Alpine_Tom

quote: Originally posted by specialed: I think its unrealistic to expect outdoor retail salespeople to know everything about every product and have experience with it. Why would you rely on someone who is getting paid to sell you something for unbiased advice on a product anyway? I worked retail for about five years (computer sales, back in the old days, when you HAD to know what you were talking about.) I am pretty torn about buying stuff on the Internet (or mail order) vs. locally, because I feel, rightly or wrongly, that you "need" to keep local retailers in business.Bricks-and-mortar retailers are always going to have higher costs, so the only way for them to compete is by providing useful information.If I'm willing to do the research and figure out what the right crampon is for my particular need, then why should I pay the 20% extra for the privledge of picking it up in person? I bought a helmet from the REI Flagship store a couple of weeks ago, with my dividend. I'd pretty much decided that I should go with the Petzl Ecrin Roc, based on feedback from here, but I asked the sales guy, because it was a quiet day and he'd asked me if I needed any help, and it was as though I'd asked him which color fleece to buy. "Well, they're all good. It just depends on what you want."Great, thanks. (I forgot to ask about helmet decals, tho -- did I screw up? Are the BD decals compatible?)So, I got the Ecrin Roc, because I had the dividend check (and the 10% off), even though I could have saved $15 or so going on the Internet.Moral: if I know the model/size/style I need, I'll order it on the Internet; if I don't, I'll go to PMS. As others on this thread have observed, REI is heading down the trail Eddie Bauer blazed. Look for the new REI home store, opening soon near you.It wouldn't bother me a bit if the chinos and loafers and baby backpacks subsidized the climbing gear, but it seems just the oposite.

According to their website, this is the tent that got the Backpacker Magazine's Editors' Choice Award for 2002. I got a "GearMail" today that gives you 20% off on REI brand gear, which brings it down to a reasonable $120.

This advice all strikes me as perfectly accurate, but not very practical. The problem with all these recommendations -- wet vs. dry, accumulation zones vs. ablation zones, “reading the snow," is that they're of little use to a "newbie." The dotted line that so clearly separates the ablation and accumulation zones in the illustrations in “Freedom of the Hills” is often less visible on the actual glacier. Being able to read the snow is exactly what a newbie is NOT going to be good at. In my personal experience, which includes several solo glacier crossings, the only time I’ve seen a crevasse fall was on the Interglacier, in September, close to the rocks, when it looked perfectly reasonable to travel unroped (The leader, who went in, had the rope safely tucked in his pack! We’ve still never told his wife about the incident.) From my days of reading about the exploits of the Himalayan masters, I read about how Messner fell into a crevasse at the outset of his solo ascent of Everest, and (that Italian who’s name escapes me) fell into a crevasse and died after his solo sprint up K2 in 1986, in sight of the base camps. So, experience isn’t entirely protection. I think the reality is that most people, roped or unroped, don’t experience crevasses falls. Those that do usually experience small enough crevasses that they don’t actually go in. So it’s a combination of statistics being in your favor, and some luck. And, occasionally, disaster. If you go up normal routes on Sulphide Glacier or Inspiration Glacier, or following the boot-track on DC, you’ll likely be pretty safe. If yours are the only footprints on the Challenger Glacier, you’re probably taking a fair risk, no matter how well you can read the snow.

at the Copa Copacabana music and passion are always in fashion...

quote: Originally posted by To The Top: Kautz is nice, but I would also look at the Emmons route. You start out in a forest, then a meadow and then a snowfield, then either rock 3rd class or a glacier.TTT In my oh-so-humble opinion, the Emmons is the most boring route I've been on. It's a long slog through the trees, an interesting bit over the Interglacier and across to Camp Schurman, where you get to see you entire route spread out ahead of you. From there it's a steady, 30-degree slog meandering straight up the mountain. Nothing changes except when you look back to judge your progress against Little Tahoma. Finally you get to the bergschrund, and then the crater rim. The best part is that you get to slog back out the white river trail, which feels 20 miles long at the end of a summit weekend. Hike up to Camp Schurman as a practice trip, and you've seen the best of the route. Then you can go back and summit via Kautz, or DC. YMMV

NPR did a piece on him over the weekend, including the interview referenced above. Here's the link to the real audio archive: http://search1.npr.org/opt/collections/torched/wesa/data_wesa/seg_140425.htm

My God, I think that's Dan Larson!

quote: Originally posted by Mike Collins: The oldest bristlecone pine was not cut down by dendrologists but by a geologist who wanted to determine the age of a moraine which he was studying. He used crude dendrological methods for his work (i.e. cut down the tree). According to Galen Rowell in Mountain Light (p. 20, I'm home with a sick kid today) "The Forest Service had granted geographer Donald Currey permission to cut down a tree in order to date Little Ice Age events." This was in the Wheeler Peak area. He tried using a corer first, and it broke and rather than wait months for a replacement tool, he had it cut into sections and determined that the tree, named for posterity "WPN-114" (who says scientists aren't poetic?) was over 4000 years old, and older than any other trees in the area by 1200 years.The tree known as Methuselah is 4600 years old, and is someplace called Westguard Pass (p.12).

The place I've done it, which I guess you could duplicate up around Mt. Hood someplace, is on the snow walls at the side of the road up by Alpental. The walls were about 8 feet high at the time, and pretty hard, and looked enough like a crevasse edge (to us) with the benefit of being an easy drive ad no real danger.

One thing to keep in mind is that supplments are not regulated as drugs, the fda doesn't test them, and in fact manufacturers are forbidden from claiming any theraputic benefits. There are regular news reports of various supplement manufacturers including unlisted ingredients, varying dosages, impurities, and other reports that make me, anyhow, worry about what's in these things. According to the US Olympic Committee, the one independant lab that does testing for dietary supplements is consumerlab.com. Here's their report on Glucosamine:http://consumerlab.com/results/gluco.asp

Hikerwa, do you know the brand name of that camera mount, or who carries them?

