jclements

yeah one of these days I'm going to drop the gym and start climbing more at those sweet crags just down the street, right before work, several times a week. Otherwise no critique of American civilization applies to me.

I just spent 6 weeks in the Netherlands (yeah) and it was amazing to see the cycling and walking infrastructure they have over there, not to mention the public transport. Busses and trains everywhere. People will drive if they can afford it but they won't cycle or walk if they don't see it as a viable alterntative, factoring in laziness. In the Netherlands, and I would presume elsewhere in Europe, people walk because they have to. Everything's expensive. Cars are only a meter wide and get excellent mileage (kilometerage?). I'm thinking that if we don't rebuild our infrastructure to make it easier to bike and walk everywhere with all our green stimulus thinking we're doing something wrong. Just this morning, as I was waiting outside the doors of my gym waiting for it to open, it was maybe 40F. There were two big ass shiny diesel pickups in the parking lot idling their engines, presumably to keep the occupants warm while they waited for the gym to open. As soon as it was 5 am and the gym opened, people piled out of their cars. They're there to get fit, right? Doesn't getting out in the cold a bit help to stimulate the metabolism and burn calories? This is another thing: people are pampered from the cold, or just pampered in general in this country. In the NL a lot of folk have to walk to the train, bus, cycle, etc, outside more often. I did this for the time and found it an invigorating way to start the day. In most towns it is easier to walk or cycle and get outside than to drive. That, and we need to be able to smoke weed legally in public meeting houses.

glass pipe during flu season = MISTAKE.

We have a tree and shit.

I was just having a laugh, as they say in the Old Country. I'm in the pictures, with a glazed expression...

Well, my patent agent is billing me crazy on the Mountain Rescue Maximization Unit (MRMU), to be available for the spring REI catalog, but have your people call mine and they can talk licensing.

Oh, ONE word.

Word. Trapped coal miners, trapped kids in wells... This goes back to that Floyd Collins dude in the cave, big media attention, only if it weren't for those people in Nome needing diptheria vaccine, he'd a blown up even bigger on CNN. So here's a little device needing to be invented... rather than having a trusted person at home call rescue services, you get a special cell phone with a timer that calls out at some time when you should be back, leave it somewhere close to a tower near your excursion area. It calls 911 with your prerecorded voice that says, "Help, we're in trouble out here in X, and my cell phone is about to-" bam, clock is ticking on people in trouble in the backcountry, thereby doubling or tripling the rescue efforts. But where's the fun in that, really? Those Crystal snowboarders - maybe they coulda called out, but decided that ain't how they roll. In the movie, dude (played by Mark Wahlberg) opens his cell phone, looks at his best buddy from high school buried alongside him in the debris, insert shot of several bars on cell phone screen, and then his buddy nods, and Marky Mark clicks the cell phone shut.

Any books/sources you recommend?

Damn, you whipped that joke right to the end! It was a joke, right? The humor reminds me of my navy buddies... not that they ever, uh, oh forget it. Let's do it again soon. Without the uh, "after party."

I could have used something like this on a massive scree slog down in the Sierras back in Oct. I munched on Clif Bloks but clearly not enough- cramping that demanded stopping and eating for a while. Sometimes I feel like I'm not hard enough when I'm munching all kinds of gels and snacks and hydrating during a climb and a partner is barely taking anything in and gets kind of sullen towards the end of the day...

I don't recognize anyone in those pictures. Was this another function? I went to the Lucky Lab in PDX last night. Whoever it was I met last night, it was good doing so. And you guys look like an okay bunch too, hope to see ya around. Cheers!

I got a new vinyl Master of Reality bout a year ago (wore the CD out), sounds damn fine...

And dudes... like Ali G- respect.

