Off_White

I recently read Roper's book (note: no relation to Steve Roper, venerable Yosemite climber and early guidebook author) and didn't find it a total loss, but the things he got completely wrong about the parts I knew intimately did call all of his other facts into question. The two things I thing he got somewhat right was some of the nature of Unsoeld's character and the idea of 1976 being a time of change in the nature of Himalayan expedition climbing. Maybe it was just the number of Unsoeld's direct quotes and writings that got me, because I could hear them in Willi's voice, and it was wonderful to "hear" it again after all these years. Roper's posit on expeditions was that they were changing from the "gentlemen climbers working for the glory of the team" to a more stratified class system where the superstars work to place themselves in the right place to summit because success=sponsorship=making a living as a professional climber, and that this led to more "me" and less "us" with a lot of hurt feelings. I think you could also make a point that it was always that way, and it wasn't until that time that people would admit it in print. Galen Rowell's book about a failed K2 expedition, Throne Room of the Mountain King (I think thats the title) was a great expose of an expedition gone sour, featuring Big Lou in a starring role. Its been a long time since I read Roskelly's book, and I see its out for another round with a fresh foreward, Roskelly reflecting on the past from the perspective of an older family guy now instead of 20 something hot boy upstart. I do think Roskelly was one of the best (if not THE best) American alpinists of his time, but even by his own admission interpersonal skills were not his forte. Its worth a read, but it is strictly Roskelly's side of the story. I never read Leamer's book, so maybe I need to go back and give it a look-see. What I recall from the time it came out was how upset the Unsoeld family was about it, and that kind of put me off it back then.

[ 10-15-2002, 07:16 PM: Message edited by: Off White ]

G. Gordon Liddy is certainly a self-inflating asshole of the first water, which is not to say that he isn't entertaining. He gets points for being the only Watergate conspirator not to have some smarmy conversion to Christianity or grovel in some mudpit of remorse or self-pity.

I seem to be developing a stutter, gotta be more careful with the chlorinated hydrocarbons. [ 10-15-2002, 05:36 PM: Message edited by: Off White ]

I think the gunks has the most amazing collection of "easy" climbs on the planet. Easy in the rating sense, they're sure not giveaways for the uninitiated.

Stayed up all night to watch horror movies, TR in spray. Spent the rest of the weekend recovering from staying up all night. I've discovered how to get that forced bivy feeling without leaving town.

quote: Originally posted by Muffy The Wanker Sprayer:[/qb]pisses me off too and I'm not even a HUSKIES FAN [/QB] C'mon Muff, haven't we had enough threads about people and their dogs?

great, thanks for the link!

I think in the "old days" it wasn't cool to be from Utah, you had to be from Colorado and go climbing in Utah. Climbing (the magazine) has always been based in CO, same deal for R&I. I recall being psyched when Climbing first came out, because up until then all we had was the odd American report in Mountain (British mag for those unfamiliar). Being a Californian at the time, the Colorado bias swiftly became apparent, but the two states have never really been a mutual admiration society. Off Belay and Summit were cool because they were so much less ambitious, seemingly more the vision of folks not so impressed with themselves: geeky sometimes but it didn't seem like they kept one one on the mirror all the time. Anybody remember Moutain Gazette? It was more arty, a big newsprint magazine. If I ever get those bookshelves done I'll have to exhume the old collection from it's dusty carboard cartons. As far as the current crop goes, it doesn't offend me to look at it now and then, but it doesn't really move me to own it either. I do like a nice picture now and then though. My main climbing reading these last years has been guidebooks, sometimes piled up 4 or 5 deep next to the bed.

Yeah, forget the milk challenge, lets have the milk bottle challenge: who can hold onto a flaming plastic milk jug the longest.

Yow, a lucky man. Rappel anchor failure is rarely survivable. Glad he's alive, and another thankful nod to rescue crews.

Without conflict in the world, what would I have to complain about? Did you know you can put a small block chevy engine in a subaru?

What I wanna know is who is bringing the battle cage for you two at the Rope-Up?

My wife worked for seven years as the tribal librarian at the Nisqually Tribe near Olympia. They always got Columbus Day off as a holiday, with the admonition from the administration: "People, this isn't a holiday, its a day of mourning." PC or not, you know you'd be bumming Greg if someone came in with a tank and discovered and claimed your house. Invasion is the history of mankind, and part of the spoils is writing the history. Nothing new there, and I don't think anyone should feel guilty about it 500 years later. Nonetheless, Indians are still holding the shit end of the stick, and much of what people currently decry as "special rights" (fishing, hunting, some small choice real estate parcels here and there) are in fact negotiated treaty rights intended as exchange for loss of property. Me, I'm just pissed off that the banks and post offices are closed.

quote: Originally posted by chucK: I don't mind all the little pleasant reminders that I'm "missing out on a great deal" (too much). But now that is getting threatening-sounding it pisses me off . Climbing magazine SUCKS , as do as all strongarm deceptive marketers.[/QB] With any of those ad mailings that have a pre-paid business reply envelope, just take all the crap they sent you, add a little written abuse, include any other garbage you have laying around, and send it all back to them and let them pay for the postage again. According to my local postmaster, you can no longer tape those things to bricks to increase the postage due, but he gave a big thumbs up for including anything (legal materials only) you want in the envelope.