Amongst all their other services, RMI does a one-day crevasse rescue school about a dozen times a year, and I'm considering taking it. Why? Well, though I've practiced crevasse rescue techniques (never for real, and hope to keep it that way) and set up z-pulley's, I've never had any formal training. I don't strongly feel the lack on my CV, but it would make my wife a bit happier about my "brushes with death." And, there's a bit of reassurance to knowing that someone who has done this a LOT and knows what it's supposed to look like has reviewed my technique. Plus, doing it under pressure -- in front of a bunch of other classmates -- seems like better practice than screwing around on the snow at Snoqualmie pass, which is where I've actually done it.Someone posed here in the last week that he'd taken the this course from RMI about 15 years ago (?) and thought it was a total waste of time. Does anyone else have any feedback on it? While it'd be nice to take two weeks for the AAI course, I haven't got the free time. I don't get two weeks in the mountains in two years (I know, wah, wah, I've made my bed, etc.) Besides, I can self-arrest. I can do pressure breathing. I can even put on crampons without getting hurt. I don't really want to hang around with a bunch of beginners learning how to put on a seat harness and practicing boot-axe belays.

This is the one I look to generally, NOAA's mountain weather forecasts. http://www.wrh.noaa.gov/seattle/forecast03.html

Nah, it wasn't Beckey. But the down suit had this big sewn-on patch that looked like a K-2 expedition logo. I wanted to ask, but "hey, are you someone famous?" is almost as tacky as not recognizing the name when they tell you.

That does it. I'm changing my name to Matt_Tom

I think it’s normally approached from Timberline. That’s the way I went, anyhow. I did it solo, and except for the short step, it seemed pretty safe. The amusing bit is that, as I was looking at the step, trying to figure out what to do, this old guy (in his seventies, I’m sure, in a one-piece down suit) came down it in telemark skis. Slow, one step at a time, but I figured if he could walk down it in skis, I could sure get up it with crampons and an ice axe.

You might look at the Wyeast route. Basically it wraps around the the right behind the Steele cliffs (see Oregon High.) It has the advantage of a great deal less traffic, and aside from one short fairly steep bit (which was thigh-deep powder when I did it, and really held my attention!) it's not particularly difficult or dangerous.

[ 03-13-2002: Message edited by: Alpine Tom ]

quote: Originally posted by mr. happy: what's the story on kropp? Well, I planned on really enjoying his book, since I'm a cyclist. But it's mostly about how everyone but him cheats -- he lists all these guys who didn't make it to the summit of climbs they claimed. And how no one appreciates him. So he decided that he'd climb Everest the only way that was fair -- he'd bicycle down there, climb solo, and bicycle home. Anything else would be cheating, you see?Certainly I don't begrudge him his feat; I'll never be capable of doing it. (For one thing, I have a job, a family, and a mortgage.) But he no more "did it himself" than Edmund Hillary. After all, he took full advantage of modern climbing gear, acclimatization, knowledge of physiology, route information, weather information, and every other advantage of the modern climbing scene. For his actual summit climb he didn't use the fixed ropes thru the icefall, but for his acclimatization climbs he did.His book reminds me of the quote by, I think, Newton, "If I've seen further than other's it's because I was standing on the shoulders of giants." Kropp doesn't seem to think he's standing on anyone's shoulders. It's all a question of degree, and you're certainly entitled to your own views of what's "fair means" and what's not, like Twight says, as long as you're honest about it. What I find offensive is that he takes his arbitrarily chosen personal values and uses them to judge every other climber.Plus, just so there's no question of how much more macho he is than you, he includes a tick list in the book, of all the peaks he's climbed. The kicker is that he claims in the book to be the second person to summit K2 without supplimental oxygen. This is in the '90s, about 94 or so, I think. Hell, the Wickwire expedition in '78 had three people summit without supplimental oxygen. That's what I meant by being a liar.

I've had good experiences with gearexpress.com.

I went up to Pilchuck a few weeks back (with kids, to go sledding) and there was a bit of a landslide a mile or so up the road. I wouldn't try it without four wheel drive. And, you might well have to walk the last half mile or so. But it's a fun winter outing, and (probably) not very dangerous from an avalanche pov.

"Touching the Void" remains one of the most vivid and scary books I've ever read. "In the Throne Room of the Mountain Gods", Galan Rowell's account of the first Wickwire expedition to K2, is well worth the read. Goran Kropp is a whiny, self-righteous jerk.And a liar. [ 03-06-2002: Message edited by: Alpine Tom ]

quote: Originally posted by max: On a related topic: Do any of you watch OLN much? Sorry to klenke for tangent-ing. When we got cable a few months back, I was thinking "OLN! Finally I get to see some of those cool climbing shows. And, of course, the Tour de France."So, every time I turn it on, what's on? FISHING! Every &*%#$@ time I look at OLN, it's a fishing show! You look at their website, and there's all this other stuff listed, but every time I flip to it, it's fishing, perhaps the only outdoor activity more boring to watch than golf.

Werner Herzog (the guy who did Fitzcarraldo, Nosfaratu, etc) made a film about Messner and someone else enchaining two himalayan summits, as I recall.It's called "Gasherbrum - the shining mountain" I saw it at the Harvard Exit in the early 80's when it was still a repertory theater, and well before I got interested in climbing. I checked once at scarecrow video, but they didn't have it there.

In Extreme Alpinism, Twight recommends a shovel that connects to the shaft of an ice axe, but doesn't mention any brands. Anyone know what he's talking about?