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Oops...well, go figure. thanks Bill. At the very least, the update seems to be that they are indeed here to stay. Meaning, now I can feel free to thrash on the ones I have been keeping in the oxygen chamber for the past few years, breaking out only for special occasions...

I guess this is the forum to put this in- For you aid aficionados (or even free climbers, for that matter)- rejoice: HB Offsets at the Yosemite Mtn Shop Looks like the mountain shop is manufacturing these as a proprietary item since the demise of Hugh Banner. Don't go up the Captain without them.

Some recent favorite albums: Aes Dana- Memory Shell Solar Fields- Extended Chris Coco- Heavy Mellow

One of my favorite parts of every Valley trip I've done is the last 4 hours of the 16 hour marathon- Red Bull, Coffee, Trance music, hammer to the floor at 3 AM through all the Tweakerville's in the Central Valley foothills. By the time I arrive I've spent 16 hours getting so amped to climb I can hardly stand it. It's all about being free, on the road, and going someplace. How can it get any better?

Hi Scott, Colin and I completed the r/t in about 15 hours. Two others I know did it in similar time the same summer. The key advice I can offer is to solo or simul as much of the route as possible due to it's length, and be prepared to negotiate some rather loose rock and thick vegetation. If you are going for it in a day,the North peak summit is where you should evaluate your time and decide if you think you're moving fast enough to avoid the big epic. Once you rap into the north/middle notch, the seriousness grade ratchets up handsomely and retreat becomes more than a passing matter. If I remember it right, Colin and I reached the north peak summit in about 3 1/2 to 4 hours from the car. The remaining traverse from there to the tarns on the far side of the Main summit took about 7 more hours. We then lost a solid hour trying to find the correct descent gully. We made it back to the trail at the lake just 20 minutes shy of total darkness. Colin and I did not take rock shoes, we climbed in boots. Our packs were nearly empty, just light windshirts, food and water. Colin felt that the half ounce vial of sunscreen I had brought for us to share was "too heavy", but I offered to carry it in my pocket. We took 2 liters of water each, and tanked up well at Serene Lake. We encountered no water or snow until the tarns near the top of the descent gully. We were lucky to locate the correct gully on only the second try- it is not very obvious from above, but the gully drops away from the tarns on the ridge and is the right hand one looking down. There is a fixed rope to make a short rap mid way down. The bushwhacking just above Lake Serene, on a prominent buttress crest, is quite memorable. If you go in late August as we did, fresh blueberries will take the sting out of this part. Oh, and when passing the eroded gully on the Main peak, it may be easiest to pass this ugly feature by going as high as possible before crossing it. Where we crossed, it was very loose and unpleasant. Good luck. It's delightful, and very committing. Mark

Charlie was a true gentleman and a class act. Always a positive attitude. Stronger than an ox. Friendly and generous, selfless. I'm glad I had the chance to know him. This hurts.

Northwest face of Lembert is very enjoyable. Oz with the Hobbit Book linkup---

I'm in the same boat- I actually just started trying leashless climbing at the crags this season- it's definitely the way to go on pure rock, but so far I find climbing pure ice leashless is spooky, especially after you pull off the rock onto the ice and have a solid pump going. Leashless is more pumpy for me so far but I think it might be that I haven't dialed shaking out and swapping tools enough yet. For the pump factor alone I plan to keep using leashes in the alpine and on pure ice for the time being. Even on the big Alaska routes I haven't found the mixed climbing hard enough that swapping tools would make a crucial difference, and I just deal with it. But I'm always looking for a better way to work, and as I try harder routes, it's good to have a new strategy...

Indeed it does; you're committed to a left and a right tool. Which is why I'm reading this discussion with interest...

Doug, The system I use on big alpine routes is this: I use Cobras with the lockdown leash. There is a tight sewn loop on the underside of these leashes- I tie a length of 3mm cord to each leash, and then use a utility carabiner to clip them to my backpack shoulder strap, up high. While climbing, the cords are pretty much out of the way, with the 3mm cord hanging from under your wrists- totally out of your way. The only thing that can be a pain is if you have a shoulder-gear sling for the rack (gets tangled, esp. with stoppers on the rack), hence I usually don't use a gear sling on alpine mixed climbs. When I reach the anchor, I immediately clip the biner into the anchor so the tools are secure but they are totally out of my system. The other nice thing is that by having the 3mm cord tied to my leashes instead of the bottom of the tools, when it gets to walking terrain, the cords don't have to be untied, and also, having them clipped up to your pack, the length is perfect so they don't trip you and/or get wound up in the climbing rope.

