permit it. The phrase first appeared on the short lived 1864 two cent coin, and didn't appear again until 1908. It was 1916 before it made it onto the dime.

 

And while I'm at it I'd like to point out that "under god" was added to the pledge of allegience in the 50's as part of the whole McCarthy era fear of godless communists, not as some sacred intent from the founders of the United States. And now the President goes on television to spout off about god guiding us to victory. There is not enough separation of church and state for me, not by half.

 

Well you know your history better than I do. I had heard "under God" got added to the pledge at a fairly late date. I wasn't aware of the history of our coinage. Interesting post. I'm not at all about shoving any kind of religious beliefs or doctrines down anyone's throat, unfortunately some people are and then you end up w/ people who are offended or turned off to the whole idea. I think there's a lot of ebb and flow and push and shove and what not in terms of how big of a role religion plays in the mainstream. There's a whole spectrum of different ideas and there's no way everyone is ever going to agree completely. Oh well, I guess we'll have to do the best we can.

[Peter_Puget]

After seeing Climb4christ posting on RC.com I realized this thread was addressed to a real person and i finally read it. Thinking back to the first Gulf War I am reminded of these comments:

 

"Well," he said, "my daddy, he didn't leave me much, you know he was a very simple man,

but what he did tell me was this, he did say, son, he said"

- there was a long pause, nervous laughter from the crowd -

"he say, you know it's possible to become so defiled in this world

that your own father and mother will abandon you and if that happens,

God will always believe in your ability to mend your ways."

 

PP

[Dr_Flash_Amazing]

 

Say huh?

[Alasdair]

TellTheChristiansToShutTheFuckUp4Christ

[Sphinx]

[Sloth_Man]

I made it back in finally.

 

You guys are funny (mostly) this thread is entertaining as hell. I aggree anybody who comes in as climb4christ is a dick and deserves everything they get.

 

When I think that 30% of the US population is evengelical christian I get real scared. We're supposed to be an educated people, but really we're just as backwards as all them other crazy religious countries.

 

Whenever I hear Shrub talk jesus crap I get pretty irrate. It's as if the jerk off never even took a high school civics class.

 

Anyway, anybody who comes off with this "I know and you'll suffer if you don't believe" is nothing but a cultist, and far from what I would think a true follower of Jesus would be like.