I appreciate mattp's response, I don't think he was sidetracking anything - conversations work their way around... I might be wrong about Hood, I was just saying there is a threshold beyond which people shouldn't be venturing until they've had enough experience, as well as life experience. Sooner or later someone's going to try and get a 12 yo up Everest: it's not worth it, they need to experience a little more life first before they risk it to climb a mountain that carries a significant chance of death and bodily harm. So where's the threshold? As far as the ski/climbing thing: skiing is considered a relatively safe family activity, as such many more people do it. Climbing is considered dangerous (and not that fun) by a lot of non-climbing folk and thus keeps out many people. Though 25-50 people die skiing in the US every year, this would have to be considered with total number of skiiers. There has been a concerted effort in recent years to mandate the wearing of helmets by children while skiing. So to objectively compare the risks we would need to study an equally distributed population in both camps, in terms of experience, age, etc. I might be wrong, skiing in general might be a more dangerous activity.

If that were the case every parent that takes there kids skiing and snowboarding are in the same boat. Only if it were the case that the risks of mountaineering on Mount Hood and resort skiing were roughly equal, which, I'm sure you'll agree, are not.

Add me to the list of mountaineers who are adamantly advising you not to do this with your child, or any child. I think even a legal case could be made to charge you with child endangerment even if you were successful. Climbing, difficult climbing at high altitude as opposed to a walk-up, is no place for a child. I have not been up Hood (yet), but from what I can tell about the mountain, it is in a league above other mountains in North America, a glaciated volcano that carries a serious risk of death that no one, to my mind, has a right to calculate for another person as an elective endeavor. Even when professionally guided an adult must sign a waiver - in final the adult must make a decision for themselves. It is my belief that you do not have the right to make this decision for your son. I took my 5 yo son up Black Butte (mostly piggyback), a Class 1 walk up to 6400 feet or so and even that made me a little nervous, not from any objective danger but from the general sense I've gotten from many climbs to high altitude, and I'm sure many others get, that an exposed alpine terrain above treeline is a harsh environment that is hostile to human life. I get a kick out of being there myself, but I calculate my passage through it. Do a few climbs on your own and I'm sure you'll understand what I mean. In time I will take my son up higher (if he wants) but only when he is physically and mentally able to handle it, and only where the risk is minimal, in terms of rockfall, exposure to weather, etc, and I can most likely rescue him if need be. I will probably not allow him to climb high-altitude 4th or 5th class until he was of majority age, and that includes Hood. When he is 18, he can do whatever he wants. High summits of difficulty are the province of physically fit, skilled adults, period. Maybe you should consider a trip to Colorado, there are relatively easy walkups (and driveups) to 14k; done at the right time of year (usually early fall, when thunderstorms have abated) the risk is minimal, the exertion level satisfying, and the views decent.

Something... anybody? Mountains, misery, shoeing, climbing, skinning? Wednesday Dec. 5. Hood area?

Mike, thanks for dealing gracefully with my asshole phase of development here at cc.com. Good luck to you wherever you are. You should try and get yourself into Twight's gym. Of course when we're driving fifty plus miles to ski and climb you will be driving about a half hour to the insane pow. Just stock up on your liquor out here! I know how you feel. Climbed down in Bishop in Oct, with some local old-timers, met some cool folks, and really dug the scene, couldn't get over the surplus of good rock, and made me thinking of making a move myself one day. Cheers, John C.

I will be there.

Mountaineering IS kewl! "It doesn't have to be fun to be fun." Nicely done.

I'm gonna bail on this... a cold and sore throat has me laid up.

I'm thinking about renting some AT skis to try it. I've not done AT skinning before, so if that doesn't work out so I might have to just a-frame them up to a descent point. The weather looks to be shaping up...

My first time on this one, probably going to recon the SS. Day before T-day. Anyone care to join? Perhaps ski down...

Don't mean to Hijack the thread, but anyone have any ideas for stairs in the PDX area? I live in Hillsboro, about as flat as a lake- I go over to a local school that has about a twenty-step stairs and go up and down up and down...