billcoe

Well I would have said it that way if I hadn't been drinkin" I don't know about all of it now that I'm thinking about it Doug. Maybe the last 4 words could be re-considered. I have a flight into Bangkok in a few days to remind me of that last point...the airport is closed now due to political protesters who are getting hosed by the asswipes running the country and they want freedom. So I guess I would have said it your way except for the 2nd part of your post. Because it is our problem sometimes. Had it been your family, it would then have been your problem, and I guess I could have looked over and said, well, it sucks to be you: but that's not my problem. Had you, your parents or your children been in Mumbai you might have left out the last part of your post too. OR, perhaps we can just sit here and wait till it comes to us and then cross out the last part. It will come to us if we ignore it, and it will not be because we Americans are assholes, but because that's just the way it is. The solution to that is to forward project and correct it where we can and try to change our own countries often boorish overseas behavior. We can and do encourage governments to not fund Madrasah, Mosques and other religious schools that have a violent agenda (like recently in Saudi Arabia). We encourage these to be closed if they don't (like in Jordon), and if you have too, you kill those who are at war with you and would kill you (insert lots of examples in lots of countries here-maybe not Denmark with the islamic cartoons or the Netherlands though). So I think we pick and chose to deal with things which may forward project into our life and our country's life and be a threat to any or all of us in the future. Had someone stepped up and offed Hitler in 1938 instead of pandering, perhaps 20 million more lives would have been spared. When do we choose to be pro-active or just walk away? I can't say, every case is different. Those responsible for these decisions have difficult choices. It is much easier to second guess it when it doesn't work out. We helped overthrow the Iranian government in the 50's and they hate us for it. Now we are facing an Iranian gov't which hates us for what we stand for and what we have done to them in the past and in the not to distant (Iraqi-Iranian war) past. Then when it's over and the deal has gone down: when we are all safe, sound and what we believe to be untouchable, like now, we (or some of these guys on this site) can all sit and bitch about those of our brothers who are risking it all so we can be safe. They can bitch about how evil we in the US are: at no personal cost to themselves. But yet as much bitching ad self-loathing as these folks do, this shit still remains hanging over our heads like the Sword of Damocles, and rears it's ugly head like on this occasion. Take care all

True dat. I'd agree even more if everytime the redneck woman said something the other dumb bitch in red disagreed with BUT WAS TOO STUPID TO FIGURE OUT A REAL ANSWER TOO: the dumb bitch in red said "You're just stupid" or "YOU F*ING IGNORANT". Or something along those lines. Then it would be spot on money Trash. ESPECIALLY when the red dress dumbkauph couldn't come up with an intelligent response

Actually, Islam in general, despite a spotty record here and there, is often fairly good at leaving other religions alone. There have been strong Jewish and Christian communities in many middle eastern countries for centuries. Once you commit to Islam, it is a death sentence to renounce it.

They do this shit to all kinds of people, including for thought crime. They will execute you for lots of reasons. The former Cat Stevens had a Fatwas proclaimed by some Saudi Arabian Asshat(later revoked) for chanting and recording the Koran (forbidden). The writer Salmon Rushdie may still have a fatwa issued by the Ayatola asshat on his ass. It was the duty of any Muslim who comes across Rushdie to kill him immediately for his writing which was claimed by said asshat to have offended Islam.

Rudy's post title was "Fucked up". What is happening in Mombay is. God forbid it come over here to our shores and to our loved ones. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-493570/Gays-tortured-hanged-says-Iranian-minister-meeting-British-MPs.html The Iranian PM's pronouncement was met with derision when he stated that Iran has no homosexuals while touring a US college campus a year ago. Here's what they do to gays for just being homosexual: 2 gay teenagers.

Something we as North Americans agree on, Pam Anderson should be encouraged to continue to dress, act and look like this. Something most Muslims agree on (Arab and Persian Muslims) is that this whore should be taken out into a public square and horsewhipped till she bleeds and collapses in a heap. In fact, a few years ago an American woman who's skirt was above her knees received that very punishment in Iran. In fact in the kingdom, women canot drive and face that kind of punishment if they violate Gods law and do so. So it's true what they say: "different strokes for different folks". Here's a picture of a guy who had reportedly drank 2 beers and got caught doing it in Iran. 2 beers = 130 lashes in public (they say).

Damm, I need to get out and climb more. Thanks for the heads up Kevin!

That's really well spoken JB. Except for your last line. I don't think that "Evil Homonym" was a name you were called though as much as it was about government subsidies. JayB, good post as usual: however, I have to disagree with your point about farmers making those choices was something which was occurring in the not too distant past. We were the poorer for it. Society would then endure times of starvation and famine when poor or incorrect farmer choices collided with weather patterns. Government intervention and insurance (paying for farmers to not plant) has assisted increased crop yields (which also benefited from Government interventions through knowledge sharing, water projects, and various research programs) in virtually ending this hunger and starvation whipsaw pattern. Yes, there is a price to pay for this insurance premium, this inefficiency. However, no one is starving in this country. In fact, on average the reverse is true, and the common person eats better than Kings of old. Thankfully!

