kevbone

Remember the golden rule: Treat people how you would want them to treat you! Would you want someone to chop your bolts that you painstakenly placed?

Rap bolting is not shitty ethics, instead its the sign if a smart climber, most climbs that require bolts that were put up on lead are poorly protected. Rapping is the only way to be sure the bolt goes in the right place, the best route are TR first.

Do the bolts abstruct the holds at the top? Are they realy doing anyone any harm? Not including ego! 15 feet is far enough to fall and get hurt. Starting a war over a piece of rock is counter productive. Maybe trying to find the person and disscusing it might be the best approch. They did not acctually retro a route, since the only way to climb the route is to solo it. No one owns the rock. It is a hard call.

Thanks bill for cleaning, portland needs new routes, cleaning dirt out of cracks and off of faces is super hard work. Once again thanks for taking the time to clean. As far as putting anchors in, you know I am a fan of not topping out on singe pitch cliffs, expecially where the soil is not stable and there is an abudance of that poison stuff. If the routes are new, then it is entirely your call as to how you want to climb it and protect it. Maybe put the anchor is such a place that you have to climb the route to get to them or rap it. Some climbs there you can walk up to the anchor from the top. As for the bolts, I like the five piece rawls. Or the studs you gave Jim a while ago! Those are bomer! Once again, thanks for doing vertical cleaning, I know how painstaking that kind of work is.

Maybe we should put a large 4 foot carved wooded owl on big ledge in the back so no one on the ground can see it, the birds will never nest there again.

How is the bird watching going?

How many accents does City Park have?

I dont care if is climbed it or not, he should not have put in on camera, and not sprayed about it.

Wow Joe, thank the maker we both love to climb. Maybe our views are different about climbing, but our goals seem to be the same, get to the top! Maybe how we get there might be different and thats ok.

Jim cleaned the crap out of it before he led it. I was there and helped clean it and belayed him on the first accent. The style is, what it is. Ground up FA are bold and have a style all on there own, but does not always make a safe and great route. Have you ever been to Jtree, that is a good example of ground up. However bold and glorious, most of those bolted climbs are poorly protected and people get hurt. As far as Genesis goes, he rapped in and put a TR on it, and cleaned it top down. Lets not forget. Most of the climbs on the south face, that we all enjoy, looked like a forest at one time, and Jim and company power cleaned it so you and I can enjoy it. And they did not have to check with big brother to do it.

Like I said "To my knowledge they were put up just like any other climb. Cleaned it, top roped, drilled it, lead it" I appreciate the importance of following the rules, but come on! Letting 2 guys clean some moss, so maybe 10 other people might climb there over the next 20 years is not much to ask, considering how much of Beacon Rock they destroyed putting the trail in, so 600,000 people a year can walk to the top. Or how many trees they cut down in the forrest to build the road you and I drive on to get to Beacon. Having to ask big brother if its ok to play on our big toy is lame. Where does it end? Soon we will have to sign in to climb there.

Yes, those are the routes in question. Thanks for the beta. What do you mean by "the way they were put up" To my knowledge they were put up just like any other climb. Cleaned it, top roped, it drilled, lead it. Its the ranger that had a problem. Any there problem was a lame one at that.

Has anybody climbed Genesis, Jims route on the west face near the parking lot, its got a couple of bolts (optional)? Half way up it you can skirt right (up a different line) up a bolted line that goes all the way up to the next rap station. Does anybody know anything about this route? What it goes at?

I have entered the relm of not being immune to poision oak anymore. I got it on my arms a couple of weeks ago. First time for everything.

I believe that part of the rock is open all year round. You are not able to clean anything, so the opening is a little arbitrary. The existing routes need cleaning and the routes that are ready to be put up need cleaning, so the park is kind of laughing at us. Ha ha!! We will give them this part of the rock to climb on knowing we cant do anything with it without cleaning it properly. Otherwise we are kind of bushwacking! All for some senitive moss that grows all over the entire rock! I just think it is a shame. If you did open it to whoever, only the bold and few would tackle such a huge job of putting routes up on the west face. I help Jim clean Genesis, what a chore that was!

Joe, once again thanks for monitoring the birds and keeping us informed about the possibility of a early opening. As far as your comments on possible routes on the upper NW face: "The protocol in question will likely be the approval of overall lines after a review versus inidividual pieces with the understanding that the priority on the routes be gear, pins, and bolts as a last resort in keeping with Beacon traditions. At this time the BRSP is considering the possibiliy of either they or the BRCA providing the fixed protection required for a route. "Approval of overall lines after a review" will probably entail both identifying what mix of fixed protection is required, and on which stretches of the route, and a survey of objective hazards. " I think this is what John was talking about, the politics that will go along with someone else deciding whether or not a fall is safe on a route they are not putting up will get crazy! If I or someone else overbolts a route, so be it, its there choice being that they are the ones putting the route up. They may be ridiculed for life for it, but once again its intirely the FA choice, thats how its always been. So having a comitty making decisions on what is appropriate gear VS bolts is arbitrary. You may think its safe and another person might not. As for the use of pins, I know you are a little bit more old school than I (that is not a burn), but in my opinion pins are not used because we have powers drills and strong bolts now, its not the 70s anymore, we as climbers dont need to use pins anymore. Im not trying to argue with you, its just the thought of having to submit a route request that makes sence to me, only to be denied because the chairperson is old school (that does not mean you)and shoots it down, its crazy. Of course this may be the only way it will be accomplished. Just my thoughts.

I thought this was cascade CLIMBERS.com not cascade politics.com, any body have any good CLIMBING stories to tell?

Beacon has alot of loose rock and poison oak, stay away!

This county was founded on imigrants, lets not forget that.

Dont forget about Carver, one of the best places to climb, you can lead 5.8 gear and TR 11s and lead 10b face and tr 12s. It a great summer crag due to north facing.

Tell him to hit the gym and make friends with people. Most of the good climbing fiends I have I met at the gym over the last 10 years.

what the hell are you all talking about???

Whats this I hear about Beacon opening this Sunday?

Cool!!!

Just to the right of the parking lot (water fountain) are a couple of realy nice face climbs that protect with gear, they are both about 10+ and are not for beginer climbers, you can TR all of these routes by climbing up the 5.6 gully (dirty) to the big tree, if you climb the route directly under the tree, it is called Forbiden slab 10B, with a piton. Way over to the right is a climb called Genesis, put up by the Flying Dutchman about 3 years ago. It goes at about 5.7 or so, there are a couple of bolts but they are optional. At that anchor you can step right and climb a bolted climb up to an anchor, from there you step left and climb the original line (Circa 1910 or so), using the original metal rods sticking out of the wall about 8 inches or so, your pro is slinging these. Unfortunataly like Joseph said we are not able to develop any more over here due to some sensitive moss growing there. But what is there is fun.