billcoe

Hmmm, I'm not in that realm of leading where I can go out and free an unclimbed aid route. It seemed to me that it would be a nice thing to smooth out the sharp areas for the fingers though. But both Mark and Tex should be listened too. Guys, I have a cliff in mind which would be perfect. Furthermore, it's closer to PDX than Beacon. Thats the upside. Downside, it's only @80-100 feet high, has a lot of Poison Oak, and its on private property. There are no, no trespassing signs or issues.........yet. But it should be kept fairly low key. I'll PM you.

Tex, as I understand it, they caught a small group which didn't have the wire seating correctly on the nose. They fear that the carabiner would only have the gate open strength. They must have caught some with this after their regular QC, so thus the recall. Bill

Did he mention if those were my bolts that got chopped? Actually, Jim asked if I wouldn't share info with Tim O when he heard the guide was being done. When Tim called me, out of repect to Jim and the others who were regulars at Beacon and the Butte, I didn't share. I was pretty straight up with Tim about not sharing though. Later when I bumped into Tim, he thought I had some problem with him cause he remembered my lack of help and then he did the guidebook anyway: there was no truth to it. Tims seems like a nice guy, and I have a lot of respect for the work that went into the guide. I have not thanked him for some niceities of layout I noticed to spread the climbing load, but I will if I see ever see him in person. My preferance is to generally not say anything to someone rather than to say something intentionally misleading. That does, however, explain some of the many things which are incorrect in the Climbing Guide to Portland area book. Some things never change, fortunatly! Sounds like you had a great time!

Jim has a heart of gold. I was surprised, shocked and saddened to see Dwight Bishop get the chop last week. Since Dwight was also my age and had more knowledge, skill, strength and vast climbing experience than 99.99% of us, still climbing 5.13 at 50 years old and having previously soloed the North Face of the Eiger would be 2 of many potential examples. It really left an unsettled feeling in my heart and a confusion in my mind. It makes me ruminate how long any of us are going to be here. I'm glad you got to spend some time with Jim: Ivan. Jims now 60, I'm 50. I should give him a call and say hi. Did you finish the SE corner on his Young Warriors route?

Thanks, I'm going to try to avoid the heat this weekend and skip Beacon. -------------------------------------------------------------- At both ends AND THE MIDDLE of the climber spectrum there is a sprayer class.

You guys did an awesome job: thanks for sharing. I particularly like seeing that old folks I know are still cranking: Wayne Wallace and John Petrosky come to mind. Hadn't seen John for probably some 20+ years, anyone sees him say hi for me. My palms were sweating in a couple of places. Reading Waynes piece on Logan knowing that by the time it have gotten a "little dicey" for Wayne I probably would have already Pissed and shit all over my self in fear was one of them. The content and layout are first class throughout, great work fellas.

Ohhhhhh, Hangerlessbolt, got it. Dude, I got it, it just takes me a while. You're T's signifigant other! Dohhh. We should climb together sometime. Say hi back to her, haven't seen her in a long time. If you are free tonight I'll most like be out there. Can be there for sure. Butte at 6:15pm or so? Maybe I should post this in the "events" forum.

Hanger, don't know about Gunsmoke having a missing hanger, didn't remember that route having a bolt on it at all and haven't been over that way for a couple of months so who can say, but that rusty stud on Bite the bullet has been that way for at least 10-11 years. Isn't there 2 on it? I keep expecting to rip my knees on that one bolt at the crux if I fall there, but haven't done it yet. There's still time. Also, re-read your post above, are you saying you rapped down and then went quite some distance away and just left your stuff there for 5-1/2 hours or so? Don't mean to be disrespectful, but for most climbing areas, or most public area like the grocery store, if you leave webbing and/or something like that laying there or hanging someplace and walk away, at some point people will consider it abandoned (ie Booty). That booty point gets debated all of the time on this site, ie, what is or isn't booty, but regardless, it is not unheard of for people to find gear abandoned on routes out there. I had a guy come up and ask me once while we were tossing our gear into the car at the end of a day: is this rope yours? Uhhhh, "no, why, we asked?" Well, it had been hanging off a chain for a week evidently, the guy had pulled it to climb the route and wanted to find the owner. We suggested he leave it there, but he wanted to find the owner, and putting it back would put it at risk of theft (or of being bootyed). So he left a note through the chain with his phone number etc. and I kept seeing that note there for over a month. Don't know if the fella ever remembered he'd left the rope. Point is, best not leave your stuff laying there by itself for hours on end. Most people will just leave it alone (the rope on the chains for a week wasn't touched and I'm sure people saw it) but thats a real mixed bag sad to say. Speaking of gear lost at the Butte: is this your post? http://www.rockclimbing.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=65708&highlight=rocky+butte Anyway, Kelly isn't the type to call the police, but you're right, he probably could have, maybe even should have. I wonder though, that if the authorities get enough of those kinds of calls (like the 4 people who pitched off the cliff this spring) if they might close it down. I think most of us wouldn't want to see that.