Same question is do you belay off the anchor or not? As far at this specific answer goes for this thread, if you clip above the powerpoint, are you not then getting the failure at the weakest piece? If you clipped a single piece, then you might have guessed on the stronger of the 2 and be further ahead. Interesting that Pat Ament (Posts as Patrick Oliver), doesn't know what a Powerpoint is. Bet he's never heard of a shelf either:-) Probably a few hundred years of climbing experience in the first 26 posts alone.

It's close to a done deal unfortunately. I believe this area is in the boundary (but perhaps not). Expect new rules and regulations next year. Obviously we all need better and closer supervision from King George on the Kings land. It's been discussed on this site, you can do a search. It will make the lawyers, the government workers (job security) and a few others happy. Not me, it's total bullshit. F*uck.

Now, you guys aren't just making sh*t up to fu* with an old man are ya? Check this out for a similar thread: http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?topic_id=731822

Yah, what was wrong with the old "arbitrary and capricious" teachers just beat your ass program of olden day? Always with these new programs. Side note: only whacked both kids 2 times total for both. Turned out great. However, there were damn strict rules which were well understood by both sides and kids, and they were so well behaved. Because there were clear rules,expectations, consequences and benefits. hmmm...... Have the same thing with the mutts, but they still piss on the carpet.

Shelf? Whats a shelf?

Well I for one just read yesterday that Obama was seriously going to go through the budget line by line and get rid of all the crap. He emphasized that we HAVE to get the deficit down. WE MUST! I can only say, that had he reemphasized it louder during his run, he would have won by an even larger margin. So as long as he is going to out-republican the republicans who only seem to stand for huge deficits and big government, and he wants to do the important things our county MUST archive to survive and move forward: I say if he wants to send his kids to a private school like a real repub, I'm fine with it. The challenges facing our new president are deep and wide thanks to the previous admin screwing the pooch. I'm glad he's the person leading this charge. We need an inclusive and deep thinker with physical stamina to match the mental depth needed. This is the guy. McCain would have been overwhelmed and we would have been sooooooo screwed. Obama is hiring what he perceives as the best people to do the job. Not (just) political hacks. Now that's a maverick.

Damn, shit like that really happens. We should take up a collection and buy that lad a shop vac.

Yes. Serious questions deserve serious answers. This pic from the John Frieh Rocky Butte collection should get you to ruminating on some of the flakes these tools may have pulled off. Look at the ground. I'm kidding. They climb routes which they FA developed with and for tools. Like John said.

Here's to hope and change:

I fixed that for you:-)

Better to be dumb than an insulting piece of shit such as yourself Pat, who cannot even answer a simple question.

Lots of words. Still avoiding the question. Either admit you cannot answer it or just confess your stupidity and be done with it.

Ditto and Congrats Elmo. This is further down @ 50' from Dougs route Pumping for the Man? BTW, if you are workin out there, you might consider drilling anchors on potential routes before the area becomes wilderness.

You guys rule for gettin' on it all winter. Small note: I think we may have discussed this. I did not trundle the obvious block on top where you dry tool, and although I only got up to the Butte maybe 5 times this year, it did appear at some point someone has been digging behind that boulder. I have a distinct feeling that it would roll without too much work. Sooo, I guess you guys can figure out if you want to avoid it or roll it. I once rolled a rock one winter (best time, as the leaves are off the trees for good visibility and there is less folks around as well) with a spotter at the base with a walkie talkie to give me the "all clear" (Dan Forester). Seemed like a pretty good strategy. He wandered around the base area looking for folks to make very very sure no one was there. That rock was @1/4 of the size of your block and was still very impressive in the trail of destruction it left. The part that surprised me, it was on the very top of Tiger Paws. I'd climbed that route many times-many many folks have, then boing/ out of the blue one day there's a small boulder right at the top out that use to be a solid grip and now it's rocking out 6" right above you when you get the same finger lock that use to be solid. Point, be careful but have fun:-) Dress warm.

Sorry, I just sprayed coffee all over the keyboard trying to stifle my laughter. Good luck in your new 'no resources required' universe. Once you've cleaned off the keyboard, can you show me an example of a critical resource that was completely depleted before substitution, conservation, and innovation made the problems presented by the scarcity of the said resource manageable - if not null and void? That's the question. I'm sure you can find at leas one example. Hell, I bet I probably could. Were Passenger Pigeons Critical resources?...Hmmm, probably not.

You might try reading JayBs question as you flapped your lips quite a lot and didn't answer it. Maybe you can't, so you fill up the space with hot air.

Actually, no one said jack shit about her not being pretty enough for the job. The facts were merely laid out. If being attractive was a criteria, neither of the presidential candidates would have made it that far, and Sarah Palin would be in office. But you could alternatively try reading what people ACTUALLY wrote on the thread as a starter, which, as it turns out, is different than what you THINK they wrote.