However, the following scenario has been discussed: Suppose a party goes to attempt a remote route on Denali, such as the South Buttress, East Buttress, etc, and perhaps they have no plans to carry over, hence they would never set foot on the Kahiltna/West Buttress. On such routes, these parties likely won't see a single other party, climbing as they are in totally remote areas. Is it fair to tell them they can't climb because the other side of the mountain is crowded? I am fairly sure the NPS has at least considered this issue, but not sure if it plays in here...

I climbed Whitney in mid September one time, and slept on the summit- in the morning it was probably about 0 F. Colin and I climbed the Incredible Hulk in early September a few years ago; the base of the route is at about 9000 feet, I would guess it was about 15F when we started the route. Neither of us have ever been so cold while climbing. The party below us bailed because of it. The wind was the big problem. More or less, around 9000 feet in Sept. you should expect lows in the teens to 20's. High temps are usually comfortable enough once the sun gets up a little.

If the weather is good, your above plan would be excellent. Forbidden gets climbed into October some years- expect the glacier to be bare ice and the shrunds to be tricky. The High Sierra is often excellent in September and into early October- crowds are gone, t-storms are usually done for the season, weather is usually sunny. Just be prepared for brisk days and VERY cold nights above 8000 feet! Picking east and south facing routes will keep you happy.

On that note, Wind Rivers could also be good in early September. Early September might still be good for the Bugaboos, but any weather that does come in is likely to result in snow. If it's an Indian Summer, the Canadian Rockies can be good also- meaning dry and cold, resulting in less rockfall on the faces.

Clint, Get in touch with Paul at TAT, at he has flown in there a few times and knows a little about the area. Another person who might be able to help you out even more is Tony Martin, a pilot who flies for K2 in Talkeetna. I'm not sure if Tony is around at the moment, but call K2 and ask. (oops rereading your post, I bet the book you have is the one with Tony's name on it...) "The Otter" on AMF has also been in the Tordrillos also. Good luck!

What I find most interesting here is that the climber in question- Hannah- didn't even post a trip report about this and it's generating such a conflict. It's not like she went trolling for congratulations. The avalanche of compliments that have ensued, while well-intentioned, perhaps deserved, are also being made into space, so to speak. They were not solicited. While I understand these are people who know her and are just happy for her, I can also understand how some think this appears a bit sycophantic. The further questioning of her judgment and skills is even more off track. We've all soloed on glaciers at some point, nobody ever claimed it was safe. Having climbed both Nisqually Ice Cliff and Nisqually Cleaver, I can tell you the real danger of those routes is the icefall hazard in the cirque beneath them. I was much younger when I did those routes. I can say that today I tend to avoid routes like that, and Hannah probably will someday too. While I don't know this person, I'm not going to second guess her decisions and insights. Like the younger me, she must have had some instinct that told her the ice cliff wouldn't fire off that morning and the crevasse bridges were solid. Moreover, being up on Rainier alone, on any route, winter or summer, is a serious matter for serious people. Hannah seems to be the most serious person here. She's the one not talking. For that, she gets my congratulations.

Realize that statement is from a church that was responsible for the massacre of millions in the past 1000 years. All to protect the "sentiments" of believers. So it goes. The last thing believers of all faiths want is meddlers opining the possibility that the whole structure upon which they rest their lives might be based in fantasy.

What about the banana, and the...two cookies? Don't study too hard amigo.

One more thing: bring a good quiver of wands for this route. The last 5000 vertical feet of the ridge is featureless in a storm. Pax, very cool pictures.