Here's a trip report for ya'll thats completely devoid of climbing content. Saturday night (Sunday morning actually) was "All Freakin' Night" at the Olympia Film Festival. They show horror movies from Midnight till whenever, which was 10:30am this time around. Some of you might appreciate the genre, so here's a trip report: First flick was The Tingler (1950?) with Vincent Price. It was a typical older funny sort, complete with admonishments to the audience by the director (in the film) to scream to release one's fear tension. A little slow but funny, it was a wise placement for the start of things because it might have been deadly round about 5am. I think the original release had some sort of seat vibrating mechanism (the tingler!). Second flick was Dog Soldiers (2002). British army patrol runs into werewolves in the remote scottish highlands, carnage ensues. This one came out this year, and I'd give it a thumbs up, classic monster flick, overtones of Aliens (but no sci-fi element) and a brit production. Third we had the unrated version of Re-Animator (1985). Young med student tries to conquer Death, which never seems to be a good idea. This one is in the funny-gross category, graphic but not as over the top as Peter Jackson's early work. I think the main thing the unrated version offers is a little sex between the girl and Dr. Hill's severed head. It was fun, a nice peppy number to have in this time slot. Fourth came Versus (2000), and I'd highly recommend this one. A modern Samurai Japanese Gangster Zombie film with an "opponents destined to re-encounter each other through the incarnations" story line. Very stylish, lots of action so sub-titles weren't much of an issue, some great (and funny) supporting cast. Style owes somewhat to The Matrix, or to some Hong Kong action flick that Matrix lifted its style from. The plot is a little week, but so what. Fifth flick was Surf 2 (1981) which was another comedy number. (there never was a Surf 1) Early 80's so-cal teen surfer flick, with a young Eric Stolz. Somebody is turning formerly wholesome surfer dudes into punk zombies who eat garbage. Definitely played tongue in cheek, probably not available on video. As a bonus, it features Ruth Buzzi (from laugh-in), gratuitous tit shots (not Ruth, thankfully), and a police chief named Chief Boyardie (yes, he does request spaghetti-o's at one point). There were the various contests (the brain toss, like an egg toss but using real cooked cow brains was my favorite) and short films. The best short was Lucas Versus the Monster Root Beer Float which looked to be a local super 8 production. Funky looking nerd punks in jumpsuits make a root beer float out of lots of Sparkle ice cream and Root Beer in a 32 gallon garbage can. They proceed to consume voluminously, until they begin to spew. Then consume more, barf more, repeat until rolling in the aisles. Definitely the best barf scenes of the night, all the better because you knew it was the real thing.

Yeah, its a common publishing schtick, and Climbing is owned by a larger corporation these days. Tell them in exchange for helping their circ stats for the all-advertisement issue you feel they owe you a year's subscription. They're just demanding payment, not sending you the goods are they?

quote: Originally posted by Dean Lowery: I've been out Aasgard probably 6 or more times and I really hate that route since the talus is always shifting underfoot. On a hot day it is a bitch (to me) and it puts real hurt on my ageing knees. I know what you mean, I've only descended Aasgard, 4 times as a Dragontail descent route, and each time its made me vow never to go up because it was so awful down. Entering my older wiser years, I've come to the conclusion that for the steep stuff, down is worse than up, for just the reasons you stated. Truth be told, I've never been closer to the enchantments than the top of Aasgard, so I think I'll have to rectify that next year. Thanks all for the great beta (even though it wasn't my question to start with).

He's not doing the chipping, he's just airing a dirty little secret. There's a similar thing in the aid world, with "enhanced" hook placements and all: just a few taps and twists of the drill make a hook feel much better. The issue is full disclosure, and I confess I haven't been aware of the extent to which routes routes have been manufactured at Smith. Thanks for the info though trollmeister.

Dreams of Darrington aside, its become apparent that other commitments will keep me in town for the weekend. Anybody in the Oly-Tacomaish area up for something local on Saturday?

Isn't that the rule here, every thread must go down the toilet? If you start with poop, the question is how can you continue down? It just seems that Greg and I are up to the challenge.

quote: Originally posted by RobBob: The worst is the Tar Baby. That's the one that requires a shower after you get home. Noooo, I don't wanna hear the story of how Brer Rabbit got both hands and both feet stuck in the Tar Baby!

Don, your post really struck me. I was tallying up my roster of lost ones earlier today, and was thinking that seven seemed like a lot. Its an odd thing, because we tell ourselves stories about how safe it is, a matter of sound judgement, that prudence and caution will insure a good outcome. Fact is I have lost far more of my peers to climbing than any of the other catastrophes that stalk the imagination: plane crash, car accident, cancer...

"Matchmaker, matchmaker, make me a match"

quote: Originally posted by Chepe: quote:Originally posted by Dr Flash Amazing: quote:Originally posted by Greg W: Go down to the fish ladders on the Columbia and cut holes in the nets of the indians camped out there. Gee, great idea! Systematically murdering them and remorselessly stealing their land and then kicking them off of it wasn't enough. Clearly instead of removing superfluous dam(n)s to save salmon, we should punish some of our nation's remaining Native Americans for trying to eat. Nice troll, by the way, and it even worked! They make enough money from casinos and other tax free shit to buy from the grocery store like anyone else. Those are just a long lost arguments that only work on the uneducated anyway. How much time have you spent on the Rez, white boy? Doesn't matter what kind of degree you have, I'll wager that when it comes to Indian Country you're pretty ignorant.