Carston: Schweeeettt! You got on it and cranked. Anyone else on the corner with you? You kidding about the falcon?

This line added: this is turning into an ethics/re-bolting question further down the thread and I am actively soliciting opinions. My weekend sucked for getting out and climbing (but my daughter had a great graduation party), I showed up here expecting a vicarious thrill to the see 20-30 TR's of the weekend at Beacon since it just opened and lots of people were making plans for getting out there. I see nothing. Could somebody advise if it was empty out there or if it was hot and cold running people? Were the routes dirty or was there fresh rockfall from the winter like last year. Anyone get out there?

There's bolts with no hangers all over up there at various places, some of those studs have been there for many many years. Are you saying someone pulled some hangers or chains recently and left studs or perhaps you might have just noticed the stud for the first time but it might have been that way for 15 years? What routes were the draws on and what route were you on? Was that Saturday or Sunday? Sundays usually get lots of Christians, and although I won't speak ill of them myself, I've climbed with a couple and they were as good as they get IMO. However, my friend Kelly is 100 percent certain the young folks throwing rocks at his group on video bluff were Christians cause he caught them. I've heard the rock throwing story from others who witnessed it. Basically it's this: rocks got tossed down: climbers start screaming up to the miscreants to stop it immediatly, people could get hurt blah blah: then more rocks get thrown acoumpanied by laughter, Kelly Warden runs up to the top of the cliff and catches a group of them, who were unrepentant till he starts screaming at them. I couldn't believe Kelly didn't get physical and kick some a**. I'd be sorely tempted after chasing and catching - literally catching, the people responsible. I'd like to think Kelly has been too busy to get out there recently, and not just sick of this kind of crap up there. Hell, I even bought a helmet which I hope is rated to 1 Heinikan bottle. Of course I don't think its rated to take either a video monitor, TV or one of those shopping carts which periodically get pushed over the top. Pretty sure it would be fine against underpants, condoms and hypodermics though. Anyway, curious what routes were you guys were on?

What OW are at Smith? Anyone......... Anyone......... I don't think King Kong would be valid, but how about the 5th pitch of the route that goes up Parking lot wall, Free lunch? Anyone?

http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/plab/showphoto.php?photo=162&papass=&sort=1&thecat=500 Damn, gonna get booty, karma points and more booty. Sweet.

To carry or not to carry, that is the question. What I learned is that if you draw down on a Cougar they obviously will recognise the caliber of the weapon and back the hell off. So, the moral that is bigger IS better! My feeling is that any sane cougar would back off when eyeing my rolling bulk, and would halt in its tracks, knowing instinctively that it wouldn't have a chance in hell of dragging me off. So no need for me to carry. Hmmmm, unless the same cougar was thinking...."Hmmmm , my family and I could live off of that lard-ass for at least a summer or 3". Hmmmm - better carry I guess. I'm undecided about the carring thing, maybe I should just lose some weight. Yeah, that would help.

I don't think that is me either although I've been called Wild Bill many times. Well, the puff up the chest and spray part hits fairly close to home though...hmmmm..... Red hair? Nope, use to be kind of yellow now theres not enough left on me to really tell. Most assuredly not me......well, except for the spray part of course.