VW, Jedi's right. Despite most people's aversion to cornices, I have to highly recommend the south ridge for a number of reasons. Aside from unstable cornices, the objective hazards are low and the technical climbing found lower on the route is of exceptional quality on solid red granite. Although the Happy Cowboys is mentally taxing and very insecure, the position on the ridge is absolutely breathtaking and unforgettable. While the technical difficulties are generally moderate by modern standards, the route requires a full Alaskan alpine skill set, and the high commitment level more or less requires descending by another route (reversing the Cowboys would be extremely difficult and undesirable). I'm not saying I necessarily recommend it for one's first route in Alaska, but if it is inspiring to you, then Carpe Diem. It´s a good one. And I certainly echo Joe's sentiments about Mystic Jewel and Rattle and Hum. Not safe, and probably getting even moreso with these warming times of ours. The Corliss/Taylor has some objective hazards at the start from a hanging ice cliff but it is only for a short time. This route looks like a more sustained version of the south ridge, with double the amount of mixed climbing to reach the Happy Cowboys area. The south east spur is much harder due to overhanging rock followed by what is according to Benowitz a lot of cornices that are worse than the Cowboys, and on an inclined arete. VW I would also urge you to check out the southeast RIDGE (note the nomenclature). It's unrepeated (although a team came very close) last I checked, and the difficulties appear to be similar to the west or southwest ridges but the route is more remote. Joe and I attempted this years ago, although we retreated once on the ridge due to bottomless snow, we were able to find a much safer way onto the ridge than the FA party, accessing it lower down below a major summit in the ridge, via an 1800 foot snow/ice face and couloir system. Once on the ridge the difficulties are strictly snow climbing and some corniced sections- the difficulty of the latter probably varying from year to year but certainly not as bad as the south ridge. Good luck and happy hunting! Mark

Johnny Waterman climbed the south ridge in 1973 with three partners- Carman, Black and Rau (Rau did not summit). After the climb they determined that they actually did not reach the south summit but reached a small spire near it while in a whiteout. Waterman later made the first ascent, solo, of the southeast spur. Both of these routes, after considerable stretches of difficult climbing, join on the ridge crest and then share the "Happy Cowboy Pinnacles", a horror show of double corniced knife edged terrain. The south ridge was repeated in 1986 alpine style by two British climbers, then Forrest Murphy and I made the third ascent of this route in 2003. The southeast spur was repeated alpine style by Athens, Randall and Metcalf, and received its third and only other ascent in 1997 by Jeff Benowitz and Rick Studley. In 2001 a California team climbed a large, 4500 foot buttress in between the two routes and continued along the Happy Cowboys to reach the summit after 10 days. The southwest ridge mentioned above is often confused with the south ridge and southeast spur and is considerably easier than either. The southwest ridge begins from the Kahiltna whereas the latter two routes start on an arm of the Tokositna Glacier.

His partner sees it differently-

Late June. It was good then (2000), but take note that in the past several seasons it has been abnormally warm and many faces and gullies below 14,000 feet in the Alaska Range have started to show the results- lots of melt out, running water, and increased rockfall. This year the route saw many ascents from late May to mid June.

3 days from the bergschrund to the summit, approximately half of which was spent in bivouacs sleeping and eating. The weather was so good it made for a very chill, very enjoyable experience, with no sleep deprivation required. We actually started out for the route from Kahiltna basecamp, to which we had returned after acclimatizing on the w. buttress, and we left there with 3 1/2 days food and 5 fuel, and most importantly- under clear skies and a very good forecast. The 25 pounds did not include rope and rack, it was the dead weight on our backs as we began climbing the Japanese couloir. The packs felt very friendly, and also this weight did include the lightweight MSR snowshoes which we used (and appreciated having) up the NE fork the previous night. The crux as noted above was the second pitch above Cassin Ledge, in my opinion. Each of the two rock bands had a fairly definitive crux pitch but again, nothing on the route extended beyond 5.fun.

We never hauled on the route. Packs weighed about 25#/each at the start. Every pitch led easily with the packs, except maybe the one pictured in photo number 1 above- I considered leaving my pack before leading it but the terrain, as you can see, is blocky and would've been very catchy on the pack- as well, there was some loose rock here. Not much rock gear is needed- half set of stoppers and maybe 3-4 cams up to 2". No pitons. Most tech climbing takes screws, although both pitches pictured above were entirely rock pro only. again Sobo for the help