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Alex

Cascades Ice conditions

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snaf.gif and $5 on a certain moderator gettin in a hissy fit and deleting, locking, or sending to SPRAY the whole thread rolleyes.gifthe_finger.gif

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I've held back chiming in on this for a couple of days trying to be objective in my own head ..... fuck it

 

Alex and others .... I find it some what ironic that you, who along with Jason M, have been scrounging up info on Washington ice from many of the regulars on this sight for almost two years ... take the position that you have.

Numerous people have shared great personal info here which we all have benefited from. But when asked to share yourselves you instead wish to dangle this "carrot" in front of those interested and say "No, finder's - keeper's .... neener, neener, neener".

 

I agree with Capt, Dru and Erik ... if you don't plan on being forthright with the information, if and when you are asked, and asked politely I might add, why bother posting it here.

 

When Jason posted up the first draft of "The Elusive Beast" back in '01 and asked for info from all of us here I promptly emailed him everything I had regarding the Chinook Pass, White Pass and south central Washington areas. I didn't even get a "thank you". Since then I have shared the same info with anyone and everyone that has asked (not that this area is any kind of a hidden gem).

I also find it somewhat arogant that today some people "find" areas that they claim to be "new" and "virgin". Not saying that the area in discussion is not a new "find", however simply pointing out that several climbing areas have gone thru times with little or no activity (Tieton in the early-mid 70's, Vantage in the late 70's- early 80's) and hence the lack of publicity. We all know they did sell ice tools in the '60's and '70's and I definatly agree with the premise that there area a good number of climbers both in the past and today that don't make all of their activity publicly known by submitting it to the numerous publications availble.

 

my $0.02 .... not meant to offend bigdrink.gif

 

sincerely,

 

wes

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I nominate Alex and Dave for Snaffelhound Tarzan Awards! moon.gif

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personally i dont care where its at

im not gonna go to wash. to ice climb anyhow

that would be like someone from canmore coming to chilliwack to ice climb rolleyes.gif

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wdietsch said:

Alex and others .... I find it some what ironic that you, who along with Jason M, have been scrounging up info on Washington ice from many of the regulars on this sight for almost two years ... take the position that you have.

Numerous people have shared great personal info here which we all have benefited from. But when asked to share yourselves you instead wish to dangle this "carrot" in front of those interested and say "No, finder's - keeper's .... neener, neener, neener".

 

I agree with Capt, Dru and Erik ... if you don't plan on being forthright with the information, if and when you are asked, and asked politely I might add, why bother posting it here.

 

When Jason posted up the first draft of "The Elusive Beast" back in '01 and asked for info from all of us here I promptly emailed him everything I had regarding the Chinook Pass, White Pass and south central Washington areas. I didn't even get a "thank you". Since then I have shared the same info with anyone and everyone that has asked (not that this area is any kind of a hidden gem).

I also find it somewhat arogant that today some people "find" areas that they claim to be "new" and "virgin". Not saying that the area in discussion is not a new "find", however simply pointing out that several climbing areas have gone thru times with little or no activity (Tieton in the early-mid 70's, Vantage in the late 70's- early 80's) and hence the lack of publicity. We all know they did sell ice tools in the '60's and '70's and I definatly agree with the premise that there area a good number of climbers both in the past and today that don't make all of their activity publicly known by submitting it to the numerous publications availble.

 

my $0.02 .... not meant to offend bigdrink.gif

 

sincerely,

 

wes

 

Wes,

 

I'm sorry if I didn't thank-you. I appreciate the information that you and others have provided us. All of you who have contributed have been a valuable resource. I feel bad that somehow I neglected to send you a personal email concerning the beta you sent me.

 

As I understand it, Alex was asked not to post beta on how to get to this particular area.

 

However, to indicate that neither Alex nor I have provided info since the first draft was posted some time ago is not true. I have personally responded to every post concerning areas that I did research on. If you put up specific questions we will do our best to respond with specific answers.

 

I have personally provided a great deal of beta to people through this website, through emails and over the phone. Those who made extremely large contributions have copies of the draft in many stages of development.

 

If you email me with a specific question about just about any other area than that that created this particular thread, I will answer it. If you post a question, I will answer it.

 

Again, I am really sorry that I did not thank you with a personal email.

 

Jason

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Wow, sounds like a bunch of eastern book trout fishermen talking about their "super secret" trout hole. hahahaha

Fucking ridiculous. fruit.gif

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alex

 

1) it probably melted in the rain last night

2) it isnt secret, look in don's guidebook, or on www.bivouac.com or the IcyBc web page

3) I have been told by several people, you are not cool, so beer would not help tongue.gif

 

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"There is no shortage of people being secrative about new routes, here or anywhere." - dbb

 

 

I think most everyone appreciates the idea of a secret area while new routes are going up. But lots of people are put off by the ego-stroking that's going along with this one.

 

How about......A STORY!

 

There is a guy who posts regularly on this site. He also has a website full of photos and route beta. He and his friends spent several years developing a series of excellent multi-pitch rock climbs on bomber granite. They didn't leak a word about it. They didn't post pictures and topos of their super-rad-biggest-fattest-west-side-rock-climb.

 

http://students.washington.edu/dbb/ice/ice_climbing3/ice_climbing3.htm

 

He didn't post TRs on CC.com about how good the rock was on his secret route. (i.e. "the ice was not only solid, but fun, plastic, excellent time." or "the ice was so good in this area")

 

 

Instead when their work was done the published a perfect topo of the whole area.

 

http://www.seanet.com/~mattp/Darr/westbutt.htm

 

Now that is "effortlessly cool" !

 

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I hear what people are saying - and agree that it is best to keep quiet about new areas unless you are prepared to share the information freely - but these guys didn't have to share any information with anyone, be it for the upcoming guidebook or any other occaision. They could have just as easily kept the area entirely to themselves and had their own private stash of ice for as long as they cared to.

 

I suspect that when the guidebook comes out there won't be hordes of wankers like myself laying siege to every tottering heap of ice within 5 miles of a road, and this may have something to do with their decision to keep things quiet until the book comes out and diffuses the crowds a bit.

 

Anyhow - I'm a firm believer in the "magic penny" philosophy when it comes to climbing areas - even though my personal FA list is limited to at most one 5.5 flaring chimney o' choss out in CO. I share my beta with you, you share your beta with me - and both of us end up having a better time and making better use of our limited time in the mountains as a result. If everyone kept their stuff secret, we'd all be sieging some weak-ass P.O.S. routes at Alpental and...well, never mind....

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My opinion is that there’s no ego-stroking going on here. I personally do not understand why people persist in referring to these guys as chestbeaters; I think people are just jealous (I know I am). I can see how the title of chestbeater and people’s irritation might be justified if these guys had posted reports that highlighted themselves as hardmen, and manifest an intention never to reveal where the ice is; however, these guys have not done this. DBB et al are being persecuted for posting a few innocent pictures, and being kind enough to share w/the rest of us their experiences in this new area. Furthermore, it has been made perfectly clear that the location of this area WILL be revealed in Alex and Jason’s book coming out this year.

 

I’m just as curious as the next ice climber to know where their ice is located, but I cannot fault these guys for wanting to keep a lid on the location temporarily. Hey, bagging FAs is a cool and noteworthy accomplishment. So these guys want dibs on some of the FAs in this new area--cool, they deserve it; the existence of ice in the area was their discovery.

 

My $.02

 

Edited by iceguy

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Well, I wouldn't quite say 'discovery' grin.gif. I know folks who have been up in this area many years ago and noticed ice potential. Who knows, maybe someone already climbed it all in the 70s! shocked.gif Hope not...

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