Nice!

Ivan, if that history teaching thing doesn't work out, you have to start teaching the pups creative writing! A little spell check and *poof*, awesome stuff, thanks!

I'll keep a look out, as I'm sure we all will. Was anything marked w/tape or felt tip or....? I hope you find the bastard(s), good luck.

Kunza Korner, Pioneer route and Trezlar at Smith Raindance, Blownout, Little Wing, and Young Warriors at Beacon. Harry Daley and Nutcracker at Yos (ya gotta almost drive by Nutcracker to get in the valley and its a great warm up) Iain: whats the "fricken phone call from satan thing" route and is it correctly spoken in a voice like Dr Evil's?

one time i got 4 locking biners and 2 spectra slings off orchard rock at peshastin. they were attached to a pair of rap rings I don't think anyone leaves carabiners on established raps. Yes you CAN rap directly off of slings, but WHY? I used to do it occasionly while getting down in new territory, ie, burn a sling on a chockstone and rap: but since I have the money now and rarely get in new territory, I just burn a couple of biners if I hit a rapstation with slings only. Why not? Life is already too short.

Damn:..................sucks. I remember the first time I had my pack stolen up there: it was on my motorcycle at the top, I was bouldering on the vertical part - within view, back to the bike. I never saw it again. Still long for the coat that was in there. The most blatant theft I heard about probably was when Kelly Warden had a rope pulled up and stolen which was set up on Birds while he was down below and had his back turned. I think that was just last year. Hope your stuff turns up, was it marked in any way? I put my name and the date on my runners in felt tip, for instance. (They get old faster than you can imagine, and it's nice to know when you bought them for retirement purposes). Bill

Hoax? (Not the Butt inuendo, thats real I just read it) Published: June 03, 2004 12:20 PM EST NEW YORK Associated Press editors were forced to retract an earlier report that a meteorite might have hit near Olympia, Wash., this morning after discovering that a source, one Bradley Hammermaster, claiming to be an astronomy professor, had perpetrated a hoax. http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000524192 Maybe ya all heard swamp gas? That might explain the Butt inuendo too:

Good point DC. It wasn't that long ago Lynn Hill, whom is widely thought of highly for both her safety skills and climbing skill, climbed an entire route thinking she was tyed in - with the rope only loosely run through her harness and augered in from the top of the climb after leaning back to lower. Same kind of thing, lots of highly skilled climbing people and no one paying attention to that 1 little critical detail. Fortunatly, she was very lucky and miraculosly escaped serious injury.

I agree with Rumr. If "not" an accident, then it was intentional, ie: murder. Thats way out of line. Better just to post facts and not speculation, I'm sure those involved feel terrible already. Jeffski: Sounds like the 2nd rope wasnt' even tied to the first rope and the belayer ran out of rope and it slipped through his belay device. The remarqable part is that it sounds like there were plenty of qualified people standing around talking, none of whom noticed this glaring glitch. How the heck does that happen?

I bought one of the Cassins for anybody who seconds me. I had had a wooden handle cassin Mike Jackson had brought over from Italy and my friend Kelly Warden broke the shaft. It would have been a good hammer for the alps, shere light weight, fast ascents and occasional "testing" of pins is a consideration, but not for the US. The high points for the $12 Cassin. It's light. It's cheap. Metal handle. Coincidentally, the high points are also the low points. A light cheap hammer isn't worth a F* when you need to seriously pound the living shit to get a pin some asswipe chickenshit like me has wanged way deep and hard due to excessive fear with something like a Forest Molinar, (which should be the hammer you use except I won't sell mine and they aren't made any more.) The metal handle sounds good till you get carpal tunnel from it. Surprised no-one has mentioned the A5? Be my first choice but I haven't seen or used that Kong, it looks good and Climaxe is very competively priced.Are the A5's still made? So, not knowing what you will primarilly use it for, if you're only going to occasionally use it, or want alpine rock, get the Cassin as it's light, being absurdly cheap doesn't hurt either. For serious stuff, you will rooo the day you bought it. Spend the money and get a good solid hammer. Thats my thoughts: b